What did they do? - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

Ilike 72"s · 07-28-2007, 05:46 PM

Hey, Everybody. I have a question for ya.
I just bought a guys project for $1000 and hauled it home. It is a 4 speed truck, But he replaced the engine and installed an automatic. Whats going on with the cross member. Look at the spacers between the frame and cross member. Is it the wrong adapter, cross member or both??

67Fleet · 07-28-2007, 06:14 PM

Looks like some back-woods engineering for sure. Not the safest setup IMO

msgross · 07-28-2007, 06:23 PM

I would post this in the 4x4 section, sure to get answers there. That crossmember is the same as my 4speed one (like in your bed). The TC shouldn't be hanging that low either....

teeitup · 07-28-2007, 06:58 PM

Looks like a 203 transfer to me, not original 205.

ckhd · 07-28-2007, 07:03 PM

It's the right adapter for a TH350 & NP205 combo. However, it looks like the 4-speed crossmember. The transfer case looks too new too. Also, on the side of your t-case, those two big holes near the frame, are for a bracket that bolts up right there. You may be able to find the right crossmember and t-case bracket and get it to line up right, but who knows for sure with the different t-case in there.

Ilike 72"s · 07-28-2007, 07:29 PM

You say it should have a 205, but you think it's a 203 transfer case.How can you tell? Whats the obvious?

**68 Stepside** · 07-28-2007, 07:41 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe conduit unions used as spacers might just be a bad idea

Here's the only link I could find to TC identification in my bookmarks. The pictures suck pretty badly, but maybe it'll help. Perhaps you could get some better pictures of the setup that's under the truck, I know that would help out the members who know the 4x4 stuff well.

Also, what are the details on the new ride?

Ilike 72"s · 07-28-2007, 08:00 PM

Your link didn't show up. Can I somehow move this thread to the 4x4 section, or just start over?

msgross · 07-28-2007, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 68 Stepside

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe conduit unions used as spacers might just be a bad idea

no doubt, I used old shackles for my spacers... but they were for the skid plate crossmember that holds no weight!

**Classic Heartbeat** · 07-28-2007, 08:24 PM

Man that thing is all kinds of messed up. Nothing that I see about it is correct!! You couldn't even hook up the front driveline. If you look at the 2 holes in the transfer case, they should be lining up with the 2 holes in the frame. There is a, "L" bracket that bolts to the frame there that the transfer case side bracket bolts to. (All with rubber mounts mind you) the one under the truck looks like a 203 to me also. The rear driveline output shaft is one way of telling. The one that is in the back of the truck is a 205. The crossmember looks wrong and you do not have the side brace either. Come on up to my shop and I have the whole works that you need. (Tranny, transfer case, side brace, and crossmember.) $450.00 WES www.ClassicHeartbeat.com

neonlarry · 07-28-2007, 08:44 PM

Try this link for I.D. :
http://www.chuckschevytruckpages.com/drivetrains.html

Ilike 72"s · 07-28-2007, 09:32 PM

That helps alot, it's a 203. The 205 in the bed was probably the origional that went behind the 4 speed. Are the manual and automatic 205 different, or can I put it behind this auto?

EAST SIDE LOW LIFE · 07-28-2007, 09:56 PM

[QUOTE=67Fleet;2283161]Looks like some back-woods engineering for sure. Not the safest setup IMO[/QUOTE]

**********************************************************

X2

Couldn't agree more! Those spacers are cast plumbing fixtures. What was the P?O thinking???

esll.

*screamin_eagle* · 07-28-2007, 10:08 PM

uh was the previous owner an electrician? why not just put a four speed back in it?

chipflyer · 07-28-2007, 10:13 PM

Maybe a low hump (originally automatic) cab? The Tcase would have to be lowered about that much or it would hit the floor, right?

Jeff

ckhd · 07-28-2007, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilike 72"s

Are the manual and automatic 205 different, or can I put it behind this auto?

The auto/manual 205s are different. They have a different input shaft spline count, which is probably why he used a 203 that fit instead of the 205 that was made for the stick. Count the splines of the one in the back. My memory is starting to fail me, but it seems that the manual has 10 splines and the auto has 32. I could be wrong, but that's what popped into my head when I though about it.

The spacer between them is also different. The auto spacer looks like the one you have, and there is probably a manual spacer in the back of the pickup with the old t-case.

cameeks · 07-29-2007, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilike 72"s

Your link didn't show up. Can I somehow move this thread to the 4x4 section, or just start over?

I posted this so the mods can move it for you. Sorry I cant add some info because I'm not up to speed on the 4wd's

72 CustomCamper · 07-29-2007, 02:18 AM

The 4spd trans in the bed is a 2 wheel drive trans...

Chuck

**Bob B.** · 07-29-2007, 03:22 AM

I'll bet that plastic tub in the bed was full of beer when that job was started!

68K20 x Drill · 07-29-2007, 04:00 AM

These links show the different flavors your tcases come in.http://www.high-impact.net/transmiss...case_NP203.htm
http://www.high-impact.net/transmiss...case_NP205.htm

That looks like a normal 205 crossmember, and the '73 with a 203 in my yard looks the same.

Whats the front suspension and motor mounts look like?
Cute truck BTW.

I don't think you can bolt any trans to a transfer case using the wrong spacer, although the TH400 one comes in tall and short flavors...tall using the crossmember like you have.

To toss in a bit more confusion, when I switched my truck from a Rockwell to NP205 with a 1 piece driveshaft, I had to notch a crossmember (and shorten my '74 driveshaft)

What do the front suspension and motor mounts look like?
Cute truck BTW

royo · 07-29-2007, 08:15 AM

10 spline -4 speed 27 spline turbo350 w 205 has spud shaft 203 bolts right up to t350 t400 has32 spline

Ilike 72"s · 07-29-2007, 04:42 PM

You guys have been a big help. The guy I bought this from said his dad bought this pickup new. California pickup that got USED.He told me It had a different engine and trans, but from there -- it sat for years. My plans are to do a frame up, but I wanted to know what I had. Question was why not go back to a 4 speed. The older I get, more I like automatic. Someone ask if it was a high hump. Is that just the removable hump, or is under the seat part of the cab different also? More pictures.

Ilike 72"s · 07-29-2007, 04:45 PM

more

msgross · 07-29-2007, 05:28 PM

Is that a nut on the bolt into the header? (forward most right side bolt?) Whomever did this is a sure hack....

That's the transmission crossmember in the bed along with the two smaller pieces that go to the top frame rail! He might have used the skid plate crossmember for the tranny. I would start by tearing the truck apart down to bare frame like I did. Who know how many corners have been but by the PO. Check out my build thread for a pic of how the 4speed crossmembers look with a skid plate.

If you have two of those front tow hooks then you just made a few hundred bucks on your purchase! I would leave them welded on...

Robert1970C20rstbukt · 07-29-2007, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by msgross

If you have two of those front tow hooks then you just made a few hundred bucks on your purchase! I would leave them welded on...

That's EXACTLY what I was thinking!

07-28-2007, 05:46 PM	#1
Ilike 72"s Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: eastern oregon Posts: 623	What did they do? Hey, Everybody. I have a question for ya. I just bought a guys project for $1000 and hauled it home. It is a 4 speed truck, But he replaced the engine and installed an automatic. Whats going on with the cross member. Look at the spacers between the frame and cross member. Is it the wrong adapter, cross member or both?? Attached Images

07-28-2007, 06:14 PM	#2
67Fleet Outlandish Trends - FL Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Orlando Posts: 1,396	Re: What did they do? Looks like some back-woods engineering for sure. Not the safest setup IMO __________________ -Bret 67 short-fleet sold!

07-28-2007, 06:23 PM	#3
msgross Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Central PA Posts: 12,201	Re: What did they do? I would post this in the 4x4 section, sure to get answers there. That crossmember is the same as my 4speed one (like in your bed). The TC shouldn't be hanging that low either.... __________________ The Garage: 1968 K-10 SWB - "Project Money Pit" 1996 Z-71 - "huntin rig" 1969 C-10 LWB (SOLD) "Project flip that truck or else" 1993 Passport, F@rd 1-ton (SOLD)"Project Cousin Eddie" My Garage Build "The 1,000 footer"

07-28-2007, 06:58 PM	#4
teeitup Just like to part out trucks!! Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Meriden, Ks-North of Topeka 10 miles Posts: 27,395	Re: What did they do? Looks like a 203 transfer to me, not original 205. __________________ 67 Chev swb stepside 4x4 283 4 speed SOLD 72 blazer 4x4 4 speed Cheyenne 72 GMC swb 4x4 fleet 4 speed, original paint 1958 Cameo (one of 1405 built, it was my dads) 2020 chevy Apex 4x4 crew cab 1969 Z28 with the 302 1980 chevy swb 4x4 1964 chevell Malibu SS 1976 K20, sold new originally out of my dads chevy dealership Members that I've met, over 200 probably closer to 300 in the 12 years I've been on this site, everyone I met "It was a pleasure"

07-28-2007, 07:03 PM	#5
ckhd Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: St. Johns, Arizona Posts: 2,660	Re: What did they do? It's the right adapter for a TH350 & NP205 combo. However, it looks like the 4-speed crossmember. The transfer case looks too new too. Also, on the side of your t-case, those two big holes near the frame, are for a bracket that bolts up right there. You may be able to find the right crossmember and t-case bracket and get it to line up right, but who knows for sure with the different t-case in there. __________________ my 2¢ - t.i.o.l.i. Bowen 1968 K20 fleet 1969 K10 swb fleet 1972 K10 Suburban 1972 C10 lwb step 1992 K1500 'burb 1995 K2500 'burb 1997 C1500 'burb 1999 K1500 2000 K1500 'burb Why do I own so many Suburbans? Last edited by ckhd; 07-28-2007 at 07:04 PM.

07-28-2007, 07:29 PM	#6
Ilike 72"s Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: eastern oregon Posts: 623	Re: What did they do? You say it should have a 205, but you think it's a 203 transfer case.How can you tell? Whats the obvious?

07-28-2007, 07:41 PM	#7
68 Stepside huh? Join Date: May 2000 Location: Washington, Illinois Posts: 5,690	Re: What did they do? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe conduit unions used as spacers might just be a bad idea Here's the only link I could find to TC identification in my bookmarks. The pictures suck pretty badly, but maybe it'll help. Perhaps you could get some better pictures of the setup that's under the truck, I know that would help out the members who know the 4x4 stuff well. Also, what are the details on the new ride? __________________ Someday when I'm lonely, Wishing you weren't so far away, Then I will remember Things we said today. RIP El Jay

07-28-2007, 08:00 PM	#8
Ilike 72"s Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: eastern oregon Posts: 623	Re: What did they do? Your link didn't show up. Can I somehow move this thread to the 4x4 section, or just start over?

07-28-2007, 08:24 PM	#10
Classic Heartbeat Project Junkie! Fishing Poor!! Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Olympia,Wa. 98512 Posts: 10,766	Re: What did they do? Man that thing is all kinds of messed up. Nothing that I see about it is correct!! You couldn't even hook up the front driveline. If you look at the 2 holes in the transfer case, they should be lining up with the 2 holes in the frame. There is a, "L" bracket that bolts to the frame there that the transfer case side bracket bolts to. (All with rubber mounts mind you) the one under the truck looks like a 203 to me also. The rear driveline output shaft is one way of telling. The one that is in the back of the truck is a 205. The crossmember looks wrong and you do not have the side brace either. Come on up to my shop and I have the whole works that you need. (Tranny, transfer case, side brace, and crossmember.) $450.00 WES www.ClassicHeartbeat.com __________________ On-line catolog Classic Heartbeat Pickup Parts WEHEPP@comcast.net Call us Toll Free (888) 338-2502 Like Us on Facebook No appointment necessary. 72 BB Chevy Custom Deluxe / Custom Camper 67 I-6 (Soon to be 5.7 LS1) Panel 68 BB Chevy Short Bed 72 6.0 LQ9 Short Bed Chevy 4X4 Olympia's fastest growing truck parts supplier. Olympia's home for Wayward Chevys

07-28-2007, 08:44 PM	#11
neonlarry Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Vacaville, CA Posts: 2,745	Re: What did they do? Try this link for I.D. : http://www.chuckschevytruckpages.com/drivetrains.html __________________ 70 C/10 Light Red 350/TH350, HEI, Duals w/40 series Flows, 91 seat, LED taillights 99 Pontiac S/C GTP, SLP Ram Air hood, GMPP Konis & springs 95 Neon ACR, MP PCM, AFX UDP, 3.0 CAI

07-28-2007, 09:32 PM	#12
Ilike 72"s Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: eastern oregon Posts: 623	Re: What did they do? That helps alot, it's a 203. The 205 in the bed was probably the origional that went behind the 4 speed. Are the manual and automatic 205 different, or can I put it behind this auto?

07-28-2007, 09:56 PM	#13
EAST SIDE LOW LIFE Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: VANCOUVER ISLAND, B.C., Canada Posts: 1,602	Re: What did they do? [QUOTE=67Fleet;2283161]Looks like some back-woods engineering for sure. Not the safest setup IMO[/QUOTE] ******************************************************** X2 Couldn't agree more! Those spacers are cast plumbing fixtures. What was the P?O thinking??? esll. __________________ Tomorrow is for doing today's stuff. *********************************** This truck has just the right amount of energy for me! Author: Warren Lake .... (member) Last edited by EAST SIDE LOW LIFE; 07-29-2007 at 02:04 AM.

07-28-2007, 10:08 PM	#14
screamin_eagle Account Suspended Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 114	Re: What did they do? uh was the previous owner an electrician? why not just put a four speed back in it?

07-28-2007, 10:13 PM	#15
chipflyer Registered User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Topeka, Ks Posts: 2,293	Re: What did they do? Maybe a low hump (originally automatic) cab? The Tcase would have to be lowered about that much or it would hit the floor, right? Jeff __________________ I'm not a pessimist, I'm just optimistic that bad things are going to happen. 1971 Cheyenne Super K10 - tilt, cruise, air, am/fm, tow hooks, factory buckets! 1986 Jeep J10 pickup, - 5.3L Vortec with 4L60e and NP241. Last edited by chipflyer; 07-28-2007 at 10:15 PM.

07-29-2007, 02:18 AM	#18
72 CustomCamper huh ??? Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Fredericksburg,Va. Posts: 3,368	Re: What did they do? The 4spd trans in the bed is a 2 wheel drive trans... Chuck __________________ 90 Blazer Silverado 350w/ 700R4 and 32" Kelly's "I am a bomb technician. If you see me running try to keep up!"



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07-29-2007, 03:22 AM	#19
Bob B. Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,369	Re: What did they do? I'll bet that plastic tub in the bed was full of beer when that job was started! __________________ 1967 GMC CM-2500 Camper Cruiser, 351E V-6, NP 435 4 speed, Dana 60, and factory A/C. 2012 GMC K-3500 WT regular cab, 6.0L Vortec, 6L90.

07-29-2007, 04:00 AM	#20
68K20 x Drill Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Freedom CA Posts: 488	Re: What did they do? These links show the different flavors your tcases come in.http://www.high-impact.net/transmiss...case_NP203.htm http://www.high-impact.net/transmiss...case_NP205.htm That looks like a normal 205 crossmember, and the '73 with a 203 in my yard looks the same. Whats the front suspension and motor mounts look like? Cute truck BTW. I don't think you can bolt any trans to a transfer case using the wrong spacer, although the TH400 one comes in tall and short flavors...tall using the crossmember like you have. To toss in a bit more confusion, when I switched my truck from a Rockwell to NP205 with a 1 piece driveshaft, I had to notch a crossmember (and shorten my '74 driveshaft) What do the front suspension and motor mounts look like? Cute truck BTW __________________ 68 Chevrolet k20 Longbed 350 SM465/205, Dana 44, 14bolt, Power steering, Power Disk Brakes, 35" BFGs. 84 Chevrolet Suburban K20 6.2 Banks turbo TH400/NP208 Now with G80 68 GMC C20 Parts? Truck And a few cars Last edited by 68K20 x Drill; 07-29-2007 at 04:01 AM.

07-29-2007, 08:15 AM	#21
royo Registered User Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: knoxville tn Posts: 1,013	Re: What did they do? 10 spline -4 speed 27 spline turbo350 w 205 has spud shaft 203 bolts right up to t350 t400 has32 spline __________________ nickle and dime

07-29-2007, 04:42 PM	#22
Ilike 72"s Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: eastern oregon Posts: 623	Re: What did they do? You guys have been a big help. The guy I bought this from said his dad bought this pickup new. California pickup that got USED.He told me It had a different engine and trans, but from there -- it sat for years. My plans are to do a frame up, but I wanted to know what I had. Question was why not go back to a 4 speed. The older I get, more I like automatic. Someone ask if it was a high hump. Is that just the removable hump, or is under the seat part of the cab different also? More pictures. Attached Images

07-29-2007, 04:45 PM	#23
Ilike 72"s Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: eastern oregon Posts: 623	Re: What did they do? more Attached Images

07-29-2007, 05:28 PM	#24
msgross Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Central PA Posts: 12,201	Re: What did they do? Is that a nut on the bolt into the header? (forward most right side bolt?) Whomever did this is a sure hack.... That's the transmission crossmember in the bed along with the two smaller pieces that go to the top frame rail! He might have used the skid plate crossmember for the tranny. I would start by tearing the truck apart down to bare frame like I did. Who know how many corners have been but by the PO. Check out my build thread for a pic of how the 4speed crossmembers look with a skid plate. If you have two of those front tow hooks then you just made a few hundred bucks on your purchase! I would leave them welded on... __________________ The Garage: 1968 K-10 SWB - "Project Money Pit" 1996 Z-71 - "huntin rig" 1969 C-10 LWB (SOLD) "Project flip that truck or else" 1993 Passport, F@rd 1-ton (SOLD)"Project Cousin Eddie" My Garage Build "The 1,000 footer" Last edited by msgross; 07-29-2007 at 05:29 PM.

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