283 or 307

[bigblockorange]

Sad to say but the 283 isn't big enough for a full size pickup if you want to hot rod with it. I have one in the blue stepper. All bark and no bite. Yeah I know they can make a little Nova run but they are half the weight.

[Cunit69]

If I was building a small block, I would just go with a 350, parts are cheap and plentiful.

[bad421]

67 C-30 I agree that I've some 400 blocks that were cracked or just had way to much core shift to make a good motor out of but, most of them were the early 400 blocks and mostly the 4 bolt main ones, with that said when I go to look at one its never a 4 bolt block and if it will be used for the street we just do studs on the stock 2 bolt caps if its race we do billet splayed 4 bolt caps, also I have heard about the 3.25 stroke 400 bore based motors but have never seen one heard they were very nice, but I have had my hand in a few 377" big bore motors and they love the rpm's too.

[special-K]

The Question:

Originally Posted by daveo68

My brother is giving me a 283 out of a '57 chevy he is . (It is actually out of a '65 chevy). Would the 283 be better to rebuild than the 307 or just save my money for a 350?

Thanks,
Dave

When asked what he wants from his motor:
"I guess what I want is the best of both worlds,more HP better mileage."

Answer to question:

Originally Posted by samwise68

I won't comment on whether you should save for another motor, simply because I am a firm beleiver in using what I have on hand.

Regardless, I run a tired 307, with 2 bbl and headers, 3.07 gears, etc (it's all in my sig), and I'm very content with the motor. It's approaching the 100,000 mark, and has never been apart. It's starting to burn oil, and god know what else.

But, I still squeeze out high-teen's for mpg's, and have enough snot to get up to highway speeds in a fair clip, all things considered.

Am I bias? Of course. If you're looking for an all out race motor, 283/307 isn't your ticket without alot of money invested.

But with a nice rebuild, bump the compression and cam, headers and a nice flowing 4-bbl, you'll have a good performing engine, gets respectable mpg's (pending gear ratio and driving style), and unless you're out head hunting at stop lights, should give you enough power to satisfy your needs as a daily driver.

Just my opinion.

-Sam.

Another answer to the question:

Originally Posted by bhoeger70

If you have the 307 build that, it will be a little cheaper to build than the 283 and give you more torque than the 283 will. Find a set of 305, 416 casting heads and you will have a nice running little engine, just dont expect to pull 10,000 pounds over the mountains at speed.

Pretty much everything else:
A collection of opinions on various small block configurations for various results.

[WIDESIDE72]

Talk about a can of worms here. I have run almost every SBC displacement. 267 (79 Malibu- DOG!) 283 (57 Chevy) 307(72 custom 10, 71 Nova), 327 (65 Malibu) 350 (71 El Camino, 79 Malibu (after 267), 76 C10, 82 C10, 383 (79 Malibu after 267 and 350), 400 (71 Impala I wish I had it in a little Nova or Camaro!). My Dad had a 80 GMC 1 ton with a 454, brother had a Camaro with a 454 swapped in, 76 C10 w/ a 454 (after 350), each brother had a 72 C10 with a 402. All except for the 267 and 307's had minor upgrades like cam, headers, carb, sometimes heads, nothing exotic or fancy. My point is: the 454 always had more power, but used more gas. the 283's and 327's ran good and were good in a car , or a truck when empty. IMO, a 350 is a good compromise if you do a little light towing and like to hot rod around a little. A 383 will only cost a little more to build if your core requires a new crank (don't bother with used OEM 400 cranks, there are plenty of good aftermarket cranks CHEAP). Finding a usable 400 block is more $$$ still, but they do run like a scalded dog.

[WIDESIDE72]

OK, everyone forgot to answer your question and rambled on about their favorite engine (especially me). IMO, tear down both engines and see which is in the best shape, and which would require the least amount of money. If on a budget, build the one that will cost the least at the machine shop. It will mainly come down to which engine (if any) can use he stock pistons and only require a hone job (not likely). I believe 283 and 307 cranks are the same (?) If both require an overbore, check into the cost of replacement pistons. Install a good RV type torque cam, dual plane intake, decent electronic ignition and 600 cfm 4 barrel on either engine.

[Cunit69]

Originally Posted by WIDESIDE72

OK, everyone forgot to answer your question and rambled on about their favorite engine (especially me). IMO, tear down both engines and see which is in the best shape, and which would require the least amount of money. If on a budget, build the one that will cost the least at the machine shop. It will mainly come down to which engine (if any) can use he stock pistons and only require a hone job (not likely). I believe 283 and 307 cranks are the same (?) If both require an overbore, check into the cost of replacement pistons. Install a good RV type torque cam, dual plane intake, decent electronic ignition and 600 cfm 4 barrel on either engine.

The cranks are different the 283 has a stroke of 3.480, and the 307 has a stroke of 3.250, but very good answer anyways.

[Ricks1971]

You want horsepower and tork build a 400 but if you want good gas mileage and all around nice motor build a 327

[67_C-30]

Originally Posted by Cunit69

The cranks are different the 283 has a stroke of 3.480, and the 307 has a stroke of 3.250, but very good answer anyways.

No, a 283 has a 3.00" stroke and 3.875" bore. A 307 has the same 3.875" bore and 3.250" stroke. A 267, 305, and 350 use the 3.48" stroke.

[special-K]

Another note:
From what I`ve seen,307s tend to run forever.I say this from actual experiences I`ve had and what people have said.I had a timing chain jump time and the valves got bent @120,000 miles.An overhaul/rebuild was in order since I`d never do a top-end on any small block at that mileage.That block had vitually no ridge and just a hone and new rings was all it needed.The crank was pretty,too,no machining.This motoe was in a`71 K/20 with 4.57:1 gearing,not a car.

[67_C-30]

Originally Posted by Cunit69

The cranks are different the 283 has a stroke of 3.480, and the 307 has a stroke of 3.250, but very good answer anyways.

Here's a Chevy V8 engine bore and stroke chart.



CHEVY SMALLBLOCK V-8 BORE AND STROKE


262 = 3.671" x 3.10" (Gen. I, 5.7" rod)
265 = 3.750" x 3.00" ('55-'57 Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
265 = 3.750" x 3.00" ('94-'96 Gen.II, 4.3 liter V-8 "L99", 5.94" rod)
267 = 3.500" x 3.48" (Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
283 = 3.875" x 3.00" (Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
293 = 3.779" x 3.27" ('99-later, Gen.III, "LR4" 4.8 Liter Vortec, 6.278" rod)
302 = 4.000" x 3.00" (Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
305 = 3.736" x 3.48" (Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
307 = 3.875" x 3.25" (Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
325 = 3.779" x 3.622" ('99-later, Gen.III, "LM7", "LS4 front wheel drive V-8" 5.3 Liter Vortec, 6.098" rod)
327 = 4.000" x 3.25" (Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
345 = 3.893" x 3.622" ('97-later, Gen.III, "LS1", 6.098" rod)
350 = 4.000" x 3.48" (Gen.I, 5.7" rod)
350 = 4.000" x 3.48" ('96-'01, Gen. I, Vortec, 5.7" rod)
350 = 3.900" x 3.66" ('89-'95, "LT5", in "ZR1" Corvette 32-valve DOHC, 5.74" rod)
364 = 4.000" x 3.622" ('99-later, Gen.III, "LS2", "LQ4" 6.0 Liter Vortec, 6.098" rod)
376 = 4.065" x 3.622" (2007-later, Gen. IV, "L92", Cadillac Escalade, GMC Yukon)
383 = 4.000" x 3.80" ('00, "HT 383", Gen.I truck crate motor, 5.7" rod)
400 = 4.125" x 3.75" (Gen.I, 5.565" rod)
427 = 4.125" x 4.00" (2006 Gen.IV, LS7 SBC, titanium rods)

Two common, non-factory smallblock combinations:

377 = 4.155" x 3.48" (5.7" or 6.00" rod)
400 block and a 350 crank with "spacer" main bearings
383 = 4.030" x 3.75" (5.565" or 5.7" or 6.0" rod)
350 block and a 400 crank, main bearing crank journals
cut to 350 size



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CHEVY BIG BLOCK V-8 BORE AND STROKE


366T = 3.935" x 3.76"
396 = 4.096" x 3.76"
402 = 4.125" x 3.76"
427 = 4.250" x 3.76"
427T = 4.250" x 3.76"
454 = 4.250" x 4.00"
496 = 4.250" x 4.37" (2001 Vortec 8100, 8.1 liter)
502 = 4.466" x 4.00"
572T = 4.560" x 4.375" (2003 "ZZ572" crate motors)

T = Tall Deck

ALL production big blocks used a 6.135" length rod.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CHEVY 348-409 V-8 BORE AND STROKE


348 = 4.125" x 3.25" (6.125" rod)
409 = 4.312" x 3.50" (6.010" rod)
427 = 4.312" x 3.65" (6.135" rod) 1963 "Z11" SHP drag race

[Cunit69]

Originally Posted by 67_C-30

No, a 283 has a 3.00" stroke and 3.875" bore. A 307 has the same 3.875" bore and 3.250" stroke. A 267, 305, and 350 use the 3.48" stroke.

Where are you getting your info? A 283 has a 3.48 stroke with a 3.50 bore. a 307 has 3.25 stroke and a 3.875 bore. A 265 and a 302 have 3.00 stroke, and a 307 is the only one that has a 3.875 bore.

[67_C-30]

Originally Posted by Cunit69

Where are you getting your info? A 283 has a 3.48 stroke with a 3.50 bore. a 307 has 3.25 stroke and a 3.875 bore. A 265 and a 302 have 3.00 stroke, and a 307 is the only one that has a 3.875 bore.

See the chart above. A 267 has a 3.50 bore and 3.48 stroke.

Do that math, if you don't believe me. BORE X BORE X STROKE X .7854 X number of cylinders = Cu In.

3.500 X 3.500 X 3.48 X .7854 X 8 = 267.852 cu in.

3.875 X 3.875 X 3.00 X .7854 X 8 = 283.038 cu in.

[Cunit69]

Originally Posted by 67_C-30

See the chart above. A 267 has a 3.50 bore and 3.48 stroke.

Do that math, if you don't believe me. BORE X BORE X STROKE X .7854 X number of cylinders = Cu In.

3.500 X 3.500 X 3.48 X .7854 X 8 = 267.852 cu in.

3.875 X 3.875 X 3.00 X .7854 X 8 = 283.038 cu in.

You are right, I did some more reseach and found out my book has a misprint. If you have a problem with me why don't you P.M me!!!

[Skirkpat]

Originally Posted by daveo68

My brother is giving me a 283 out of a '57 chevy he is restoring. (It is actually out of a '65 chevy). Would the 283 be better to rebuild than the 307 or just save my money for a 350?

Thanks,
Dave

To answer your question , The 283/307 engine family is a good choice especially if you have one that needs little work except maybe bearings and rings, if you need to bore and hone, I would sell the 283 and get a 350.

The savings on parts will alow you to do a better, more thorough job on machine work, also will alow you to step up to Hyperutectic pistons for what cast pistons cost for the 283.

Now for what he did not ask, but was answered anyway 400 blocks are siamesed bores, great for drag racing, really not the greatest for general use. Prone to overheating. The 400 VS. 383 debate boiling down to cubic inches is pretty simplistic, 17 cubic inches is not going to win a race (like anyone races 4500 LB. trucks anyway) What determines power and reliability is the ratio of stroke to bore, compression ring land (reliability issue) and most importantly the cylinder head.

And if you think Cubic inches always win, My buddy has a a 3.8 litre V-6 in a tuned Grand National, ran it in the 10.5 inch radial class and made it the National Finals in Fla. about 5 years ago, he raced small blocks, and guess what, They lost on a consistant basis, it's the design, build and tune that matters, right?

[special-K]

Originally Posted by Cunit69

You are right, I did some more reseach and found out my book has a misprint. If you have a problem with me why don't you P.M me!!!

Please yes,no more in this thread...at all!! I`m glad it`s cleared up,but this went too far in a thread.You guys know better.

And Skirkpat...right!

[daveo68]

Thanks for all the answers, very good suggestions.
Dave

[67_C-30]

Sorry about that guys, I reckon I woke up on the wrong side of the bed. Sorry about that Cunit.

[special-K]

Well,we know all the bores and strokes now. (And,something did get worked out.Just not "Board Style")

[fnoblitt]

"USE THE 57 283 BLOCK. THE CASTINGS ARE THICKER.. i HAVE SEEL 1000 HP FROM A TURBO 57 CHEVY.GOOGLE IT. THERE IS A FULL WRITE UP ON IT. YOU CAN BORE THAT BLOCK TO 60 WITH NO WORRIES. " if i remember right,in my '57 chevy the 283 block didn't have side motor mount bosses ,it mounted by the timing cover.

[WIDESIDE72]

Originally Posted by fnoblitt

"USE THE 57 283 BLOCK. THE CASTINGS ARE THICKER.. i HAVE SEEL 1000 HP FROM A TURBO 57 CHEVY.GOOGLE IT. THERE IS A FULL WRITE UP ON IT. YOU CAN BORE THAT BLOCK TO 60 WITH NO WORRIES. " if i remember right,in my '57 chevy the 283 block didn't have side motor mount bosses ,it mounted by the timing cover.

Good luck finding a 57 83 block... I believe the side motor mounts did not come out til the 60's.

BTW, everyone, his question was not " WHICH SBC IS BEST". His question was "WHICH SHOULD I BUILD, a 283 or 307"?

IMO, they are pretty equal. Neither is GREAT for pulling or high horsepower/ torque in street trim. Build whichever takes the least money to get running.

I had a friend of a friend who ridiculed me aboutmy 6.2 diesel being a dog. We were both on our way to the Pate swap meet in Cresson one year, both pulling loaded 16' lo boy trailer. I passed him and his hopped up 68 1/2 ton lwb 283 going up a hill. THe Banks turbo I put on later really got his goat!He hated "that damn clatter wagon". HAHA

[special-K]

Oh yeah...check the motor mounting on the block.I`d do the 307,if it`s good.The`57 283 would be great to have,though,if you can have it.

[robmrtnbb5]

i would take a 283 over 307 any day i had a 283 bored out to 301 inone of my 57 chevy`s it had plenty of scoot just my 2 cents

bob

[Skirkpat]

Originally Posted by robmrtnbb5

i would take a 283 over 307 any day i had a 283 bored out to 301 inone of my 57 chevy`s it had plenty of scoot just my 2 cents

bob

I do not know why? A 283 is a smaller CU displacement, and a shorter stroke, all things equal a 307 will make more power.

A 307 with good heads, like a Vortec (not huge runner/flowing heads) a dual plane intake, and 600 CFM 4 BBL will flat out run the same 283, it is a great build for a daily driver that wants a truck that will keep up or beat any stockers, and still pull good gas mileage. The 307 I described snapped the frame on my Turbo Regal, One of the best engines I have built.