Dana Pics

[richardwilken]

Looking For Pics Of Open And Closed Knuckle Front Axles (dana's). Also, Looking For Information On Disc Barke Conversions For Dana 44 Front Axles. Any Body Help? Thanks

[Yukon Jack]

Here's my 69 K20 closed knuckle Dana 44. 1969 was the last year for this design.

[Yukon Jack]

You can switch out the knuckles to go with disks but most people just swap in a newer Dana 44 with disks rather than messing with the conversion.

[JIMs70GMC]

My 70 has open knuckle w/ drums and my 71 has open knuckle w/ discs, you could just swap everything from the knuckle out but usually it's easier to find a complete front axle from a 71-87 truck or -91 for blazer / suburban. It was thought that you could swap spindles and backing plates from a disc 44 to a drum 44 but it clocks the caliper back or forward depending on how you put it on. On a closed knuckle front you will not be able to convert to discs. I had a lot of pics but they are on another computer w/ a virus! So after the storm I could shoot some pics.

[Budweis]

heres open one like jim talking about. im going to be using it as a doner and just swap knuckles out onto my other differential as im replacing u-joints, ball joints, seals, etc anyway and want to keep old one for the gears.

[67cst]

what are the advantages/disadvantages to open and closed knuckles?

[1969 GMC]

Derek, there is only one advantage to closed knuckle axles over open that I can see, is that they have kingpins instead of balljoints, which are a little more tough.

Downsides to closed knuckle: drum brakes only, external hubs (which arent desireable), smaller axleshafts, smaller ujoints at the knuckle, axle seals frequently go bad on these and make a mess. Also, closed knuckles cannot turn as tightly as open knuckles and therefore have a larger turning radius.

Open knuckled axles are pretty much the opposite. '70 models with drums can be converted to discs, otherwise all other years have discs to begin with. Most have internal hubs, but some still have external. These axles also have larger shafts and u joints, and dont have annoying tube end seals to make a mess. Also you get an improved turning radius.

The closed knuckle d44 in my truck was fine for DD duty (4 wheel drum power brakes) and light wheeling with my 32's, but since I plan on lifting my truck and getting bigger tires, the axle and those weeny little drums up front had to go. I would have gone to a newer d44 with open knuckles, but lucky for me I got a hella deal on a d60 for $150.

[67cst]

adam thanks for the info, im just getting into the 4x4 scene, i wasnt going to post until tomorrow when i got pics but i think im snagging my buddies 63 gmc 4x4, he put over 12k into it and now is strapped for cash cause he bought a house and a new truck, so im really concidering it,id say there is a 99 percent chance of it anways, its sitting on a 79 3/4 ton frame, so its got disc brakes, power steering and power brakes, for running gear it has a 383 stroker push a little over 400 hp, or so he says, and a th400, new 33's too, decent paint, very clean interior, new exhaust..over all its a tight rig, im going to get pics tomorrow after lunch and ill post em on here and see what everyone thinks, like if the price is right etc. im pretty stoked about it though, its a pretty tough looking truck, the only think im not happy with is that its on propane, but id swap that back to gas in a heartbeat, especailly with the newer frame and all, i could probably find a tank for it at the local wreckers

anyways enough b.s for now....ill post pics tomorrow

[richardwilken]

Originally Posted by Yukon Jack

You can switch out the knuckles to go with disks but most people just swap in a newer Dana 44 with disks rather than messing with the conversion.

where could i find a conversion kit for this? what other parts need to be converted? these drums just dont cut it for trailer towing (esp. stopping). i have looked into finding a d44 from a 71 0r 72. what kind of price am i looking at, providing that i can find one? i know 73-87's had them, but would prefer an original. any help?

[Budweis]

your on the right track just need to get one off a 71-72, somebody on here might have one near you. should be able to get one for somewhere around 125.00 to 150.00 if you catch someone upgrading.

[JIMs70GMC]

The actual dana 44 was available until around 78 in the chevys and later in the GMCs. The 73 and newer axles will have a slightly larger axle u-joint, which is desirable. While finding a 71-72 would be nice, I'd say start by looking for a gear ratio that matches your rear or what you want then go from there. You could broaden the search if you include the 10 bolt available up to 87 or 91 depending on truck or suv. One of the biggest differences would be a metric banjo fitting at the caliper.

[Grim Reaper]

Scrap any pre disc D44 unless your doing a 100 point restore. It's not worth the time to mess with if you building a truck to use.

When looking for a replacement get a 74 or newer. 73 and older ran smaller u-joints. I 147 or something. the 74 up 1/2 and 3/4 run a 297. The disc front ends made 70-73 can swap to the larger u-joint axle shaft no problem.

[Txstruck]

Heres a page that shows everything about a Dana60:

http://www.coloradok5.com/dana60manual.shtml

[richardwilken]

this truck is meant to be driven. they way i figure it, my options are:
1. 74 and up d44 (or d60)
2. find an original 71-72 d44 with front discs.

what has to be modified to fit a 73+ d44 to our trucks? spring perches on the axles? etc, what else? i want to keep my 8 bolt wheels. is the track width of the axles different?
thanks for all the help!

[1969 GMC]

I am pretty sure that all newer d44's and d60's will bolt right up. Also, all 3/4 ton d44's will be 8 lug, and all d60's will be as well. even the 10 bolt should bolt up, but I don't know much about this axle.

[JIMs70GMC]

Like Adam said, the axles will bolt right up. I was under the impression that the late 72 axles got the larger u-joints as well as 73 and up. The dana 60 appears in the late 70s under 1 tons. Steering correction is the same, i.e. raised arm or dropped pitman arm they are the same, 70 through 87 or 91(truck-suv).

[Scrubby]

Yes, they bolt right up. I have a '76 D44 under the front of my '72. Another nice thing that came with the newer axle was the stock steering stabilizer.

Good luck finding a cheap D60! 1969 GMC must have held someone at gunpoint to get one for $150. Going price is about $1000 for an axle that needs to be rebuilt. Atleast out here in Idaho.

[Grim Reaper]

Originally Posted by JIMs70GMC

Like Adam said, the axles will bolt right up. I was under the impression that the late 72 axles got the larger u-joints as well as 73 and up. The dana 60 appears in the late 70s under 1 tons. Steering correction is the same, i.e. raised arm or dropped pitman arm they are the same, 70 through 87 or 91(truck-suv).

I'm not positive of the date of change over but I kniow for a fact that it happend by 74. I have run across a few external hub 8lug D44's on 73's in junk yards. By 74 all were the internal hub so again another vote for that because it's easier to get parts for. Every Advance is going to have Warns that fit.

Any solid axles from a 1/2-1 ton up to 91 will bolt right in. I have heard that the 10 bolts from 78 up run larger wheel bearings so that might also be somethign to look at. The down side of the 10 bolts is no flat top knuckle if you want to do a cross over later.

[1969K10]

Ok, I probably should have started a new thread, but i'm looking for some help. As you can see from the grease, i need to install new axle seals. I've got (2) different questions. My hubs are different, the pass. is a Warn M-198. the driver side is a Warn M-4. I didn't do this. My first question is will the same hub tool work on both? My second question, is what is the plate at the bottom of the end with the (4) bolts, and what does it do? I have tried to attach pictures of both hubs, the first is the pass side (M-198), the 2nd is the driver side (M-4).

Thanks.

[charlieo]

That greasy old plate w/ the 4 bolts holds in a pivot pin (king pin)& a bearing (timken) for the turning of the knuckle .

[richardwilken]

so adam and jim, and everyone else; what you're saying is that 73 and newer D44 or D60 or 10 bolt will bolt right up without moving the spring perches? And the axle widths are the same? just making sure, because I remeber reading on here where people have said they have to weld the spring perches on in a new place. i only want to do this once and do it right. thanks for all your help. i may have found a 71 0r 72 D44. do you suggest going this route, or getting a 73 and newer one with larger u-joints?
Am i a pain in the a** or what!

[Scrubby]

Yes, the newer fronts bolt right up. I think they changed the distance between the spring perches on the rears in '73, so you might have read about someone swapping in a newer rear and having to move the spring perches.

[1969 GMC]

the rear axles are the only ones that will need the perches moved, and that is only on '73 and up 3/4 tons. the 1 tons are the same width as ours.

oh, and i didnt use a gun to get my d60 for $150. but for some reason, the same jy guy that wants $1600 for a running 454 and $25 for a mirror head only wanted $200 for the d60, and i talked it down to $150 but it needs a TOTAL rebuild.

[richardwilken]

thanks for all your help guys! any other suggestions?