Power break to Manual conversion

[R.L.]

What is involved in converting from my power break setup to manual? Is it as simple as just removing my break booster?

[SS Tim]

Why would you want to and what do you have now?
Manual drum brakes are very functional, but not great, due to the self-energizing geometry. Manual disc brakes were offered only on the lightest of factory C10s for good reason.

[R.L.]

I have power breaks now I want manual how is this done? I know exactly what the end result will be but that is what I want.

[Vintage Windmills]

I don't think you could generate enough pressure in a disc brake without the booster to stop within anything close to a safe distance. Drum yes, since as Tim pointed out they are self energizing. Looks like the truck in your avatar is a 71 or 72 so I'm assuming it has discs. Convert to drum if you must have a manual setup

[R.L.]

Thanks fellas I didn't know that, had several drum break setups no disc, did not understand what SS tim was trying to tell me.
Oh well I'll leave it the way it is then.

[SoCoC10]

I have always liked the pedal feel from manual brakes. If you are running a large camshaft that doesn't allow the engine to generate enough vacuum you could use a hydro boost unit. Strange how most muscle cars, trucks come with manual brakes then we are told power brakes are an upgrade. Then when you get really serious about braking(racing, auto cross etc) most go back to manual brakes.

[RManson]

Originally Posted by Vintage Windmills

I don't think you could generate enough pressure in a disc brake without the booster to stop within anything close to a safe distance. Drum yes, since as Tim pointed out they are self energizing. Looks like the truck in your avatar is a 71 or 72 so I'm assuming it has discs. Convert to drum if you must have a manual setup

That's not true actually. A properly sized manual master cylinder is usually where people fail in regards to this. I just swapped out my power setup to a Wilwood manual master and I love it. This is with a 4-wheel disc setup from CPP. A little more pedal pressure is necessary but the result is way more modulation and pedal feel.

[71 super]

I agree with r Manson , I too have a cpp master cylinder and four wheel disc on the 67 driver I have and it stops great, I was told that without a booster this would not happen and that is very far from the truth, the system will put you through the front windshield as it is .

[70blackfish]

you can run Manual disc no problem.

[chiefcfd]

My 72 has front disc and rear drum setup. It is and has always been manual brakes. That is the setup Chevrolet put on it.

[Vintage Windmills]

I was speaking in terms of stock components.

Originally Posted by RManson

That's not true actually. A properly sized manual master cylinder is usually where people fail in regards to this. I just swapped out my power setup to a Wilwood manual master and I love it. This is with a 4-wheel disc setup from CPP. A little more pedal pressure is necessary but the result is way more modulation and pedal feel.

Originally Posted by 71 super

I agree with r Manson , I too have a cpp master cylinder and four wheel disc on the 67 driver I have and it stops great, I was told that without a booster this would not happen and that is very far from the truth, the system will put you through the front windshield as it is .

Originally Posted by 70blackfish

you can run Manual disc no problem.

Curious what calipers you guys are running. Have you towed anything heavy or hauled heavy yet?

[bodydropped68]

Originally Posted by R.L.

What is involved in converting from my power break setup to manual? Is it as simple as just removing my break booster?

you will need to get the correct push rod pedal to master cyl and bolt the master cyl to the firewall

[Elliot949]

Originally Posted by R.L.

I have power breaks now I want manual how is this done? I know exactly what the end result will be but that is what I want.

The question I have is why would you want to...

[R.L.]

Originally Posted by RManson

That's not true actually. A properly sized manual master cylinder is usually where people fail in regards to this. I just swapped out my power setup to a Wilwood manual master and I love it. This is with a 4-wheel disc setup from CPP. A little more pedal pressure is necessary but the result is way more modulation and pedal feel.

I have a 63 Nova with this same setup, that car has plenty of break but its not stock breaks designed for power assist so I'll leave the truck alone.

[R.L.]

Originally Posted by Elliot949

The question I have is why would you want to...

It's the same setup on my dad's truck, brothers old setup and that was a mid 70s model. I'm running a L6 w 3 speed trans, it's a shop truck work truck setup. I like the no frills basic unit just like the ones I remember from back in the day, not everybody wants the same thing.

[BigCountryx]

My 70 C10 has manual disc/drum setup (Stock 72 components up front) I used a 7/8" bore Wilwood manual master cyl and the feel is much better than my 72 Blazer with Power brakes and same disc/drum. If I keep the blazer it will be converted to manual, guaranteed. Keith runns this setup on all his trucks, I think he uses a 1" bore..... Trust me, it works, doubt he would build $50k trucks (Hazel, Tiffany) that couldn't stop.

[R.L.]

Originally Posted by bodydropped68

you will need to get the correct push rod pedal to master cyl and bolt the master cyl to the firewall

Thanks for the reply, I could tell something needed changed but wasn't sure what all was involved.

[HEADTURNINGC10]

If going to a manual setup I would use what the others have talked about (wilwoods). You will need to add a proportioning valve due to the fact that disc brakes require more hyrdualic force than drums.

[SS Tim]

To expand on my earlier questions and comments.
Based on a FACTORY 71-72 truck configuration....

The factory required power assist with many options and made it standard on C20-30 and K10-20 series trucks.

With that in mind here is a selection of those options on a C10.
power steering
air conditioning on V8
400 big block
tool box
4 speed
and ...
step bumper

Just to put that last item in perspective. How many of those trucks delivered with manual disc brakes also had a dealer sourced and installed step bumper? It would imply many new vehicles were delivered outside guidelines new!

Now they didn't recommend the power brakes just sell an option but to make a safe, certified vehicle within the factory/Federal guidelines of the times.

Understandably a truck being used today as a second car hauling air most of the time isn't going to stress the vehicle in a way a new truck owner hauling dry goods day to day as it was intended.

Another factor is the C10's rated gross weight and combined gross weight.
So while most owners didn't have a need the truck was designed to be used, at least occasionally, at up to 10,000lb combined weight. This is a number I no longer would advised using on an old truck in today's traffic by most users.

As far as using aftermarket brakes and getting good performance, you probably are. But I must point out the OP wants to REMOVE a booster.
This implies it was probably factory for one the above reasons. Trying to compare the performance of a downgraded stock system to a modern aftermarket system is very apples to oranges if not onions.

Finally the OP never answered the question as to series. If it was a C20-30 in no way would I recommend a downgrade. Even a K10, as they often have larger than stock tires, would be an inadvisable downgrade to unboosted stock brakes.

When you think about the number of trucks out there with much heavier than stock wheel/tire mass, uprated engines and "Lifetime' pads in today's traffic I would advise everyone to at least think about a booster if they don't have one.

[R.L.]

Originally Posted by SS Tim

To expand on my earlier questions and comments.
Based on a FACTORY 71-72 truck configuration....

The factory required power assist with many options and made it standard on C20-30 and K10-20 series trucks.

With that in mind here is a selection of those options on a C10.
power steering
air conditioning on V8
400 big block
tool box
4 speed
and ...
step bumper

Just to put that last item in perspective. How many of those trucks delivered with manual disc brakes also had a dealer sourced and installed step bumper? It would imply many new vehicles were delivered outside guidelines new!

Now they didn't recommend the power brakes just sell an option but to make a safe, certified vehicle within the factory/Federal guidelines of the times.

Understandably a truck being used today as a second car hauling air most of the time isn't going to stress the vehicle in a way a new truck owner hauling dry goods day to day as it was intended.

Another factor is the C10's rated gross weight and combined gross weight.
So while most owners didn't have a need the truck was designed to be used, at least occasionally, at up to 10,000lb combined weight. This is a number I no longer would advised using on an old truck in today's traffic by most users.

As far as using aftermarket brakes and getting good performance, you probably are. But I must point out the OP wants to REMOVE a booster.
This implies it was probably factory for one the above reasons. Trying to compare the performance of a downgraded stock system to a modern aftermarket system is very apples to oranges if not onions.

Finally the OP never answered the question as to series. If it was a C20-30 in no way would I recommend a downgrade. Even a K10, as they often have larger than stock tires, would be an inadvisable downgrade to unboosted stock brakes.

When you think about the number of trucks out there with much heavier than stock wheel/tire mass, uprated engines and "Lifetime' pads in today's traffic I would advise everyone to at least think about a booster if they don't have one.

Thanks for posting.

[Elliot949]

Originally Posted by R.L.

It's the same setup on my dad's truck, brothers old setup and that was a mid 70s model. I'm running a L6 w 3 speed trans, it's a shop truck work truck setup. I like the no frills basic unit just like the ones I remember from back in the day, not everybody wants the same thing.

COOL... I was just curious... I am ALL about old school but I am also about making my truck as safe as possible while staying true to the old truck...

[R.L.]

Me too Elliot, I'm not going to drums so the power setup will stay. I'm just exploring options. Thanks for taking the time to help me out with this.

[elimontfort]

I am running a Performance online disc brake kit with a manual res. I have no problems stopping. I drive 120 mile round trip to work on back roads and interstate. The truck stops fine. Now saying that I wont be towing anything and carrying any load in the truck. But its also lowered with a 5/6 drop. In the end its your truck do what ever you want.

[R.L.]

Your right and in the end I will do exactly what I want but, I can't say at some point I wont pull a boat or perhaps a small camper trailer. I'm not going to change out the whole break system and not do a major upgrade to the steering, which is fine with me as is. I will leave the breaks as is but thanks to everyone who posted now I know what is and isn't doable.

[71 super]

Vintage I am running a cpp master w built in prop valve, stock calipers in front and 96 Camaro calipers in rear. The bore on m/c is 1 inch and I ran 3/16 lines front and rear. I have power brakes on the rest of my trucks and aside from the assist being easier to push this 67 stop very well. With a true load I have no idea, but it will haul my car trailer unloaded to a stop very quickly.