55.2-59 TF 4x4 - Colorado/Canyon Frame Swap

[dhenderz]

New member. I am starting the planning phase of a TF restomod project for my daughter. Trying to determine the 'best' chassis for this swap. Goal is to have a 'new' and fully reliable daily driver (will be her first vehicle). So short of a custom frame, I am thinking a late model chassis swap is the best path forward. This will be a 4x4, not lifted.

After compiling some data it looks like a late model (2015+) Colorado or Canyon short wheel base would be fairly close. I know many use the S10 for this swap but I really don't like the need for wheel spacers to achieve proper track width. Plus the tech on an S10 is getting really old.

I haven't seen anyone try this swap. Wondering if there is a reason? I have seen the swap done onto a Yukon. But the track width is too wide and wheel fitment is an issue.

Thoughts?

[joedoh]

Originally Posted by dhenderz

I know many use the S10 for this swap but I really don't like the need for wheel spacers to achieve proper track width. Plus the tech on an S10 is getting really old.

I have seen exactly one TF S10 swap. One. If you have seen enough to get tired of them I would like access to your archives.

for that matter I have seen exactly one 60-66 S10 swap, but thats because I did it

Originally Posted by dhenderz

I haven't seen anyone try this swap. Wondering if there is a reason?

the reason is probably the donor cost. For what you are talking about, a 2015+, the engines run from V6 to even diesels, but are still 16-20k for a donor. I think for that money for DONORS you can have your way with just about anything, including a gold leaf encrusted AM chassis. kidding aside, that is a lot of "umph" for a chassis that isnt the right length.

what I have seen a lot of is the 2005-up trailblazer swap on TF, and not a lot so as to say its mainstream but certainly more than one. the trailblazer has roughly the right wheelbase, roughly the right track width, the 4x4 version is AWD which I think is better than the on-demand 4x4 of the colorado, and comes with an inline 6 cylinder version of the atlas, which I think is a great motor.

[dhenderz]

Originally Posted by joedoh

I have seen exactly one TF S10 swap. One. If you have seen enough to get tired of them I would like access to your archives.

for that matter I have seen exactly one 60-66 S10 swap, but thats because I did it





the reason is probably the donor cost. For what you are talking about, a 2015+, the engines run from V6 to even diesels, but are still 16-20k for a donor. I think for that money for DONORS you can have your way with just about anything, including a gold leaf encrusted AM chassis. kidding aside, that is a lot of "umph" for a chassis that isnt the right length.

what I have seen a lot of is the 2005-up trailblazer swap on TF, and not a lot so as to say its mainstream but certainly more than one. the trailblazer has roughly the right wheelbase, roughly the right track width, the 4x4 version is AWD which I think is better than the on-demand 4x4 of the colorado, and comes with an inline 6 cylinder version of the atlas, which I think is a great motor.

Thanks for the reply. Not sure about the comment regarding 'getting tired' of the S10 swap. I was saying the technology (of the S10) is getting old. More modern drivelines and chassis tech is so much better for a daily driver.

[dhenderz]

I did look at the Trailblazer swap as well. Certainly closer in terms of wheelbase, but a bit wider than the Colorado/Canyon. So either choice will require some mods to work for sure. I will look at it again.

I still wonder about the tech differences between the Trailblazer (now 10+ years old) vs an essentially new vehicle.

Regarding cost, I would try to find a totaled vehicle. With some patience these can be had for less than $10k.

[_Ogre]

without any idea of your skill level... i will say this: don't do it
frame swaps tend to languish for years with lots of money spent and finally sold on craigslist for pennies on the dollar
yes there are many successful frame swaps on this forum, but there are probably 10 unsuccessful builds for each
a few minutes with a tape measure will tell you the fabrication required to locate wheels vs motor/firewall vs dash
incorporating the electronics, cluster and ac/heat within the existing dash is very difficult
old trucks have zero crash survival design features, probably not the safest first vehicle for a new driver
and with the salt we use here in michigan, i would never drive have a classic daily driver

the best frame for your truck is the oem frame under it now, anything can be added to the existing frame
efi crate motors, aod trans, cruise, ac/heat, ifs, ps, pw, etc... are all available in kit form
and last i will add; if you have to ask, you probably don't have the skill set required to accomplish this swap

[mongocanfly]

Welcome...
I dont think theres anything outdated so to speak about the s10...yes they are old now, but were very good driving machines in the day and still are as there are lots of them still on the road...and the s10 is closer in track width than the newer colorados...
Does it have to be 4wd?
I think there are a few trailblazer swaps on here...but not many...even one Lincoln navigator frame swap...mostly in the AD trucks though..
Im with Russ..a late model rolling Colorado chassis is gonna be some dollars...and still not "fit" your truck....for the same money you could buy a custom built frame and suspension that your truck would bolt right onto...or a completely updated stock frame with all new suspension and driveline ...and finding a totaled colorado that is usable may be hard...the way new vehicles are designed to crumple under impact...I'd be real careful when and if you buy one...
Something else...is this a project you'll be doing yourself? And have you ever done anything like this?
Chassis swaps take up a lot of shop room and a lot of heavy parts handling....the build section is full of builds like this that never get finished

[joedoh]

I build AD trucks (and others) with s10 swaps and the big difference between my trucks and the other s10 swaps is I use all the parts and features of the s10 where most use it as an upgradable chassis and change everything they can, wiring, options, cooling system, engine and trans. I think the way you are looking to do it fits closer to the way I have done it so here are a few pointers.

spend some time with a tape measure, the real time killer with a chassis swap is moving things around. get familiar with the centerline of both a TF and of the donor, then measure to see where the pedals will be with an unaltered firewall. the steering column center too. measure the distance from centerline for anything attached to the firewall, you may want to use the HVAC intact but if it sticks out of the side of the truck without being modified, well you might need a plan to modify it. then do the same thing with floor to top-of-firewall height, to make sure you have the cowl height to get parts inside. a lot of the TF guys use the intact firewall with the trailblazer swap and it works pretty well that I have seen

then measure the front axle centerline and how much sticks stuff forward of it and how much stuff sticks backward from it. compare that to your TF. newer trucks are tremendously compact in their packaging, whereas older trucks had room to host a quinceanera under the hood, but you still may find you have to move the engine and trans back a bit to fit the radiator and AC condenser in front of the engine or need a firewall tub for the trans. newer trucks usually have rack steering so sometimes you can cut the stubs off the original frame and attach them to the donor frame as an easy way to mount the front end.

look at things like frame width, if you plan to use the firewall, how about the floor? is there room to have the frame tuck up inside the body? will any part of the cab be impacted by a rise in the framerails at the back? will the stock gas tank of the donor fit under the cab/bed floor?

you know you will be shortening it, is there an easy place to do it? The new hydroformed frames are thinner and stronger than older c-channel ladder frames, and you may need to be careful welding and fishplating so that you dont put stress in the joint.


just some pointers, worth what they cost. if you consider 10k for a donor not significant, ti saluto! I cant wait to see your build.

[mr48chev]

It all comes back to what one's concept of "reasonable investment" is when it comes to building these trucks or frame swaps.

The S 10 swaps used to be the cheap way to have an upgrade a chassis under an old rig but now they are getting spendy as guys with dead S 10s begin to think they have more value as donors than they did as running driving work trucks.

Around here finding a roll over Colorado or Canyon that new that doesn't have chassis damage is hard as the multitude of rebuild shops suck anything that age up and rebuild them and the frames are damaged on the others.

It isn't our business to question what one has to spend or how much he/she spends as long as we don't believe that someone is ripping a member off or if maybe worse that they are putting together an unsafe rig usually due to cutting corners or trying to use something that just flat doesn't work together such as a C 10 2 wheel drive coil spring front end on a TF truck.
On the other hand we love to follow along on cool projects that are well thought out and that we can learn on. This one appears that you have been doing some serious homework before spending any money and that is the right way to do it.

[dhenderz]

I appreciate the various input and opinions. It does help. Answers to a few of the questions.

I have the space, shop and skills to tackle this project. While not a chassis swap, here is a link to the current project -

http://www.gm***************/threads...rame-off.24865

Relative to this swap, I am leaning towards using the new vehicle's firewall and HVAC module, very similar to the Yukon swap that I referenced. Need to do some more measuring and confirming, just as Joe indicates.

[mongocanfly]

Your link doesn't work....but advise from Russ (joedoh) is good to follow...hes probably done more frame swaps than most and hes a master at using every part from the donor

[dhenderz]

OK, unrelated question. How do I post a URL so it actually works?

[joedoh]

when you aare replying, there is a URL tag that looks like an earth and two chain links. thats the URL tag. even though the PHP forum software will recognize a URL when you dont use a URL tag, it can happen when you post a very long URL that it will also automatically parse, or shorten, the url using a "..." where it has removed the center of the link. it does this because some links are really really long and it would look like a wall of text.

so when you want to post a link, push the URL button and paste your link.

If that is what you did, it is possible that you copied a parsed link from ANOTHER forum. in that case, always OPEN the other link on the other forum, and copy the whole url from the address bar of your browser, then use the URL button and paste it.


good luck!

edit: I was able to discern your link, trying it here.

http://www.gm***************/threads...ame-off.24865/


it appears that the link is blocked by this forum, replaced by asterisks

[dhenderz]

https://www.gm***************/thread...rame-off.24865

So indeed this site blocks hyperlinks to gmsqarebody. Very nice. So if you go to gmsquarebody and search for 1977 K10 Frame Off, or my username you will find the build thread.