Saginaw Pump to T-bird Rack Hoses

[Hampshire]

Have a Saginaw pump set up by Borgerson for a Ford rack (mine is an 88 -on T bird rack. These are the people who make the popular pressure reduction kit for the Saginaw pump.

http://www.borgeson.com/xcart/produc...&cat=83&page=1

I also bought my hoses from them which use an adapter to use 6AN fittings at the rack. This adapter is a hex head in brass with a male connector at both ends. One end goes into the rack on top of a washer. The 6AN fitting the attaches to the pump via the other end of the adapter.

...Well, of course, one is leaking. It appears the washer got slightly offset. I didn't know this and when I pointed the leak out to the guy who installed it, he just reefed down on it with a wrench - this apparently makes it worse.

Asking around a bit, I'm hearing this adapter can be a weak spot - that it can be a crap shoot whether it works or not. Before I call Borgeson on Monday - is there anyone selling/making hoses that go from a GM/Saginaw pump to an 88 or so T-bird rack?? ...or should I just reinstall the leaking hose with a new washer adapter??

[mr48chev]

It would be a long way from perfect but some of the parts houses used to stock hose setups that you assembled about three pieces to make up your pressure hose. I don't know if they even exist anymore though.

The T bird hoses appear to have a 5/16 ring fitting on the bottom end and a 3/8 on top while the GM pumps usually have an inverted flare or a metric O ring fitting on top.

If your pump uses an inverted flare the simple solution might be to use a T bird hose and cut the pump end off and put the correct inverted flare fitting on and flare the tube and then bend the tube to fit. Not the easiest process but it could be done.

[dwcsr]

Originally Posted by Hampshire

Have a Saginaw pump set up by Borgerson for a Ford rack (mine is an 88 -on T bird rack. These are the people who make the popular pressure reduction kit for the Saginaw pump.

http://www.borgeson.com/xcart/produc...&cat=83&page=1

I also bought my hoses from them which use an adapter to use 6AN fittings at the rack. This adapter is a hex head in brass with a male connector at both ends. One end goes into the rack on top of a washer. The 6AN fitting the attaches to the pump via the other end of the adapter.

...Well, of course, one is leaking. It appears the washer got slightly offset. I didn't know this and when I pointed the leak out to the guy who installed it, he just reefed down on it with a wrench - this apparently makes it worse.

Asking around a bit, I'm hearing this adapter can be a weak spot - that it can be a crap shoot whether it works or not. Before I call Borgeson on Monday - is there anyone selling/making hoses that go from a GM/Saginaw pump to an 88 or so T-bird rack?? ...or should I just reinstall the leaking hose with a new washer adapter??

The crap shoot as they call it is that some years Tbird racks have 5/8-18 thread and some later years is 16mm, both look identical and one will thread into the other, if you get the wrong one in the right hole it will never seal and you damage the washer and possibly pull out the threads.

Pull out the fitting and measure the threads, if its wrong it will also feel loose in the bore and rock a bit even when all the way in. We ran into this when we changed from an 86 Tbird rack to a 98 M8 rack, once the correct fitting was in there it sealed with normal hand wrench torque.

I think it was this fitting kit we used to fix the leak
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/-6-AN-...nion,7489.html which has the 16mm

This is most likely what you have

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/T-Bird...AN,104737.html and its wrong for your rack

Measure to make sure and order the correct one.

[Coach529]

Originally Posted by dwcsr

The crap shoot as they call it is that some years Tbird racks have 5/8-18 thread and some later years is 16mm, both look identical and one will thread into the other, if you get the wrong one in the right hole it will never seal and you damage the washer and possibly pull out the threads.

Pull out the fitting and measure the threads, if its wrong it will also feel loose in the bore and rock a bit even when all the way in. We ran into this when we changed from an 86 Tbird rack to a 98 M8 rack, once the correct fitting was in there it sealed with normal hand wrench torque.

I think it was this fitting kit we used to fix the leak
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/-6-AN-...nion,7489.html which has the 16mm

This is most likely what you have

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/T-Bird...AN,104737.html and its wrong for your rack

Measure to make sure and order the correct one.

What are you using for a pump and hoses with the M8 Rack?

[Hampshire]

...using the Borgeson reduced pressure pump and their hose kit. I think I remember also sending them the part number on the box of the rack, which was an 88 - ford rack. I'm going to call them on Monday & ask about the adapters that were used. I didn't install the hoses, so I can't say how they felt when being threaded in - or what size/thread pitch they are, though I think i remember the tech saying "14 & 16" - (first thing I will ask on monday)

The one that is leaking looks to me like the washer is not seated correctly. How that happened is a mystery to me. The wrong adapter seems like a possibility but the other fitting looks/works just fine.

[dwcsr]

BRG899001 Pressure Reducing Kit GM Pump To Ford Rack
BRG925102 Rubber Power Steering Hose Kit
The pump was a type II GM, you do need the brass ferrule included in the hose kit
You will need to get the Speedway fittings for the M8 rack

[Hampshire]

Dwcsr - those part numbers are what I have from Borgeson (actually, I bought the pump already set up/tested from them with the pressure reduction kit installed) The adapters/brass ferrules were supplied by them, also.

[dwcsr]

It works on some racks but its not correct for your application. The hoses will be fine but you need the speedway rack fittings
There is the possibility that the installer damaged the rack threads by over tightening the fitting. You need to get that fitting out and check the threads and see if the fitting is actually the right one. 5/8-18 and M16x1.5 are very close in size, look the same and may seem to fit but it doesn't have the correct threads to keep tight.

[Hampshire]

Problems solved - thought some may want to know.

First, the wrong o-rings were used by my installer. Borgeseon sent me the correct ones (of their own design) that are meant for the 14/16mm openings this rack had (past tense - read on...)

Instead of fixing the leak, & since I wanted a 3 turn rack anyway & needed a final alignment... I waited until I found one & I had it installed at another shop I use. I also supplied them with Speedway fractional size adaptors for the 6AN fittings with the correct Ford Teflon O-rings.

All is now good. More about the new rack in the other thread I started about 3 turn racks.

Most all promote the use of teflon 0-rings and several use Loctite 545 on all but the leading thread of the adapter fittings as they go into the rack. It also seems that that the fractional size adapters are becoming the norm, as opposed to 14/16mm

Some stuff here:http://www.maximummotorsports.com/Re...004-P1461.aspx

[Rude Dude]

These guys have parts too

http://gottashow.com/products/power_steering

[dwcsr]

Originally Posted by Hampshire

Problems solved - thought some may want to know.

First, the wrong o-rings were used by my installer. Borgeseon sent me the correct ones (of their own design) that are meant for the 14/16mm openings this rack had (past tense - read on...)

Instead of fixing the leak, & since I wanted a 3 turn rack anyway & needed a final alignment... I waited until I found one & I had it installed at another shop I use. I also supplied them with Speedway fractional size adaptors for the 6AN fittings with the correct Ford Teflon O-rings.

All is now good. More about the new rack in the other thread I started about 3 turn racks.

Most all promote the use of teflon 0-rings and several use Loctite 545 on all but the leading thread of the adapter fittings as they go into the rack. It also seems that that the fractional size adapters are becoming the norm, as opposed to 14/16mm

Some stuff here:http://www.maximummotorsports.com/Re...004-P1461.aspx

where is the 3 turn rack thread?

[Hampshire]

It's here...

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=683452

...but I haven't posted what I did on it yet. Took monday off & this week is burying me!