Project: Recycle

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by aggie91

I knew I could count on you to give a better backstory, reasoning for choosing a given shock and not just say its a coil over with X" compressed length, Y" extended and a Z" long spring. I have been doing research too as to what shock companies like PB, RideTech, QA1, CPP, and others use in their conversion kits for the stock crossmember. I also recall Rob (NoLimit Engineering) saying a longer stroke shock and coil is better. I was planning on using a 5" stroke shock with a 10" spring and ironically with the same 750 pound spring that you chose. Now I know that I was on the right track. I am leaning towards a QA1 shock with similar specs to your RideTech shocks. Great minds do think alike. I just need to get my '65 back together and driving before I jump to deep in to the '75 build.

I appreciate that feedback. Seems better to understand the 'why' a decision was made when being told of a specific part that's not just a bolt-in swap. I was very impressed w/the QA1 C10 stuff when I looked @ their set-up @ the C10 Nats last year. I use the same method of thought for the cars stuff as well & actually will be using a QA1 front sway bar for the G-body. Quality parts.

Originally Posted by 88Stanger

Damn Scoti you are just amazing! This is like watching an artist! Nice job sir!

I'm better than I used to be but nowhere near amazing. Just trying to build something solid, safe, & on a blue-collar budget.

Thanks for the comments

[Inverter]

Looks good on there.
Nice to get back on schedule eh? As you were...

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by Inverter

Looks good on there.
Nice to get back on schedule eh? As you were...

I trimmed more away from the original bag mount. There's a fingers width of clearance all around the spring now. I also trimmed the front stud as well. Pulled the bracket & getting ready to put some heat to it now....

[SCOTI]

I've been pushing through & trying to get things done despite the heat & dead-ends in my attempt to utilize true tie-rod ends for the steering links. This was a concern of mine from day-one as I feel a true TRE would be better vs. a heim. I know lots of guys use heims on their builds. I know they're a common need on these aftermarket x-member/R&P set-ups. Lot's of guys also use bolt-in c-notches that kill frame strength but that doesn't make them the best choice especially when other options are possible....

I wanted to try other possibilities before defaulting to the use of heims. This was complicated by the recent spindle change (OE style spindle to CPP's modular spindle). It seems the CPP modular spindle is a little looser w/it's TRE pad tolerances.

To summarize..... Can't use OE C10 TRE's because of length (PB Dropmember + 1" narrowed arms + modular spindle). They can be cut down shorter but then would need to be machined to size & threaded. I don't have that equipment available to me & wasn't going to pay machine shop prices for a 'maybe it will/maybe it won't' mod. It was also not a 'correct' fit in the CPP spindles TRE pad (too loose/too much play).

I tried an alternative TRE that's been used before on C10's from a International Scout II. The books dimensions said it would work. In reality, the Moog part was a no go (stud too short) & it was too loose (worse) in the spindle TRE pad.

I tried a common 4wd upgrade option using GM 1-ton 4wd TRE's. These are HD sized but close in length needs (to the Scout unit) & threaded similarly (like the Scouts). The thread shank/size is larger but that's just a different adapter or re-drill/re-tap the heim adapter I already had. One requirement though was it required reaming the spindle TRE pad for a larger stud (if it would have worked, this would have corrected the loose tolerances of the CPP spindles TRE pad). I bought the correct reamer & gave it a go. Unfortunately, the spindles TRE pad required reaming it enough so that when the castle nut reached the point of inserting a cotter-pin, the TRE's body was closer than desired. It cleared when cycling the suspension but the grease-boot would have been destroyed in short order.

Can't say I didn't try....

So, the process of installing the heims (w/the correct 5/8" bolts) vs. just having them in place for mock-up (1/2" or 5/8" bolts depending on the spindles) required drilling the spindle TRE pad for inserts the correct size so that the 5/8" bolts were seated securely. I purchased inserts online (7/8" OD; 5/8" ID). Technically these were press-fit drill bushings. I bought 2 different sets: 1x 'standard'; 1x 'oversized'. The oversized bushings have additional material & require the end user to machine them to the final dimensions needed.

Drilling for the bushings was straight-forward.... Kind-of. I googled & watched YT videos of guys drilling the spindles w/a hand drill. Seemed sketchy but more than one off-roader has done it so 'timid me' just had to put my big-boy pants on & get it done. I strapped the spindle to keep it from moving. Used a uni-bit to have a nice 'starting pad' for the larger bits (started w/a 3/4"). It was almost immediately apparent in my head that this was NOT the correct approach. While I was able to drill through, the drill pulled/pushed if the bit dug in. Stop, reset, re-start. I got through but wasn't impressed. I thought "well maybe now that there's a 3/4" hole all the way through (vs. a tapered hole)… the next pass will ease my mind". Nope. Same drill (pun intended).

The 7/8" bit would dig in & pull the drill any direction but plumb. It was a PITA to keep it straight as this was the main focus. I was hoping I did good enough & suppose I did but I was not happy w/the 'quality' of the outcome. The 'standard' bushing had play when inserted from the top. It did fit snug (could barely insert it) from the bottom. One of the oversized bushings was used on this one (un-touched/as-is).

In the end, it required the hydraulic press to get the bushing seated in the spindle so I know I'm good but I also knew I WAS NOT doing the other spindle the same way. I knew it could be done 'better'. It took some staring & head-scratching but I figured out a way to get it done & luckily had some nice tools @ my work that made it happen.

The 2nd spindle took longer to set-up than it did to drill. But, once drilled, it was true & the 'standard' bushing had the same resistance top + bottom this time. Again, this bushing also required seating w/the hyd press.

So that's been occupying my shop time for the last 2-3wks. Researching parts options. Researching 'how-to'. Acquiring the parts. Buying another car. Getting it done. Getting it done correctly.... With the TRE task completed, I'll start next week & get the drivers side lower mount & passenger side C/O brackets finish welded.

[SkinnyG]

There are rubber boots you can get for Heim joints that can protect it from the elements. Likely not be as good as a proper tie rod, but better than open and exposed.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by SkinnyG

There are rubber boots you can get for Heim joints that can protect it from the elements. Likely not be as good as a proper tie rod, but better than open and exposed.

Yes sir. Already have them & have had them for a bit. I just needed to exhaust the other possibilities first.
Thanks regardless as others may not know about them.

[TA_C10]

Your gettin it figured man. Shame your original idea didn't work out but it's gonna be solid. Looks good.

[aggie91]

Wait you bought another car? A Project Car or a Driver Car?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by aggie91

Wait you bought another car? A Project Car or a Driver Car?

Both. Sort-of.

[tinydb84]

I just want to say I appreciate the level of detail and work you put into your posts. There is a lot of info/ideas/execution that I (and I assume others) are able to pull from them.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by tinydb84

I just want to say I appreciate the level of detail and work you put into your posts. There is a lot of info/ideas/execution that I (and I assume others) are able to pull from them.

I appreciate that as I'm def trying to help if/where possible.

Thanks!

[raylube]

Originally Posted by tinydb84

I just want to say I appreciate the level of detail and work you put into your posts. There is a lot of info/ideas/execution that I (and I assume others) are able to pull from them.

Times 2 . I have not yet had time to fully check out this build but glancing over it you have skills way beyond everything I have seen. When I get done with my 4x4 project I will definitely use your build as the idiot's guide to chassis work lol on my 2wd trucks. Keep up the good work

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by raylube

Times 2 . I have not yet had time to fully check out this build but glancing over it you have skills way beyond everything I have seen. When I get done with my 4x4 project I will definitely use your build as the idiot's guide to chassis work lol on my 2wd trucks. Keep up the good work

As you're aware, my recent requests & our conversation had me looking in on your stuff & has me filing your 4x4 info as a reference to educate myself. Thank you as well


As for a thread/build update, I've been working on it. The driver side brackets are fully welded & cleaned up w/60grit.

I put the 2nd C/O together & did the 2nd trimming on the upper PB Dropmember bag mount for the passenger side. I liked where things were @ so I drilled the holes for the lower mount & the lower arm. I have it all sitting there & today will try to verify the C/O is @ the same angle as the driver side. Then I'll pull the brackets out & get them welded up. The assemble/disassemble process can be time consuming..... and repetitive.

I haven't given it much thought but I'll prob grab one of the various sway-bars I have & do as mock-up for that to while I'm in there. I have an Addco/PB bar that wouldn't work in a different app as well as a ginormous bar (1 3/8" Bell Tech??) I bought for my Dually to test & see if either might work.

[raylube]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

As you're aware, my recent requests & our conversation had me looking in on your stuff & has me filing your 4x4 info as a reference to educate myself. Thank you as well

Your welcome keep up the good work and keep on truckin

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

Of the multiple 78-81 Malibu's I've owned (3 2drs & 2 Camino's), this one is the cleanest as far as floor-pan rust issues. I still accumulate parts for it when I see something it will eventually need....


Thanks!

I went back through these early posts, saw this one above from 10yrs ago ( ) & had to chuckle....

It's now 4x 2 doors & 2.5x Camino's I've owned (the .5 is for the non-running manual swap donor I bought solely for the 3-pedals & column shift delete steering column). We (myself & MattA) wound up swapping the automatic & column from the tan 'Bu posted early in this thread (pg2) over to the ElCo after we were able to get it running. Surprisingly, it even ran pretty decent. So I thought cha-ching.... I'll get the manual trans swap parts needed & make some money on top of it by selling off the donor! But, my buddy needed a cheap solid ride so it went to him.

Since then, this is No.4 2dr. It now holds the title of cleanest as far as floor-pan rust issues . . ….

[lolife99]

Man I love those G-body Malibu’s.
I’ve only had one over the years, but have always liked them.
I’d even take a clean wagon.

You need to post more pics of your Malibu.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by lolife99

Man I love those G-body Malibu’s.
I’ve only had one over the years, but have always liked them.
I’d even take a clean wagon.

You need to post more pics of your Malibu.

If they all cost the same, I would have been purchasing 66 & 70 Chevelle's vs g-body's. But, a clean survivor base model 66 or 70 is multiple times more than what a g-body goes for. I do like that g-body's are lighter, smaller, & still just as easy to work-on or upgrade.

[aggie91]

That Malibu is very clean. I do like those two doors, but never see a clean one for sale around my part of the state...only the junk seems to come up for sale.

[SCOTI]

Small update.

C/O brackets for both sides welded & bolted in. C/O's installed on both sides now. I put the spindles on both side & everything seems good. I need to get 2 front tire swapped onto the correct wheels (original tires are way past a service timeline despite zero miles). Going to use a similar set of trailer takes offs until I'm closer to it actually being drivable.

I pushed to get everything back together because I knew I needed to start thinking & making decisions on another front end item..... The sway bar.

[SCOTI]

I've got 4 C10 era sway bars hanging under my storage racking:

*1.125" OE standard bar
*1.25" OE C10HD/C20/C30 bar
*1.25" Addco/PBDM bar
*1.375" Bell Tech? (I'm pretty sure that was the manufacturer & looking for the paperwork to confirm).

I knew the OE bars were out because of the a-arm mounting style. So I grabbed the used Addco/PB bar I purchased off a board member as well as the Bell Tech unit I initially bought for my Dually.

I WAS surprised that the Bell Tech bar was actually slightly narrower than the Addco/PB bar considering the PB Dropmember has a narrowed track width vs. what the Bell Tech bar is spec'd for. I laid the BT bar on the floor under the front frame rails & WAS NOT surprised it was wider than the mounts on the arms (Dropmember + narrowed arms). But, while the ends of the sway-bar were wider & not plumb w/the C/L of the sway-bar link mounts on the a-arms, they weren't that far off either After staring @ it for a while, I grabbed more spare parts I had for the G-body & have a starting point for my solution.

In true fashion for this build, the bar bought for the Dually will get used & the end-links for the G-body will be part of the set-up as well. More 'recycled' stuff vs. having to buy new stuff

[SCOTI]

A couple of pics w/the G-body spec end-link set-up loosely in position to get a visual. My main concern is link alignment between the bar & a-arm mounts. That's where using this bar & the Addco/PB bar on my dually both failed. Misalignment killed the poly bushings quickly.

Obviously I could move the a-arm mount position to accommodate different bars but since they're already PC'd I'd prefer to not have to.

I purchased these end links in 2016 while trying to sort through the Dually issues knowing if they didn't work for that app I could use them on a G-body since they have a way of crossing my path.

You can see in the images where the link falls to the outer edge of the current bracket placement. While still not perfectly 'plumb', they're much closer vs trying to use the standard bushings @ bar > spacer < bushings @ a-arm mount arrangement. I'll keep studying it to decide if I simply drill the vertical portion of the current brackets & utilize a spacer/bearing assembly or trim/tweak the current mount as needed for something that attaches. Doing something that attaches also allows tweaking the placement for a 'plumb' alignment.

This is where loosely putting things together helps for me. I see it & start the 'what-if' process in my head. I keep looking @ it daily until I get ideas to try & see what might work (or what won't work). It's the approach I take that works w/the limited fabricating tools/skills I have.

[lolife99]

SCOTI, are you attaching the sway bar directly to the frame rails or using some kind of lowered sway bar stand like ECE use to sell?

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by lolife99

SCOTI, are you attaching the sway bar directly to the frame rails or using some kind of lowered sway bar stand like ECE use to sell?

My stuff has always been low enough that by-passing the tradtional 'lowered' mounting worked best. For this mock-up, the frame bushings are attached directly to the rail as well.

[TA_C10]

How close is the sway to the steering linkage? Can't really tell in your pics. Looks like you have a solid plan, and re-using parts is always a plus

.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by TA_C10

How close is the sway to the steering linkage? Can't really tell in your pics. Looks like you have a solid plan, and re-using parts is always a plus

.

Should fit w/o interference @ the proper length. I'm using the hardware that came w/the links in the pics which is not correct (too long) for the application needs. The sway bar is also not 100% seated @ the frame pivot mounts as there are only 2-holes (fronts) securing the bracket for the mock-up. I'll be drilling the other holes this week.