Seatbelts in 47-54 trucks

[DieselRat]

Getting to the point of finishing up my interior and I need to add seatbelts. Would like to do a 3 point, using the original bench seat and frame for now. Ive seen some of the aftermarket kits but I just wanted someone with some experience to say what to look out for etc.

I could see how bolting them to the floor is simple enough with some added bracing, what I'm not seeing is how they would attatch to the sheet metal up at the shoulder area. My truck is a 54 GMC thats never had any seat belts added. Thanks for any input.

[LEEVON]

It's quite a bit of work, requires some welding to be done best. Here is a good read:

http://www.julianos.com/how2_3point_...evy_truck.html

[Iceburgh]

I did mine a little different . I bolted to the same bolts as the seats. For the 3rd point I used the parts that come from Juliann's for the shoulder. Found the mounting point I was comfortable with. Drilled the hole in the inside B pillar.tack welded a strip on the 3"x2" shoulder part...fished it down ran a bolt in and tightened it up. Worked like a charm and no welding

[Trekster]

I made my own from seat belts out of the back seat of an Isuzu Trooper. I made nut plates for the corners of the cab and the seat frame. I used rear seat belts because they looked new compared to the front seat belts in the vehicles in the junkyard.

[DieselRat]

^ so at the attatchement point up top theres basically a heavy flat steel with a nut welded to it that the belt bolts into?

[Trekster]

I used a big square washer with a nut welded to it. I drilled and tapped a small hole in the corner of the washer. With the head liner out, I drilled 2 holes in the top of the inner cab, one big one for the belt attach point and one small one to secure the washer inside the inner cab. This way the attach bolt can be removed and the nut will stay in place. I also put a dab of JB weld on the washer to keep it in place.

Hopefully this makes sense.

[MARTINSR]

That area up there above the window isn't strong enough to mount a shoulder belt. It's only sheetmetal, sheetmetal that is spot welded on. I know, I have removed that piece of metal from my truck and it's not very strong, not anywhere near strong enough for a shoulder belt.

Now, this is the fact that only you can answer for yourself. The fact is, this truck wasn't designed for these seat belts, there is no "energy management" designed into this truck for a collision. A VERY light hit and you are thrown into the steering column that is NOT collapsing like a late model car, not by a long shot. So that shoulder belt mount, as weak as it is would probably help you from falling into the steering column in a slow speed accident. So it does have some value. Any faster than a slow speed accident and it will do nothing, it will rip that piece of metal out and whack you in the back of the head as you slam into the steering column.

Not a pretty picture but those are the facts. I look at driving these old cars like riding a motorcycle, not one bit different. And I have ridden a motorcycle regularly so I have an understanding of the difference from a late model comfortable "safety capsule" car.

I drive my 59 Rambler every single day, with the understanding that I WILL be injured if I have a minor accident. I have been in the autobody collision industry my whole adult life (and a little before that) I know accidents and what happens. And I have cars at the shop right now VERY badly damaged where the person didn't get so much as their hair knocked out of place. I know that isn't the same on a motorcycle, a plane, or my Rambler. And for that reason I drive COMPLETELY different leaving LOTS of room, MANY car lengths. I drive under the speed limit NEVER trying to push yellow lights, never jumping in and out of lanes. I have totally and completely changed how I drive from years ago when I didn't understand this being a young punk.

My Rambler does have simple lap belts (it had no belts until I bought it five years ago) and that is all I have. I have thought about putting shoulder belts in it but thought about what I have told you here and figured I would just ride the motorcycle more carefully instead.



My advice is to drive much more careful with or without that shoulder harness.

Brian

[DieselRat]

Martin, thanks for the advice, and I am fully aware of the fact that it is obviously foolish to just bolt in seatbelts to sheet metal and call it good. Im aware that the upper shoulder support 'spot' is sheet metal, and never meant to handle any major stress. However, I do want shouldnt style belts and want to know how everyone else is attatching them. Not looking to hold anyone accountable. The road is a dangerous place no matter how fast your driving, exercising caution is always number 1. With all this click it or ticket crap going on, I figured with a shoulder belt is one less reason for the man to need to pull me over to discover I have only a lap belt.

[LEEVON]

Well said Brian. I've used the motorcycle analogy before and that's exactly how we should treat safety in these oldies, just consider yourself exposed and take precautions.

I would however urge people to bolt the lower mounts to the floor, not the seat brace. Either way the three point belts is a "something's better than nothing" approach for me. I was actually surprised that Juliano's was willing to post instructions.

[MARTINSR]

Here legally no car that didn't come from the factory with seat belts is required to have them. But you sure as heck don't need to make it a law to force me to put them in! I am a BIG fan of seat belts and wouldn't dream of driving without them.

And if you haven't studied driving and habits with time you REALLY should. I could go on and on about this subject because I have studied it. And I don't mean looking, I mean keeping records of time and mpg and what not. It is CRAZY how distorted our image of time is.

Brian

[Trekster]

Martinsr, I agree. If you get in a wreck in these old trucks you are going to get hurt. However, the seat belts may help in a fender bender and they may help keep you from being thrown out. I have driven an AD truck for the last 30 years and I am very careful to leave a lot of room when I stop and since none of my trucks have been very fast I usually don't drive very fast.
Seatbelts or not, I hope everyone is careful when driving.

[MARTINSR]

Absolutely that is what I was saying. If it didn't come out that way I'm sorry for the confusion. I have them in my Rambler, in my 65 Buick Gran Sport and will in my truck for that reason.

Brian

[nvrdone]

I've been driving my truck since 1973, a lot as a daily driver. One of the first changes I did was to install lap belts.
Then about 10 years ago I got distracted and rear ended a Ford Expedition. Hit him so hard ( about 40 mph ) the radiator was impaled on the water pump pulley. But the seat belts held & I didn't hit the steering wheel. Was I lucky? Damn right. Would a 3 point belt have been better ? Maybe. I still think seatbelts are the best improvement any one can make in an old vehicle.

[MARTINSR]

Originally Posted by nvrdone

I've been driving my truck since 1973, a lot as a daily driver. One of the first changes I did was to install lap belts.
Then about 10 years ago I got distracted and rear ended a Ford Expedition. Hit him so hard ( about 40 mph ) the radiator was impaled on the water pump pulley. But the seat belts held & I didn't hit the steering wheel. Was I lucky? Damn right. Would a 3 point belt have been better ? Maybe. I still think seatbelts are the best improvement any one can make in an old vehicle.

Absolutely, I am NOT going to drive a car without them!

Brian

[S10Fan]

I installed simple lap belts in my 50. Mine are bolted to the floor with the bolt areas reinforced with steel plate both top and bottom. I'd much rather have 3 point belts, but with corner windows I'm not certain the cab corner area is strong enough for mounting.

[Root2812]

I was originally against putting seat belts in my 1950 but I recently found out that I am going to be a parent. I'm not going to stop driving the truck so I need to mount a child seat and be a good role model by wearing my seat belt. Now the 50' is getting lap belts. I won't do the shoulder belts but I think lap belts will work well.

[DieselRat]

Good info guys, thats more what I was looking for. Ive got a 4 year old I wanted to hook in with me too so I will at least be doing lap belts.

[Coach529]

I put the kit in that Leevon posted a link too. I would do it again in a second.

[Scott2]

If the cab interior sheetmetal is a poor mounting point for shoulder belts, it would seem that a logical alternative would be a roll bar. I realize it might not look great, and I have yet to see one installed in any project here, but it would defintely resolve the problem. Has anyone come up with a better approach to insert some actual structure - not necessarily a roll bar - for the shoulder belt mount?

I'm getting ready to install seat belt mounts so I've been thinking about how to do it right.

[whitedog76]

I've always thought routing the shoulder belt behind the seat, similar to a 4 point harness, would be much better than mounting to the a pillar.

Another option is finding some late model seats with built in belts.

I'd never go with just a lap belt. The whole idea of the shoulder belt is to keep your noggin from bashing the winshield or steering wheel.

From personal experiences, I know seat belts are life savers.

Chris

Here's a racing harness made for bench seats. http://wescoperformance.stores.yahoo...-belt.html#top

[MIKESAD50]

Im looking at the set up that WhiteDog76 posted

[whitedog76]

Originally Posted by MIKESAD50

Im looking at the set up that WhiteDog76 posted

The only down side to the racing style is that it can be a little cumbersome. I'm wondering if a retractable could be mounted on the center portion.

http://wescoperformance.stores.yahoo.net/trrelapbe.html

[wolffcub]

I got the 3 point kit from bothers truck parts. The kit uses washers about 3" in diameter that you install behind the sheet metal. The install instructions indicate that you should never go to the seat frame but rather to the cab floor. The pillars mounts were very easy to install with the backing washer as well.

I look at it as me possibly being in better shape having them then not having them at all granted they are not 100% like more modern belt setups.

[jeffbcn]

What size lap belts mounted to cab floor for a 47?