Jeep rolling off Black Bear Road

[Ziegelsteinfaust]

Originally Posted by Orange Crate

Does anyone have the back story on this? What started the roll?

My guess she got close to the edge, to much speed, or a combo. I read up on the trail, and it is not for the faint hearted. When I used to bomb dirt roads a lot. I saw quite a few people who didn't know how to drive, and had no intentions of learning. I had taken my 2wd rcsb C10 with a posi, and off road tires high up into the hills. Every once in awhile I would see some idiot get stuck doing something dumb. Like taken a crew cab 4x4 lifted dually up dirt road switchbacks. Or people freeze from fear of heights.

The guy who caught it on the trail cam is lucky he didn't get t-boned there otherwise they may all of died. She was what 50 foot in front of him?

From the pics they appear to have the same vehicle, and judging by hers as it flew by she upgraded it. So she may of been as simple as she was hesitant to roll her tires against the mountain side.

Hopefully she is alright.

I change my opinion after reading further. Her dumb ass boynfriend needs to learn to drive, and get over scratching up his jeep.

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by Ziegelsteinfaust

My guess she got close to the edge, to much speed, or a combo. I read up on the trail, and it is not for the faint hearted. When I used to bomb dirt roads a lot. I saw quite a few people who didn't know how to drive, and had no intentions of learning. I had taken my 2wd rcsb C10 with a posi, and off road tires high up into the hills. Every once in awhile I would see some idiot get stuck doing something dumb. Like taken a crew cab 4x4 lifted dually up dirt road switchbacks. Or people freeze from fear of heights.

The guy who caught it on the trail cam is lucky he didn't get t-boned there otherwise they may all of died. She was what 50 foot in front of him?

From the pics they appear to have the same vehicle, and judging by hers as it flew by she upgraded it. So she may of been as simple as she was hesitant to roll her tires against the mountain side.

Hopefully she is alright.

I change my opinion after reading further. Her dumb ass boynfriend needs to learn to drive, and get over scratching up his jeep.

Not sure what you're talking about ????

The jeep started rolling and went over the edge after the driver got out. Failure of parking brake and/or driver to properly secure vehicle before exiting the vehicle.

It could have happened almost anywhere but in this case the surroundings and thus the results were spectacular. A half mile down the road from us a lady parked and got out and the car started rolling and she tried to catch it and it ran over her with fatal results.

[1976gmc20]

Also, there was a fatal plane crash in Ingram Basin a couple weeks before this jeep accident. They took off from Telluride Airport in a non-turbo Bonanza and tried to fly straight up over the pass without circling to gain altitude. Sad


Edit: actually, the plane crash was only five days before the red jeep accident. Time is all warped out of shape in 2020.

['63GENIII]

Really thought it was going to be the Jeep taking the video that was going over the edge. The red one caught me off guard!

That video was giving me the willies when things were going right! The conversation after between the driver and his GF was probably not all that great either.

Zoomad - "It's ok going up but coming down from the summit is three distinct straight downhill sections that get worse as you go. The last section is the worst as it is like coming down on marbles with a lumpy uneven surface. I had my hands full so I neglected to take shots coming down."

There isn't a bucket big enough to hold all of the "nopes" that I'd have for that! Just the thought of that downhill.... yeah, no way.

[jjzepplin]

Old school tune about this trail.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzWyZ-jM9Is

[mongocanfly]

Wow...I never heard that one zepp...!

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by mongocanfly

Wow...I never heard that one zepp...!

You've been missing out!

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by Zoomad75

I've been over Tincup a lot and I don't think you can go anywhere off of the summit than the trail itself now. At least in a vehicle that is. I know you can hike up to the peak, but nothing else.

Mt. Antero is a trail Larry and I did 13 years ago. Summit is at 13k and most of the trail is exposed shelf switchbacks well above timberline. Oh and its two way since the trail is a up and back type.


That's my old K5 near the top crossing the scree field.


Here's an idea of the tightness of the trail itself and the elevation gain in the switchbacks alone.


Red Cone is a little different to climb and come back down. It's different as it does not go up or down via switchbacks. It goes up and over following the spine of the mountain. So the bonus is great drop off views from BOTH sides of the truck. It's ok going up but coming down from the summit is three distinct straight downhill sections that get worse as you go. The last section is the worst as it is like coming down on marbles with a lumpy uneven surface. I had my hands full so I neglected to take shots coming down.

So I watched some YT videos and it looks like Webster Pass itself is pretty easy - mostly just a dirt road that a 2wd pickup could handle?

We've got a 2016 K2500Hd rclb with a Leer high roof topper set up for camping/sleeping. Based on previous experience, I think I could take it most places without much problem, but I don't want to beat it up too much nor scare my wife (even though we did lots of jeep trails long ago).

Since she still has family in C.S. I guess we will be wandering down there once a year or so (I'd rather just explore MT). So just cataloging some interesting excursions coming and going.

[Zoomad75]

Originally Posted by '63GENIII

Really thought it was going to be the Jeep taking the video that was going over the edge. The red one caught me off guard!

That video was giving me the willies when things were going right! The conversation after between the driver and his GF was probably not all that great either.

Zoomad - "It's ok going up but coming down from the summit is three distinct straight downhill sections that get worse as you go. The last section is the worst as it is like coming down on marbles with a lumpy uneven surface. I had my hands full so I neglected to take shots coming down."

There isn't a bucket big enough to hold all of the "nopes" that I'd have for that! Just the thought of that downhill.... yeah, no way.

I went into that one somewhat blind. I knew it was a steep climb and decent, but it was a little more than I expected. But here's a good video taken from my mirror mount. Still does not translate how steep the last section was. I was on the brake pedal with both feet, legs fully extended, sliding under my seat belt as I was a little shy of being vertical as the truck was going down. Even with both feet clamping down on the brake pedal the tires were still sliding on the loose dirt. I knew Hydroboost needed to be in my future from that point.
https://youtu.be/dEAWtOgqQ4A

Originally Posted by 1976gmc20

So I watched some YT videos and it looks like Webster Pass itself is pretty easy - mostly just a dirt road that a 2wd pickup could handle?

We've got a 2016 K2500Hd rclb with a Leer high roof topper set up for camping/sleeping. Based on previous experience, I think I could take it most places without much problem, but I don't want to beat it up too much nor scare my wife (even though we did lots of jeep trails long ago).

Since she still has family in C.S. I guess we will be wandering down there once a year or so (I'd rather just explore MT). So just cataloging some interesting excursions coming and going.

Webster isn't bad, but it's not always open. You can see the junction with Webster in my video above near the end. There's always a snow bank right at the summit of Webster. Depending on the previous winter's snowfall and how the summer temps have been the snow may still be there until August. That video was taken in July. No chance we could have got through it as it was over 8 ft deep on the trail side down from the summit. It forced us to go all the way down to Breckenridge come back through Fairplay.

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by Zoomad75

I went into that one somewhat blind. I knew it was a steep climb and decent, but it was a little more than I expected. But here's a good video taken from my mirror mount. Still does not translate how steep the last section was. I was on the brake pedal with both feet, legs fully extended, sliding under my seat belt as I was a little shy of being vertical as the truck was going down. Even with both feet clamping down on the brake pedal the tires were still sliding on the loose dirt. I knew Hydroboost needed to be in my future from that point.
https://youtu.be/dEAWtOgqQ4A



Webster isn't bad, but it's not always open. You can see the junction with Webster in my video above near the end. There's always a snow bank right at the summit of Webster. Depending on the previous winter's snowfall and how the summer temps have been the snow may still be there until August. That video was taken in July. No chance we could have got through it as it was over 8 ft deep on the trail side down from the summit. It forced us to go all the way down to Breckenridge come back through Fairplay.

That's why I hate automatics in 4wd. I figured that out about two weeks after I bought my brand new 1973 K20 with TH350. It's all okay until the wheels start locking up.

So now I have yet another one but it had to be so my wife could also drive it. This 6 speed is different, though. I haven't had it off road, but just going down my driveway you can leave it in Drive and keep your foot off the gas and it will just idle down real slow, instead of running away like every other automatic we have or had. Same out on the road, take your foot off the gas going down most hills and it will slow right down almost like a manual. I'm almost liking it

Obviously many of those roads aren't open until July/August. First time I tried to go over Tincup Pass there was a drift like that right below the top so I had to drive back down to BV and go over Cottonwood like a sane person

Not "four wheeling" but the last logging/trucking job I did was up off of Old Cochetopa Pass. There was an insane logging road cut in there by the FS. It wound around nice and easy for miles and then suddenly went up this really steep loose rock hill. I couldn't load my trailer so going up empty was spin/catch spin/catch in 2nd gear all the way. The product was big green poles and coming down loaded in 1st gear I had to stand on the brakes with all my strength just to hold it back and stopping on the grade was out of the question. Just hoped I didn't meet some hunters insisting on uphill right of way! It was a contract job, so much per piece delivered, and the guy who had the timber sale couldn't understand why I didn't load more logs Yeah, a diesel and a jake brake maybe ...

[1976gmc20]

Webster isn't bad, but it's not always open.

Actually we would be more likely to take the "shortcut" over Mosquito Pass. I do NOT want to ever again go over Hoosier and through Breckenridge because of the crazy traffic.

[Zoomad75]

Originally Posted by 1976gmc20

Actually we would be more likely to take the "shortcut" over Mosquito Pass. I do NOT want to ever again go over Hoosier and through Breckenridge because of the crazy traffic.

Actually, Hoosier wasn't bad when we came back off of Webster/Red Cone. It was certainly better than coming back out of Aspen over Independence Pass. I've driven many a pass on dirt that I'd rather go over than hit Indy again. Pretty, but the uppity Aspen people won't give an inch where it gets tight out of town.

[1976gmc20]

Originally Posted by Zoomad75

Actually, Hoosier wasn't bad when we came back off of Webster/Red Cone. It was certainly better than coming back out of Aspen over Independence Pass. I've driven many a pass on dirt that I'd rather go over than hit Indy again. Pretty, but the uppity Aspen people won't give an inch where it gets tight out of town.

We were going down the 15mph switchbacks on Hoosier following a belly dump jake braking his way down the hill, when some jack-hole in a big SUV gets up right behind us - literally about two feet like he thought he was going to just make us drive right through that semi!

And then the weird zig-zagging through Brokenridge - what's up with that ???

That's another reason I traded off the little car and went back to a full size pickup for a travel outfit: people just try to run over you. Like "hey, you're not using all your lane so I will just use the rest of it!" At least in a pickup you get some respect.


I've never been over Independence and only been to Aspen once. One time a guy that I was working for at the time wanted to take his early 70's K20 over Taylor Pass and a bunch of us rode along. I had my 1980 K10 by then and there was no way I was going to risk tearing it up on those rocks. So we get over and took the ridge road down and by then he needed gas so we drove down into Aspen for fuel. Must have been quite a sight for those movie stars when they saw a bunch of dirty loggers riding in the back of that beat up old blue pickup

Coming back over to TP he put a big gouge in the side of the bed near the fuel cap.

[Zoomad75]

Taylor is a fun trail for sure. The snow levels and resulting melt changes that trail every year. I don't think I've seen it the same way any time we've tackled it. The climb out of the creek has been really easy one time and crazy hard the next. Last time we took it I let my then 17-year-old son take the wheel of my old '75 K5 over it. Only stalled it once at the hard spot and by some miracle, the body came out untouched.

We camped on the Aspen side of the pass that night. The next day we were on fumes and really needed some fuel. Only place to fill was right in Aspen. We got lots of nasty looks from the folks at the gas station. Admittedly, the K5 was pretty crusty and not quite up to the supercar levels of vehicle quality Aspen is known for. We boogied right out of there. Taking Indy out of Aspen is the quickest way home for us. We didn't realize that just outside of town the road is narrow enough two cars can barely pass by going in opposite directions. It's paved, but the road is cut out of the side of the mountain and for some reason, they couldn't go much wider. It's well marked to tell you it's narrow, but the upper crust types don't fall under those rules I guess. Our side was on the edge, with a guardrail that I was within inches of touching (the kid was watching for me) and spme lady coming the other way in a Range Rover was driving over the center line and into what little of a lane I had. She had the balls to deliver a crusty look my way like I was the one in the wrong.

Next time I do Taylor I'll go back via Pearl Pass to Crested Butte. At least it won't have any traffic over it.

[1976gmc20]

lady coming the other way in a Range Rover was driving over the center line and into what little of a lane I had

I guess it started a long time ago. We were coming home from shopping in Gunnison one winter while my wife was (not! ) expecting the twins. Taylor Canyon was pretty clear so our K10 was in 2wd. Somebody coming down in a Wagoneer (the "Range Rover" of those days) with Texas plates came around a corner way over the center line and I had to dodge to avoid a head on collision. I tried to pull back out but without 4wd couldn't get steerage and got sucked in really deep in the ditch. Snow was up to the window on the passenger side. I dug and dug until my shovel handle broke and then some different folks in another Wagoneer came along and took us to their fancy house to warm up. That little rich subdivision (I'm sure you know where I mean ) had a year round caretaker (a local guy) and he came and got us out with a K20 pickup. He had to chain the back of his pickup to a tree across the road and winch us out. It's a wonder some other idiot didn't come along and make a big wreck! All of this must have been before the big snow slide that winter and I wrecked my knee trying to get the tracks back on a dozer.

I tried to go up Taylor Pass in my brand new 1973 K20 early in the summer. The water was really high and I couldn't get traction to drive up the waterfall coming out of the creek crossing. It was impossible to even see the rocks to try to figure out where to steer. For some reason I never got around to trying it again, until fall 1980 when a bunch of us rode up there with Johnny Hale* in his "old" pickup (which maybe 5-7 yrs old at the time already looked like a wreck because he had used it so hard).

* long gone I'm sure so I feel free to post his name but no one here would probably have known of him anyway