Can my truck pull this?

[Chevy_mud_truck]

Little more info on your truck might help to do yo know what gears is in the rear axle I have a buddy with a tundra and it will tow circles around my 04 1500 silverado my old 78 would tow what both of them put together could hall but it also has a 5:13 gears in it

[tucsonjwt]

The idea of a weight distributing hitch is to equalize the weight between the towing vehicle and the trailer. If you review the film, you see that explained. Just adding helper springs will reduce rear end sag, but won't help with equalizing weight. You want the weight distributed through the whole frame of the towing vehicle, not just the hitch.

For the few hundred dollars spent on a good towing set up I think it is worth it. CL will have the same set up for less than $100. Once you understand how it works you can set up an equalizer hitch in about 5 minutes or less.

Here is an advertising pic for a weight distribution hitch showing an Olds Toronado (front wheel drive) with no rear wheels on the ground.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/atta...0&d=1046733152

And a Chevy Citation pic.

[mongocanfly]

Ha ha..what some pics...

[Skunksmash]

Originally Posted by Chevy_mud_truck

Little more info on your truck might help to do yo know what gears is in the rear axle I have a buddy with a tundra and it will tow circles around my 04 1500 silverado my old 78 would tow what both of them put together could hall but it also has a 5:13 gears in it

2.73's in the rear lol. But at least I can do 85 at 1800 rpm. Or something like that.

Originally Posted by tucsonjwt

The idea of a weight distributing hitch is to equalize the weight between the towing vehicle and the trailer. If you review the film, you see that explained. Just adding helper springs will reduce rear end sag, but won't help with equalizing weight. You want the weight distributed through the whole frame of the towing vehicle, not just the hitch.

For the few hundred dollars spent on a good towing set up I think it is worth it. CL will have the same set up for less than $100. Once you understand how it works you can set up an equalizer hitch in about 5 minutes or less.

Here is an advertising pic for a weight distribution hitch showing an Olds Toronado (front wheel drive) with no rear wheels on the ground.



And a Chevy Citation pic.

Who the hell would wanna buy a car called "citation" lol

Anyway that's a pretty cool pic. Yeah it seems craigslist has them pretty cheap, I'll pick one up.

What about trailer surge? Where you feel like its pushing the truck, and other times its pulling it back. I don't have that weird braking thing on the tongue of my trailer, and it doesn't appear that the trailer even has brakes. But what about the two shock absorbers somewhere in the hitch, that face opposite directions of each other? Set up so that the trailer can't really surge anymore. Is that idea good, bad, or ugly? And has anyone ever sold or put together anything like that?

[tucsonjwt]

Lag and surge is less of an issue with an equalizer hitch, since the trailer and towed vehicle are more closely connected as one unit. I have never used the shock absorber set up for this purpose, but I suspect that it won't help much with an equalizer hitch. Trailer sway is much more of a concern, so that is why the sway control is a better idea, and it seems like it will also provide a more rigid connection and help reduce lag and surge.

You should install an equalizer hitch and tow your trailer. You should not have very much lag and surge with an equalizer, but you can decide for yourself if you need another piece of equipment after that.

If you mean the brake safety control on the front of your trailer, you are required to have one if you have trailer brakes. If the trailer becomes decoupled from the towing vehicle, then the safety control applies the trailer brakes to keep it from rolling wild and causing an accident elsewhere.

If you have a wire running to the wheels on the trailer then you should have trailer brakes. Without trailer brakes the trailer will push your truck when you come to a stop, caused by the momentum of the trailer. Your trailer may fishtail your truck if you stop quickly. Trailer brakes are necessary on a large trailer, but some don't use them. Traveling at highway speeds without trailer brakes is taking a big risk. I would think that DOT would have regulations on when trailer brakes are required, but I don't know what those regulations might be.

[Skunksmash]

Ok thanks for the help. What weight rating should I get for the weight distribution hitch? I found one on craigslist with a 1000lb tongue limit, 10,000 lb trailer limit. Is that one too heavy duty for what I'm doing?

[tucsonjwt]

I would check out any of the many trailer hitch sites on the internet. There are tables for the weight of your truck and trailer which match up to specific weight rated hitches. I don't think you can get a hitch that is too heavy for your truck. However, you need to pay attention to the trailer ball size and coupler size you are using. You might have to get a new trailer ball to match the coupler on your trailer. I think most are 2 5/16" now.

[Skunksmash]

Well yall were right. My truck can pull this. And quite well, I might add. I feel like it puts my friend's 2014 toyota tundra to shame. The toyota sucked when it comes to pulling this boat. The chevy barely seems to notice its there. The surge and lag on the toyota was horrendous, on the chevy you can barely feel it at all.

I really can't explain it. The chevy is 2000 lbs lighter than the toyota, but that should make it even easier to push around. And the chevy doesn't act like its the hardest thing its ever had to do, when you're going up a hill. The toyota hated it. I had the pedal to the floor, it was turning about 4k rpm, and I was still losing speed going up the hill in the toyota.

Can anyone explain these differences? The toyota may be heavier, but its also got 165 more hp and 150 more ft lbs of torque. It also squatted down more in the rear. Not a whole lot more, but you could notice the difference. I doubt I ever would have bought a toyota truck anyway, but now I never will. Also don't judge! The truck is dirty and I still need to have the wheels redpainted at the body shop, and get the beauty rings and center caps on. Wheels are a mess right now.

[TwoFiftyShifter]

Cam profiles are partly to blame. The new engines are showing great on the spec sheets, but they need to be revved to pull anything. I love the 5.3 Chevy, but my father's 07 Z71 and my 96 Z71 with the Vortec 350 towed a car and trailer on back to back weekends. (5000lbs). They had the same axle ratio but the 5.3 was hunting between 2nd and 3rd all day. The old 5.7 just chugged it and rarely had to shift.

[Skunksmash]

I'm going to put a 5.3L in this truck lol. Maybe I can change it so it still pulls as well as the 350

[mongocanfly]

That stock 5.3 swap will add about 100 hp over what your stock 5.7 has,,, and you will love the extra mpg....

[Skunksmash]

Yeah I've decided I'm going to do it one of these days.

Also, 2 more questions.

1. You can see in the first pic that the trailer tongue is slightly tilting down some. All I could find at walmart was a 2" drop hitch. Couldn't find any that were just flat, or were only 1" drop. Does it look to you guys like that's too low?

2. Also in the first pic, you can see the wire loom for the trailer lights hanging down. That seems kind of like a bad idea to me. Its hanging kind of low, and something might come along and get caught up in there. Should I try to affix it to the top of the tongue? Or does it have to have some room for when you turn?

[wilkin250r]

Those were my first thoughts when I saw the pictures, I would change the drop on the hitch, and an actual auto parts store (Napa, O'Reilly, Autozone) would probably have a much better selection of hitches and drops than your local Wal-Mart.

Just keep in mind that with any trailer, higher on the front hitch equals lower on the tail end of the trailer, and the longer the trailer the more problems you get. You might run into a problem scraping the tail end of the trailer on dips and curbs. It would be unfortunate to break tail lights, licence plate frames, and scrape the trailer. It would be downright TRAGIC if there is an outboard motor hanging too low off the back of that boat and you break the fin or lower unit.

[1976gmc20]

Can anyone explain these differences? The toyota may be heavier, but its also got 165 more hp and 150 more ft lbs of torque.

Honestly I am somewhat suspect of some of the specs these days. They may have gotten those readings on a test stand at some ridiculous high rpm, but an old 350 will chug along pretty good.

I've pulled some godawful loads with my pickups - some stuff I would never do again and never advise anyone else to even think about. I may not have always been able to hold 70mph on a long straight hill, but I always got up there and anyway most hills have curves that you have to slow down for anyway.

These old Chevys have a lot of reserve built into them. The only problem you might have is pulling your boat up a wet ramp with 2wd and not much weight in the back.

[tucsonjwt]

If you get an equalizer hitch you can adjust the rear of the truck and tongue of the trailer to make it level at all times. If you just address the ball mount, then the level of the trailer ball will vary when you load up the truck and/or trailer with items (such as camping gear,etc.)

You will be surprised on how much better your truck tows with an equalizer hitch. A new ball mount won't give you this benefit.

The trailer wiring harness will hang down somewhat to accommodate turns and dips in the road. I have seen a lightweight bungee attached to the wiring with a short loop hanging down. The idea was that the bungee will give up slack when there is stress on the harness. I don't know if this is legal. 18 wheelers have flexible cables.

http://www.easternmarine.com/15-abs-...sembly-30-9621

Also, check to see if you have trailer brakes if you have not done so yet.

Just my $.02.

[mongocanfly]

Yep the bungee idea would work and give you some slack on wires when you turn..just make sure the wires wont pinch when you turn..on the tounge/hitch weight issue from the looks of it the boat is way forward on the trailer..next time you put it in the water don't winch it all the way to the front..leave the boat about 6" back from the winch..won't hurt a thing to pull it out on level ground and see what it looks like..if you like it just move the winch stand back to the boat..most trailers are a one size fits all design and you have some wiggle room as far as boat location on the trailer front to back..by no means get it to far back as to get to much weight off hitch..if you do you are asking for trouble..mine was all the way forward to and had about 350 lbs on the hitch so i kept moving it back until I got it where I wanted it..i moved mine about 10 1/2" and still have 200 lbs tounge weight

[Skunksmash]

Originally Posted by tucsonjwt

The idea was that the bungee will give up slack when there is stress on the harness. I don't know if this is legal. 18 wheelers have flexible cables.

http://www.easternmarine.com/15-abs-...sembly-30-9621

Also, check to see if you have trailer brakes if you have not done so yet.

It seems I do not have trailer brakes. But, the chevy doesn't seem to need em. The stopping isn't all that much different from without the trailer lol. Its definitely better than the Tundra. The tundra was getting pushed around. The tundra does have a 4" lift on it though, and taller tires than stock. I probably should have mentioned that before, but I just found out today that raised trucks have more problems towing than stock height ones.

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

Yep the bungee idea would work and give you some slack on wires when you turn..just make sure the wires wont pinch when you turn..on the tounge/hitch weight issue from the looks of it the boat is way forward on the trailer..next time you put it in the water don't winch it all the way to the front..leave the boat about 6" back from the winch..won't hurt a thing to pull it out on level ground and see what it looks like..if you like it just move the winch stand back to the boat..most trailers are a one size fits all design and you have some wiggle room as far as boat location on the trailer front to back..by no means get it to far back as to get to much weight off hitch..if you do you are asking for trouble..mine was all the way forward to and had about 350 lbs on the hitch so i kept moving it back until I got it where I wanted it..i moved mine about 10 1/2" and still have 200 lbs tounge weight

Its interesting you brought that up. I was just about to ask, what happens if the boat is not touching the "carpets" at the front of the trailer? Those two posts that stick up, that have colored carpet (mine's black) or turf sticking to them, that you pull the boat all the way up to. The boat is supposed to touch the carpet.

Mine is about 8 inches back right now, not touching the carpet. I let the wife put the boat on the trailer lol. She's a big DIY'er and wants to do everything herself, at least once just to see if she can. So she wanted to put the boat in, and put it on the trailer and pull it out of the water when it was time to leave. She brought it up there to me with it like that. I went ahead and towed it home, but it definitely seems off balance. Trailer seems to rock up and down a lot more.

The pontoons aren't hanging off the back, but they're right up to the edge of their resting place on the trailer. I was thinking of going to walmart or oriellys and getting some straps to strap the front of each pontoon to somewhere on the tongue of the trailer. Would this help? The fronts of the pontoons have tow hooks on them, so that wouldn't be an issue. I could just loop it around the trailer tongue. Whole thing kinda makes me nervous.

[71swb4x4]

That's a great looking truck, and rig when the boat is behind it.
I would urge you to look at trailer brakes. There is no way it stops as good with the trailer as without. You may not need them for regular traffic, but you may need them when a little kid isn't paying attention and walks into the street, or someone runs a stop sign going across the highway.
If you are saying the trailer doesn't have brakes either, then you are likely stuck. Just make dang sure you drive extra defensively when pulling the boat.

[mongocanfly]

Sounds like your boat may already be properly balanced on the trailer when you have it all the way forward,, especially if the trailer seems to bounce more,, you could tie down the front if you are concerned,, better safe than sorry,, but as long as the boat is fully supported on the bunks its not going to fall off.if your concerned about your truck squatting down it may be time for helper spring, load leveler, or airbag assist..the thing is the more you mash down on the back of the truck you are somewhat unloading the front tires making the front brakes less effective,,, but looking at the pics of your truck it doesn't look to bad,, I would just roll with it

[Skunksmash]

Originally Posted by 71swb4x4

That's a great looking truck, and rig when the boat is behind it.
I would urge you to look at trailer brakes. There is no way it stops as good with the trailer as without. You may not need them for regular traffic, but you may need them when a little kid isn't paying attention and walks into the street, or someone runs a stop sign going across the highway.
If you are saying the trailer doesn't have brakes either, then you are likely stuck. Just make dang sure you drive extra defensively when pulling the boat.

I looked for trailer brakes, there doesn't appear to be any. But honestly, there is not a whole lot of difference between the way the truck stops with the boat, and the way it stops without the boat. The boat doesn't really do that lag and surge thing, and it doesn't really shove the truck around. I mean you can tell a difference, but it ain't much. This might be because the trailer isn't steel, its aluminum. I don't know. The boat itself is also completely aluminum. I think the whole thing looks heavier than it is.

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

Sounds like your boat may already be properly balanced on the trailer when you have it all the way forward,, especially if the trailer seems to bounce more,, you could tie down the front if you are concerned,, better safe than sorry,, but as long as the boat is fully supported on the bunks its not going to fall off.if your concerned about your truck squatting down it may be time for helper spring, load leveler, or airbag assist..the thing is the more you mash down on the back of the truck you are somewhat unloading the front tires making the front brakes less effective,,, but looking at the pics of your truck it doesn't look to bad,, I would just roll with it

Ok cool I went to walmart and got some 500lb (1500 lb break rating) ratchet straps and put those on the front. They look a little small, but I don't see that boat being able to come up with 1500 lbs of upward force. Not just in normal driving down the road lol

And thanks again for all the replies everyone, I can't thank you all enough for all the help.

[1976gmc20]

I don't think your pickup looks overloaded in the pictures (the boat is all the way forward there, right?). It looks to me like it is just settled down to the "loaded" level, like if you had some lumber or a camper on the back.

Generally, the more hitch weight the better, up until you unbalance the tow vehicle (back down, front up). I would invest in a weigh distributing hitch before I started moving the boat back on the trailer. They are not that expensive if you already have the receiver on your pickup, but it does take a little more time to hitch and un-hitch.

I am surprised if that trailer does not have brakes on at least the front axle, as most manufacturers assume you are going to be pulling it with an inadequate vehicle. Some states require brakes if the loaded trailer is over 1500 or 2000 pounds so they have to be 50 state legal.

Look underneath again, if there are no backing plates/drums on either axle then no, you don't have brakes. But I'm guessing the wires got chopped off, and you might have to take the drums off to connect them again.

I've towed quite heavy trailers without brakes with a 3/4 ton, but they are designed to stop a lot more weight to begin with. I've also done it with a half ton without any big problems but it gets a bit more interesting. Also, a half ton with a four speed manual is quite a bit more capable holding things back on a long hill.

Best thing would be to get your boat/trailer on a scale and know exactly what it weighs, and then make a rational decision from there. You might want to consider having brakes added to your trailer, or doing that work yourself. It shouldn't really be that expensive or hard to do.

[tucsonjwt]

Braking at highway speeds or downhill is where trailer brakes are most beneficial, in my opinion. I would agree with taking a closer look at the trailer for brakes - it would be unusual to not have brakes on at least one axle. It could be that they were just never wired up in the first place.

You can google trailer brakes to get an idea of what to look for.

[RIDE-RED 350r]

I know that in NY, they go by unladen trailer weight as the line between a trailer that must have brakes and those that do not. When a trailer has an unladen weight of 1,000 lbs or more, it must have brakes in NY. Under 1,000 lbs, brakes are not required.

My Four Winns I mentioned before does not have brakes on the trailer, and it is the Four Winns trailer that came with the boat from the dealer. I just got home from a 10 day camping trip in the Adirondacks. With my '78, I towed my boat loaded with some gear, and also had the bed of the truck loaded with firewood, full coolers, and the heaviest Rubbermaid totes we take with us for the trip. My truck has the type of helper springs that come up against rubber stops when the truck is loaded down. It was on the helpers, but she did just fine.. No ill handling from too light of a front end and stopping power was quite fair albeit more distance and defensive driving is required. I probably had 600-800 lbs in the bed, and 3500lbs gross trailer weight.

I have to wholeheartedly agree with Tuscon about weight distributing hitches. I have a 27' camper and use them all the time when we haul the camper with the '06 Z-71 ext cab. And he is right, they do not simply and plainly raise the rear of the towing vehicle back up... they distribute tongue weight forward to the rest of the truck chassis, and back to the trailer axles. End result being a much more stable rig in every way to run down the highway when properly adjusted/set up.

I hauled the camper a short distance (about 5 miles) recently with my K-10 (SWB). I hooked up, and was about to mount the torsion bars when I noticed the camper was slightly nose-up. I checked the rear springs and found that the helper were engaged and the truck didn't sit terribly low in the rear. I decided to go without the bars for the quick trip. It carried the weight just fine, and had adequate power to get it all moving. BUT, the problem I had and the reason I would not haul the camper long distance with the '78 was that camper being somewhat long and about 4500 lbs empty, in curves I could feel it wanting to sway and yank the rear of the truck around more than I was comfortable with. Granted, my truck is a short bed, reg cab, lifted 4" and has 35" tires..so not the best setup to tow heavier/longer trailers. Beside that, the old truck exceeded my expectations for toughness once again.

I cannot even come close to hauling the camper without the torsion bars with the '06... She flattens right out, and bad.

Looking at your pontoon trailer and going by the pics, I am not sure that you would be able to use torsion bars due to the design of the trailer tongue. You need an A-frame type tongue, like campers have. And on that A-frame, there needs to be open space to mount the torsion bar keepers, and clear space for the bars themselves along side the A-frame.

But again, I do not see that rig being heavy enough to need torsion bars.. And it is very possible that it (the trailer) is light enough empty that brakes are not required (at least in NY)

Couple of pics of my helper springs. Not sure what brand or if still available. They came on the truck when I bought it.