how hard - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

toddtheodd · 05-03-2005, 05:09 PM

I've put off fixing the front suspension on my truck for too long, and now HAVE to fix it. I've gone to different places to get quotes, and the labor alone is over a grand.

I will not pay that.

So here is the deal. Am I getting in over my head???

What are the parts I'm replacing?
Inner and outer tie rod ends, tie rod adjusting sleeves, upper and lower ball joints, upper and lower control arm shaft kits, idler arm and pitman arm.
How many times have I done this before?
Not once.
I do have air tools and sockets and wrenches. Ball joint seperator and tie rod end puller. Do I need anything else other than a spring compressor?
My luck?
I changed the steering wheel on my truck and the ignition switch immediately went out, how's that for luck?

Todd

ksamps01 · 05-03-2005, 05:24 PM

You will need a ball joint press to push the lower ball joints out and back in. They have them to borrow at Auto Zone.

The lower Cross shaft can be a PITA but just keep at it. I did mine last year and I had never done it before either.

The job is not that bad. Just be patient and don't forget to get an alignment immediately after.

It is worth a weekend to save a grand. You can do it.

Elsie72 · 05-03-2005, 07:18 PM

I just finished doing most of that myself. The only things I outsourced were the installation of the ball joints, and the Idler and Pitman arm replacements, due to a lack of the proper tools. (puller, and ball joint tools). I wouldn't hesitate to go after it, as it's mostly just basic wrenching, parts swapping.

Pull the inner and outer tie-rods off as an assembly, and assemble the new parts on the bench, getting them as close to the same length as you can, that will ensure that you toe adjustment isn't too far out when you get it to a rack, and if you've got a floor jack, you can safely pull front springs without a spring compressor. Just loosen the upper and lower ball joint nuts, but don't remove, then put your jack under the lower ball joint, smoke the spindle where the ball joint shaft goes through with your choice of large hammer, and when the ball joint releases, bring the jack up to compress the spring, remove the lower ball joint nut, and slowly lower the jack. Reverse for install, minus the hitting with the hammer part.

sneakysnake · 05-03-2005, 07:37 PM

Jacks and secure stands,nothing worse than getting a truck on top of you.

Alexis · 05-03-2005, 07:51 PM

the suspensions on our trucks(coils) are cake.

GloryHound · 05-03-2005, 08:19 PM

It could really help to have a hot wrench for getting some of the older parts off, but it can be done without also!

cdyblu · 05-03-2005, 08:19 PM

Go for it!!!!

mr402 · 05-03-2005, 10:09 PM

I say go for it too.

It's not that difficult to do but it will take a little time. Once you've done one side the other will go twice as fast.

c10chevy69 · 05-03-2005, 10:39 PM

I just finished mine up after about 2 weekend of off and on working and parts chasing. I changed out the whole front end on my 69 and now I have power disc and five lugs all the way around. The rear axle was actually tougher to change out in my opinion. I used all basic hand tools, jackstands, and a floor jack. Not as tough as it looks. The hardest part for me was getting the 36 year old cotter pins out of the front end pieces. Good luck.

Peregrine · 05-03-2005, 10:50 PM

Mines turned into a 3 month drama fest. And all I was going to do was replace ball joints......

SCOTI · 05-03-2005, 11:44 PM

I did my 1st lowering job because of an insane quote for labor. That was back when I was 18/19yrs old.

I've done a 'few' since then & while it's basic R&R, it helps to know the tricks. I suggest having someone assist you that's done this before if you doubt your ability.

Perhaps you could barter w/a fellow board member in your area? Offer them cash, or parts for their guidance/help. You would spend much less than 1K & would gain significant knowledge on how your suspension/steering works (that knowledge alone is worth way more than a grand in the long run). Plus someone you trust would be doing the labor (you).

**Green Machine** · 05-03-2005, 11:59 PM

I replaced all of the parts myself except for the lower ball joints and lower A frame bushings. Basicly did the easy stuff myself, and farmed the rest out.

toddtheodd · 05-04-2005, 07:03 AM

I can't afford to farm anything out, hell, I can barely afford the parts alone.
I forgot to mention that I don't have a shop/garage to do this in since I live in some apartments.
This is also my daily driver, and so I can't have it turn into a 3 month ordeal either. (speaking of which, what the hell went wrong peregrine?)

I've actually hit the point where doing it is no longer a choice.

As far as board members that are close, no cash, but I have... uhh.... a th350 trans and some cast iron intake manifolds, 2 and 4 barrel, one of each.

Todd

Peregrine · 05-04-2005, 08:02 AM

hehe, sorry to scare you. When I tore my front end apart to replace the ball joints and put new spindles on I found out that my truck had hit something rather massive. The front bumper is a lil dented, the lower arm was bent bad, and there was a big impact point on a trailing arm (all of this are in line and looked like the guy hit a transmission just sitting in the middle of the road) I ordered some control arms, waited 3 months to get them and still havent got them yet and my truck is still on jack stands (read about it in the review forum about classic performace products). The thing is, I can't stand putting my truck back together in a way that won't make it perfect. I could get away ith putting that arms on untill I get new ones in, but it's still really dangerous and I wouldn't feel safe now that I know about it.

Without problems, it's not that hard of a job, but it would be rather hard to do in a apartments parking lot. Find someones garage that will let you use it for a day or two and you'll have it done in a weekend. If I was near you I'd tell you to bring er over and we'ed gett'er done

Big69C20 Toy · 05-04-2005, 08:19 AM

I'd say just make sure you get all the proper tools/parts ahead of time and have a 'helper' to make things go faster.

What EXACTLY is wrong with the front suspension that you need to do a full rebuild so fast... i'm asking because if it's your daily driver and you run into snags you'd be fubar and that's not cool.

As stated a weekend would suffice for all this ASSuming you get all the parts right and things come apart easily (projects can become entertaining sometimes).

67ChevyRedneck · 05-04-2005, 09:09 AM

BE CAREFULL with those coil springs. I used a spring compressor I "borrowed" from autozone. Some guys will tell you that you can use a good hydraulic jack, just be careful. I swapped a complete 67 suspension for a complete 71 disk brake suspension, but I tore it completely apart, repainted everything and replaced all the same parts you listed above. I'd never done it before (except for going to a friends garage for use of the ball joint comressor thingy) I did everything at home in the driveway. I then took it to be aligned. If your truck has never had this done you may need a grinder cause I'm pretty sure original upper ball joints had rivvets holding them in. I think there's only four of them and they grind out pretty easily.

toddtheodd · 05-04-2005, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big69C20 Toy

What EXACTLY is wrong with the front suspension that you need to do a full rebuild so fast... i'm asking because if it's your daily driver and you run into snags you'd be fubar and that's not cool.

I really must point out here that I am not a strong man, more fat than muscle, and therefore cannot even come close to exerting the kinds of pressure that driving would exert on these parts. Even still, my wimpy ass was able to do the following.
Upper control arm shafts have almost an inch of play. Lower ball joint on passenger side has over an inch. Upper ball joint on drivers side has almost an inch. I can wiggle my tires back and forth almost 2 inches.
My tires are not out of balance, and yet whenever I drive on smooth pavement it feels as if I am driving on gravel. I also have a lot of free play in my steering wheel, that is not due to the gear box. I've already gotten 98% of the free play out of that. I can hear stuff moving when I turn the wheel, but the wheels aren't turning until I take all of the slack out of the bad components.
When I take easy turns on the highway, it feels as if the inside tire on the turn is flopping around like a.... noodle.
If I hit even the smallest bump, it feels (and sounds) as if I just jumped my tuck over the grand canyon.

Sound pretty bad to anyone else? Because it sure as hell scares the crap out of me when I drive it.

Todd

toddtheodd · 05-04-2005, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 67ChevyRedneck

If your truck has never had this done you may need a grinder cause I'm pretty sure original upper ball joints had rivvets holding them in. I think there's only four of them and they grind out pretty easily.

Yes, the balljoints all looked to be originals.

toddtheodd · 05-04-2005, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toddtheodd

but I have... uhh.... a th350 trans and some cast iron intake manifolds, 2 and 4 barrel, one of each.

Nobody interested in the th350 huh?

Todd

1969K10 · 05-04-2005, 02:06 PM

Dude, go for it. I did the same thing on my '72 a few years ago (4?). got up early, and spent the entire day working on it. Well worth the time and the couple of busted knuckles!!! Had it in the alignment shop the next morning! the use of heat was a major help, but not required. Unfortunately, she got wrecked about 1 month after it was done. Had just bought new coil springs for the front... Never got them installed, they're still in the box in the garage

chickenwing · 05-04-2005, 02:43 PM

I did my c-20 except for the pitman arm. I couldn;t figure out how I would press the new one on. Was kinda leary of smacking it with a BFH and then using the nut to force it on. Farmed it out to a retired mechanic working out of his garage. Charged me 60 bucks and I supplied the part. The control arm shafts require a lot of torque for removal and installation. Have a nice cheater bar handy. I would recommend a 1/2" torque wrench for the installation. I'm kinda anal when it comes to torque specs. Everything else was a breeze.

**StingRay** · 05-04-2005, 05:09 PM

Have the right tools and it should be able to be done in a day. Two if you don't have the tools and have to go looking to buy or borrow them. As said the shafts can be a real pita. I got my shaft bushings off with the arms off of the truck by standing on one end of a 3/4 drive ratchet and pounding on the control arm with the other foot. You will need a pitman arm puller and some kind of press for the lower ball joints. Some guys pound them in and out but I wouldn't. You can buy a c clamp type press for on the vehicle use that works very well for under a hundred bucks.

View Poll Results: Am I getting in over my head by trying to fix my front suspension myself?
Too hard for you, pay the grand and have somebody else do it for you.	1	2.78%
Extremely hard, expect to cuss a lot and take two days.	4	11.11%
Just hard, expect some busted knuckles and about 10 hours.	11	30.56%
Moderately hard. 6 to 7 hours and a little cussing.	8	22.22%
Not too hard. 4 to 5 hours and you may scratch your head once or twice trying to figure something out.	5	13.89%
Not too hard at all. 3 hours tops, followed by complaining about how the mechanic was trying to rape you with his prices and how you saved a buttload of money.	4	11.11%
Dude, I could do this in 1 hour, blind, and with a broken arm.	3	8.33%
Voters: 36. You may not vote on this poll

05-03-2005, 05:09 PM	#1
toddtheodd The oddest Todd around Join Date: May 2004 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,418	how hard I've put off fixing the front suspension on my truck for too long, and now HAVE to fix it. I've gone to different places to get quotes, and the labor alone is over a grand. I will not pay that. So here is the deal. Am I getting in over my head??? What are the parts I'm replacing? Inner and outer tie rod ends, tie rod adjusting sleeves, upper and lower ball joints, upper and lower control arm shaft kits, idler arm and pitman arm. How many times have I done this before? Not once. I do have air tools and sockets and wrenches. Ball joint seperator and tie rod end puller. Do I need anything else other than a spring compressor? My luck? I changed the steering wheel on my truck and the ignition switch immediately went out, how's that for luck? Todd __________________ "The greatest pleasure is to vanquish your enemies and chase them before you, to rob them of their wealth and see those dear to them bathed in tears, to ride their horses and clasp to your bosom their wives and daughters." Ghengis Khan IIOY???

05-03-2005, 05:24 PM	#2
ksamps01 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Farmersville, TX - Northeast of Dallas Posts: 56	You will need a ball joint press to push the lower ball joints out and back in. They have them to borrow at Auto Zone. The lower Cross shaft can be a PITA but just keep at it. I did mine last year and I had never done it before either. The job is not that bad. Just be patient and don't forget to get an alignment immediately after. It is worth a weekend to save a grand. You can do it. __________________ 1967 Chevy LWB Fleetside 350/400 (Worn Smooth Out) Resto in progress It may be ugly but at least it's slow!!

05-03-2005, 07:18 PM	#3
Elsie72 Chinook Arch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: High River, Alberta, Canada Posts: 218	I just finished doing most of that myself. The only things I outsourced were the installation of the ball joints, and the Idler and Pitman arm replacements, due to a lack of the proper tools. (puller, and ball joint tools). I wouldn't hesitate to go after it, as it's mostly just basic wrenching, parts swapping. Pull the inner and outer tie-rods off as an assembly, and assemble the new parts on the bench, getting them as close to the same length as you can, that will ensure that you toe adjustment isn't too far out when you get it to a rack, and if you've got a floor jack, you can safely pull front springs without a spring compressor. Just loosen the upper and lower ball joint nuts, but don't remove, then put your jack under the lower ball joint, smoke the spindle where the ball joint shaft goes through with your choice of large hammer, and when the ball joint releases, bring the jack up to compress the spring, remove the lower ball joint nut, and slowly lower the jack. Reverse for install, minus the hitting with the hammer part. __________________ 1972 GMC 1500 Custom - Bought used by Grandpa in '74, currently back on the road after a long hiatus. Elsie's truck 2.5" dual exhaust with Hooker Aero Chambers Holley 670 Street Avenger Edelbrock Performer RPM on GMPP 290HP 350 ECE drop 3.5/5

05-03-2005, 10:09 PM	#8
mr402 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Elmira, Oregon Posts: 449	I say go for it too. It's not that difficult to do but it will take a little time. Once you've done one side the other will go twice as fast. __________________ Enjoying life again. Time to get those big blocks rolling.

05-03-2005, 07:37 PM	#4
sneakysnake It's a catastrophic success. Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 2,077	Jacks and secure stands,nothing worse than getting a truck on top of you.

05-03-2005, 07:51 PM	#5
Alexis Member since 2000 Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Mountain View Ca / Mexico Posts: 7,879	the suspensions on our trucks(coils) are cake.

05-03-2005, 08:19 PM	#6
GloryHound Working on a Nova. Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: ## Posts: 506	It could really help to have a hot wrench for getting some of the older parts off, but it can be done without also!

05-03-2005, 08:19 PM	#7
cdyblu Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Green Bay, WI Posts: 44	Go for it!!!!

05-03-2005, 10:39 PM	#9
c10chevy69 Registered User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 205	I just finished mine up after about 2 weekend of off and on working and parts chasing. I changed out the whole front end on my 69 and now I have power disc and five lugs all the way around. The rear axle was actually tougher to change out in my opinion. I used all basic hand tools, jackstands, and a floor jack. Not as tough as it looks. The hardest part for me was getting the 36 year old cotter pins out of the front end pieces. Good luck. __________________ 1969 chevy C10 long bed 350 4bbl auto p/disc and 5 lug

05-03-2005, 10:50 PM	#10
Peregrine Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Louisville, Ky Posts: 329	Mines turned into a 3 month drama fest. And all I was going to do was replace ball joints...... __________________ Brian 72 C10 longbed 350/th400 Let the world change you and you will change the world.

05-03-2005, 11:44 PM	#11
SCOTI Registered User Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: DALLAS,TX Posts: 21,946	I did my 1st lowering job because of an insane quote for labor. That was back when I was 18/19yrs old. I've done a 'few' since then & while it's basic R&R, it helps to know the tricks. I suggest having someone assist you that's done this before if you doubt your ability. Perhaps you could barter w/a fellow board member in your area? Offer them cash, or parts for their guidance/help. You would spend much less than 1K & would gain significant knowledge on how your suspension/steering works (that knowledge alone is worth way more than a grand in the long run). Plus someone you trust would be doing the labor (you). __________________ 67SWB-B.B.RetroRod 64SWB-Recycle 89CCDually-Driver/Tow Truck 99CCSWB Driver All Fleetsides @rattlecankustoms in IG Building a small, high rpm engine with the perfect bore, stroke and rod ratio is very impressive. It's like a highly skilled Morrocan sword fighter with a Damascus Steel Scimitar..... *Cubic inches is like Indiana Jones with a cheap pistol.* Last edited by SCOTI; 05-03-2005 at 11:44 PM.

05-03-2005, 11:59 PM	#12
Green Machine Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Estherville, Iowa Posts: 3,371	I replaced all of the parts myself except for the lower ball joints and lower A frame bushings. Basicly did the easy stuff myself, and farmed the rest out. __________________ 1968 C10 307 3spd Long Fleet ------ http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=201103 1970 C10 305 Super T10 Long Fleet --- http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=202285 1971 C20 383 TH350 Dana Posi ----- http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=206894 2001 GMC Sierra 1500 C3 6.0

05-04-2005, 07:03 AM	#13
toddtheodd The oddest Todd around Join Date: May 2004 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,418	I can't afford to farm anything out, hell, I can barely afford the parts alone. I forgot to mention that I don't have a shop/garage to do this in since I live in some apartments. This is also my daily driver, and so I can't have it turn into a 3 month ordeal either. (speaking of which, what the hell went wrong peregrine?) I've actually hit the point where doing it is no longer a choice. As far as board members that are close, no cash, but I have... uhh.... a th350 trans and some cast iron intake manifolds, 2 and 4 barrel, one of each. Todd __________________ "The greatest pleasure is to vanquish your enemies and chase them before you, to rob them of their wealth and see those dear to them bathed in tears, to ride their horses and clasp to your bosom their wives and daughters." Ghengis Khan IIOY???

05-04-2005, 08:02 AM	#14
Peregrine Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Louisville, Ky Posts: 329	hehe, sorry to scare you. When I tore my front end apart to replace the ball joints and put new spindles on I found out that my truck had hit something rather massive. The front bumper is a lil dented, the lower arm was bent bad, and there was a big impact point on a trailing arm (all of this are in line and looked like the guy hit a transmission just sitting in the middle of the road) I ordered some control arms, waited 3 months to get them and still havent got them yet and my truck is still on jack stands (read about it in the review forum about classic performace products). The thing is, I can't stand putting my truck back together in a way that won't make it perfect. I could get away ith putting that arms on untill I get new ones in, but it's still really dangerous and I wouldn't feel safe now that I know about it. Without problems, it's not that hard of a job, but it would be rather hard to do in a apartments parking lot. Find someones garage that will let you use it for a day or two and you'll have it done in a weekend. If I was near you I'd tell you to bring er over and we'ed gett'er done __________________ Brian 72 C10 longbed 350/th400 Let the world change you and you will change the world.



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05-04-2005, 08:19 AM	#15
Big69C20 Toy Livin' it up. Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Richland, MI Posts: 2,212	I'd say just make sure you get all the proper tools/parts ahead of time and have a 'helper' to make things go faster. What EXACTLY is wrong with the front suspension that you need to do a full rebuild so fast... i'm asking because if it's your daily driver and you run into snags you'd be fubar and that's not cool. As stated a weekend would suffice for all this ASSuming you get all the parts right and things come apart easily (projects can become entertaining sometimes). __________________ -Greg; Sold the 69 C20. It's off to a better home with more love! Now onto the 86 CUCV M1009; K5 blazer with 6.2L diesel, corp 10 bolt axles, Detroit locker in the rear, trutrac front, 3.73 gears, 35" tires.

05-04-2005, 09:09 AM	#16
67ChevyRedneck Hittin E-Z Street on Mud Tires Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 23,090	BE CAREFULL with those coil springs. I used a spring compressor I "borrowed" from autozone. Some guys will tell you that you can use a good hydraulic jack, just be careful. I swapped a complete 67 suspension for a complete 71 disk brake suspension, but I tore it completely apart, repainted everything and replaced all the same parts you listed above. I'd never done it before (except for going to a friends garage for use of the ball joint comressor thingy) I did everything at home in the driveway. I then took it to be aligned. If your truck has never had this done you may need a grinder cause I'm pretty sure original upper ball joints had rivvets holding them in. I think there's only four of them and they grind out pretty easily. __________________ Jesse James 1967 C10 SWB Stepside: 350/700R4/3.73 1965 Ford Mustang: 289/T5-5spd/3.25 Trac-Loc 1968 Pontiac Firebird: Project Fire Chicken! 2015 Silverado Double Cab 5.3L Z71 2001 Jeep Wrangler Sport 4.0L 5spd 2020 Chevrolet Equinox Premium 2.0L Turbo 2011 Mustang V6 ~ Wife's ride American Born, Country by the Grace of God 1967 CST Shop Truck Rebuild! My 1967 C-10 Build Thread My Vintage Air A/C Install Project "On a Dime" Trying my hand at Home Renovation! 1965 Mustang Modifications!

05-04-2005, 02:06 PM	#20
1969K10 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Clarks Hill, Indiana Posts: 733	Dude, go for it. I did the same thing on my '72 a few years ago (4?). got up early, and spent the entire day working on it. Well worth the time and the couple of busted knuckles!!! Had it in the alignment shop the next morning! the use of heat was a major help, but not required. Unfortunately, she got wrecked about 1 month after it was done. Had just bought new coil springs for the front... Never got them installed, they're still in the box in the garage __________________ 1969 K10 - V8, 465, 205, 12 bolt, D44 2002-current 1969 K20 - V8, 465, 221, Eaton, D44 2012-current Nothin' but drums on all 4 corners! past horses in the stable 72 C10-short step (97-02), 68 C10-long fleet (06-12)

05-04-2005, 02:43 PM	#21
chickenwing Lovin' Life in Miss.! Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Puckett, Mississippi Posts: 1,937	I did my c-20 except for the pitman arm. I couldn;t figure out how I would press the new one on. Was kinda leary of smacking it with a BFH and then using the nut to force it on. Farmed it out to a retired mechanic working out of his garage. Charged me 60 bucks and I supplied the part. The control arm shafts require a lot of torque for removal and installation. Have a nice cheater bar handy. I would recommend a 1/2" torque wrench for the installation. I'm kinda anal when it comes to torque specs. Everything else was a breeze. __________________ The truck... you hear that? No really, you did hear that?!!!

05-04-2005, 05:09 PM	#22
StingRay Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Saskatoon,SK,Canada Posts: 2,476	Have the right tools and it should be able to be done in a day. Two if you don't have the tools and have to go looking to buy or borrow them. As said the shafts can be a real pita. I got my shaft bushings off with the arms off of the truck by standing on one end of a 3/4 drive ratchet and pounding on the control arm with the other foot. You will need a pitman arm puller and some kind of press for the lower ball joints. Some guys pound them in and out but I wouldn't. You can buy a c clamp type press for on the vehicle use that works very well for under a hundred bucks. __________________ Saskatoon, Saskatchewan Canada

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