Clifford intake with Hedman headers??

[Scottcoda]

I found a great deal on Hedman headers so I bought them, ceramic coated them and this past Monday ordered a brandy new Clifford intake... but today I read on another site that Hedmans will not work with the Clifford intake on a 250ci.. Can anyone confirm this?? Any info would be a great!!

['68OrangeSunshine]

I never heard that. Sounds weird. I have Clifford headers and an Offy intake on a 292. They are the long tube headers. I've seen the Hedmans and they look like a clone of the early ''Clifford Research'' headers like mine.
I have heard some kids with lowered pickups with a 250 complain that their long tube headers scrape on the pavement, but then I can't see what they think they're doing in a truck anyway. JMHO.
They are the same headers for 250 and 292, but the heavy duty tall deck 292 is about 1 -3/4" taller than the 250. Shouldn't be any clearance problems with a stock stance truck w/250, especially not in a 3/4 ton. They do make a shorter header too, but the long tubes are great for torque.

Unless it's a fitment issue with the water-jacketed Clifford intake [which can't be notched or grindered much without getting into the water jacket] where the exhaust and the intake manifolds mate with the head. IDK.

Maybe someone else knows more about the L6 Hedmans. I have Hedman 'hedders' on a 350 V8 in my '71 GMC. I ceramic coated them. They run good on my Jimmy.

[BlacklandCamper]

I do know that some of the Clifford intakes will not work with some types of headers, although I am not sure if Heddman is one of those. Clifford should list required mods to those that have clearance issues. On the L28 engines the Clifford intakes will not fit with original NISMO headers (which I happen to have), but there is some minor clearing that can be done on the flanges to make them fit together.

['68OrangeSunshine]

I believe my '68 292 is an L25. What is NISMO? Did you really put a Chevy engine in a '93 Nissan? I heard the old Toyota FJ40s would bolt right up to a Chevy engine.
Semper Fi! VMA 513, 1st + 3rd MAW, '73-'77.

[BlacklandCamper]

Originally Posted by '68OrangeSunshine

I believe my '68 292 is an L25. What is NISMO? Did you really put a Chevy engine in a '93 Nissan? I heard the old Toyota FJ40s would bolt right up to a Chevy engine.
Semper Fi! VMA 513, 1st + 3rd MAW, '73-'77.

The L28 of which I speak is the 2.8L SOHC inline six found in the Datsun 280Z cars. The NISMO header is a long tube type that was built by Nissan Motorsports as a factory supported performance upgrade. As far as putting a Chevy engine into a Nissan.. No. As much as I like Chevy engines, I could not bring myself to put a SBC into my Nissan. Instead of dropping a Chevy engine into my Nissan like many others have done I decided to go with something different. My friend had a 280ZX that he was parting out, and I made him on offer on the engine. It didn't hurt that I helped him build the head, and taught him how to port and polish on it. It lopes like a built big block.

Here is a vid of the engine after we broke in the cam. This is what is going into my '93 Nissan truck.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiP3kcGxZzY

Good to meet another Lava Dog! I'll bet I lived in some of the same barracks as you did, and running up KT Hill (Radar Mt) still sucked, and **** Creek still stank, but Kaneohe Bay was still beautiful, and the waves at Pyramid Rock were still choice, if you could get a ride across the flight line.


Sorry for the hijack...
Carry on.

[Scottcoda]

[QUOTE='68OrangeSunshine;6585036]
Unless it's a fitment issue with the water-jacketed Clifford intake [which can't be notched or grindered much without getting into the water jacket] where the exhaust and the intake manifolds mate with the head. IDK.QUOTE]

From what I found out so far this seems to be the issue.. The intake flange on the Clifford's is 3/8" and the Hedman's Flange is 1/4" so the bolt will not sit correctly over the them.. Can anyone confirm this or have a solution if this is true?

[BlacklandCamper]

Everything I have seen on the Clifford's say to take the material out of the exhaust flange when having fitment issues.

I would mount the exhaust manifold first, then place some grease on the flange of the intake. When you go to mount the intake, the grease will show the spots on the exhaust that are in interference.

As much as it sucks to hear it, if the clearance issues are too bad to sort with a little grinding, you may need to decide which one you want more. The Clifford, or the Heddman.

['68OrangeSunshine]

I have used the stock Chevy L6 connecting tabs, [short ones only] just ground out so there is a matching notch on them and mounted headers and exhaust that way. Of course I once had a shop modify my Clifford Headers with a 3/8" mating flange [done long ago when shop time was a lot cheaper], so there's less of a drop between the header and intake.
Remember to take a vice-grips and pull out the non-threaded mounting studs on head holes # 1 and #9. They are threaded 3/8-16 UNC, you will find, and a bolt or stud and nut works a lot better for mounting headers than a stupid guide pin. On mine I have a round rocker arm half-ball, inverted, to increase pressure under the bolt heads at 1 and 9.

Hey Blackland, my recruiter promised me MCAS Kaneohe, so naturally I never got there. I was a Harrier Handler, AV8A Avionics Troubleshooter with VMA 231 and VMAT 203 at Cherry Point NC, 2nd MAW, then overseas to VMA 513 out of MCAS Iwakuni Japan [plus NAS Cubi Point Philipines, Kadena Airbase Okinawa, and Po Hang ROKMCB, Korea] with the 1st Airwing, rotating back stateside to MCAS Yuma, 3rd MAW, for the last 11 months of my tour. Nothing else to do weekends at Yuma, I hotrodded my first 292 there. It ran 25 years.
I have a rice grinder myself: my Mom left me a '92 Subaru Legacy, 2.2 L boxer. Freon 13 A/C, cassette deck and power windows all still work good and it gets 25 MPG crusing 80 MPH. It has about 117,000 total miles.
Semper Fi

[RichardJ]

There are many old threads about mounting headers. In this post I have a picture of the original hardware that you should still have.
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ds#post5714976

Including the pins 68Sunshine mentioned that should be removed, there are 8 threaded mounting holes. Two of the holes originally had threaded studs. I put threaded studs in all 8 holes. It makes assembling all that stuff to the side of the engine easier and provides more consistant clamping.

I robbed extra studs and short clamping bars from junkyard engines. The short clamping bars are easy to grind down on one side to allow for different flange thicknesses. Don't grind any material from the flanges.

ARMY Avionics here. Was stationed NAS Corpus Christi for 5 months before Nam. Got to see how you NAS guys lived. They ate on plates! Same with the guys at Clark Air Base, Philipines, but was only there a couple days.

Hedman, early Clifford without water passage built in. They're on the outside so it shouldn't matter.

['68OrangeSunshine]

Yeah, you're right -- 8 not 9 stud holes. [I posted after Beer-Thirty.]

Best chow overseas was at Kadena AFB, Okinawa. If you could hitch a ride to SAC-side, they had stolen the Colonel's secret recipe, and you could get great southern fried chicken.
Navy chow was good. Marine Corps chow wasn't bad usually, a lot of times we ate off "John Wayne Trays": stainless steel, divided portions, 11.5'' x 15.5'' -- capable of stopping small arms projectiles. Never tried the Army's.
I learned to eat Sushi, offbase in Japan, before it became a fad. In the P.I. there was "Monkey Meat on a Stick" [never sure just what it was?] but it was 3 pieces for 5 Pisos. 7 Pisos = 1 US Dollar. Also a San Miguel Beer was 7 pisos.

[RichardJ]

San Miguel bottled in the Philippines or San Miguel bottled in Manila?

[BlacklandCamper]

Originally Posted by '68OrangeSunshine

Best chow overseas was at Kadena AFB, Okinawa. If you could hitch a ride to SAC-side, they had stolen the Colonel's secret recipe, and you could get great southern fried chicken.
Navy chow was good. Marine Corps chow wasn't bad usually, a lot of times we ate off "John Wayne Trays": stainless steel, divided portions, 11.5'' x 15.5'' -- capable of stopping small arms projectiles. Never tried the Army's.
I learned to eat Sushi, offbase in Japan, before it became a fad. In the P.I. there was "Monkey Meat on a Stick" [never sure just what it was?] but it was 3 pieces for 5 Pisos. 7 Pisos = 1 US Dollar. Also a San Miguel Beer was 7 pisos.

Chow on Kadena was truly excellent. Our own chow hall at Camp Hansen was decent, not great, but it didn't try to kill us too often. I do have memories of at least two bouts of food poisoning per deployment. However, just outside Main Gate was Kinville, which had some of the best Taco-Rice&Cheese around, not to mention the Yakisoba. Not many Sushi joints outside of Oki-City, but Kinville had some real cool chicken nuggets, half a dozen per serving, all about the size of a plum, and all dark meat.......

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by BlacklandCamper

Chow on Kadena was truly excellent. Our own chow hall at Camp Hansen was decent, not great, but it didn't try to kill us too often. I do have memories of at least two bouts of food poisoning per deployment. However, just outside Main Gate was Kinville, which had some of the best Taco-Rice&Cheese around, not to mention the Yakisoba. Not many Sushi joints outside of Oki-City, but Kinville had some real cool chicken nuggets, half a dozen per serving, all about the size of a plum, and all dark meat.......

Yakisoba, So Desu, ne? I remember hanging out with my buddies from the AVI shop, out in the "Ville" getting that my first night there. If you could handle your chopsticks without spilling any pieces, you were not too drunk to stay out drinking in the ville. If you could'nt handle chopsticks, you had to RTB.
Taco- Rice & Cheese? Had not hit the WestPAC yet. Sounds like some LA food truck fusion thing, like Bulgogi Tacos with GoChuJang/Pineapple salsa.
I try to make Yakisoba on my wok at home, but it just doesn't have that official yakuza taste and consistency.
Sushi and Sashimi was a main-island Japan-thing. MCAS Iwakuni is in Yamaguchi Prefecture, 20 miles outside of Hiroshima, on southern Honshu, the "Big Island" in Japanese terms. [Not counting Hokkaido]. I got dragooned into being the Squadron Training NCO, and had to run 3 miles with the hogs and fatbodies every morning. To upgrade my protein intake, I decided to try that 'raw-fish thing'. I was pleasantly surprised with a bowl of Miso, Maguro Sashimi, a bowl of rice and endless green tea. They were surprised to see an American in their shop and really tried hard for me. Total bill was about 3,000 yen. [$10 bucks, back then]. I became that terror of the grinder, a Corporal with a Clipboard, in my 5-creased Trop shirt, glossy shoes, pisscutter cover and RayBan shades. Great times. Best shape in my life. Ooh-Rah!
[All the above has nothing to do with Clifford intakes and Hedman hedders.]

[BlacklandCamper]

Outside of some training we did every deployment near Mt. Fuji, we did not get to spend much time on Honshu. Which I truly regret. We would get a few 96 hour libbos in Tokyo, and I managed to find a few awesome Ramen shops tucked away in Shinjuku, and Shibuya. Did get some interesting looks when I walked in, not many Gaijin to be found in hole in the wall Ramen shops. Managed to earn a few approving nods when I ordered correctly, and rolled the chop sticks properly. Loved the neverending green tea, just wish it had more of a bite.

Call me a romantic, but I would have loved to watch the cherry blossoms, or relax in a real hot spring sipping sake while the watching the snow fall.

Had a great time doing training on Hokkaido, got to visit Sapporo, and even visit the brewery. Got asked politely to leave after we drank a few weeks worth of their inventory after the tour. The local GSDF troops were great guys. They were rather entertained to see us walking to the bath house carrying cases of beer. Best cure after a long field op is to take a warm shower, then soak in the big tub with a few cold beers.




Hoping we solved the original issue, as we seem to have thoroughly hijacked the thread.

['68OrangeSunshine]

Before joining the service, I fancied myself a climber. When I found a mountaineering store in Hiroshima, I bought some goodies: carabiners, Swiss volcano stove, crampons. I was told verbally by my OIC, the Training Officer, [a Harrier pilot] that I was good to go for a 96 to climb Fuji-san. It was my 26th birthday. I took the Shinkansen up to Shizuoka-ken and made my way to the hill. It was a nice day when I started out, but as I got further up the slope, a cloud cover swiftly rolled in from the Pacific to the East. In no time the weather got real snotty and one of my crampons broke. I started skidding downhill fast. I pulled an ice-ax arrest and stopped after a long-enough scrape, but had sustained damage to my jerry-rigged rucksac and lost some gear. When a sheared-off half of my lost snack orange came down at great speed after me - after about a 3 minute delay - just missing my head, I decided I wasn't gonna make the peak. I glissaded down as far as I could on one crampon until I could see brown gravel, and then found shelter overnight in a mountain hut. The next morning I made it out. When I got back to Iwakuni, while in sickbay getting my frostbitten fingers treated, I found out 513 had gone on deployment TAD to Kadena, and that I was UA, AWOL and had Missed a Movement. Capt W_______ had flown to Okinawa and forgotten to process my 96 hour pass.
I found the Sgt Maj and a skeleton crew on Embark duty, and since I was a new S3/TRNG guy, I too was to be on the Embark detail. Sgt Maj said he'd check with my Capt, and to meantime ''turn to'' on Embark. For the next 36 to 48 hours, we'd load up C-130s with crates of gear, and stuff as they each would come in thru breaks in the taifun, catching what ever sleep we could on empty pallets in the hangar. At the last bird out the S4 officer got us a case of PBR beer, and we scarfed it down fast. Of course the Sgt Maj discovers us at our 'prop-blast', threatening to bust us until I told him a Marine Officer had ordered us to kill that case. We got on the last Hercules out of Dodge, and I pulled the tarp off a GSE generator, rolled up in the nylon and slipped under the genny and slept one of the deepest sleeps of my life. An Air Force crew chief gently kicked me awake as the 130 was in the pattern and I got up and restored the tarp on the genny. After that I considered myself a true Yankee Air Pirate.

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by RichardJ

San Miguel bottled in the Philippines or San Miguel bottled in Manila?

Since we were in Olongapo City, close to Subic Bay/ NAS Cubi Point, which is not far from Manila, I'm going to guess there. I don't remember. Can't read Togalog. I liked it better than Kirin or Sopporo. There was a [Piso] coin-operated beer machine in our barracks.

[Scottcoda]

well if you can't beat them join them!!! so i hope the headers and intake dont work so I can sell them, use the money to buy a plane ticket, go to japan, get **** faced and then eat a big plate of omurice!!!

['68OrangeSunshine]

Scott-san: You Numbah One Gaijin and all-around good sport.
Kampai!

[Scottcoda]

Originally Posted by '68OrangeSunshine

Scott-san: You Numbah One Gaijin and all-around good sport.
Kampai!

Hey Thanks!! Gotta have fun!!
I do have a question.. On replacing the number 1 and number 9 dowel, Guide pin or what ever we call them.. What length 3/6-16 bolt should I look for?? The exhaust flange is 1/4" so I was thinking 3/4 or 1 inch..

['68OrangeSunshine]

Originally Posted by Scottcoda

Hey Thanks!! Gotta have fun!!
I do have a question.. On replacing the number 1 and number 9 dowel, Guide pin or what ever we call them.. What length 3/6-16 bolt should I look for?? The exhaust flange is 1/4" so I was thinking 3/4 or 1 inch..

Actually Richard was right. It's 8 not nine mounting holes on the drivers' side of the L6 head.
The holes are bored at 3/8'' -16 UNC. I use a stud overall about 2" long, threaded 3/8-16 UNC on the head side [about one- to 3/4'' deep] and finer threaded on the manifold end: 3/8-24. The fine threads don't come off as easily and give better adjustment fitting up. I don't remember where I got the studs-- my machinist may have come up with them. They are very similar [if not identical] to some Carb studs.
I have a mixed bag of some bolts and some studs, but if I were starting over. I'd go all studs. Much easier to hang the headers and intake when setting up.
Good Luck.

[RichardJ]

As '68Sunshine has just told you, I can not stress enough, how much easier you will make assembling the gasket and the three manifold pieces to the head after you have installed the threaded studs. It is very easy to have exhaust leaks if you over tighten any of an assortment of bolts and stud nuts. With eight studs and nuts, you can get more even tightening.

In the picture below there are eight studs, but not one bolt holding anything on the head. To duplicate that alignment with only the two original studs so that you can push a bolt through the manifold, through the gasket and into the head without cross threading anything, will leave you wishing you had two men and a boy helping you to hold everything up in place.

The studs are maybe a buck and a half at NAPA. A 2" stud may be too long in that first hole, but you may need it for a PS bracket or just put a couple extra washers on it. "68Sunshine mentioned using an old rocker arm half-ball so he could spread out the pressure under the nut. Good idea on thin flanges.