Bad Motor, what are my options

[Austin C10]

My 350 small block seems shot. At the least it needs a valve job, but might also need rings. There has been lots of pinging, buring oil and water, fouled plugs, loss of compression, and backfiring through the carb. I either need to move on or get it up and running. So I need a little advice.

First of all, I'm pretty limited on replacing the motor myself. Just not going to happen at this time in my life. Would it be better to get something stock and have a good engine shop replace it, or should I consider having the current motor rebuilt?

The latter option has a certain appeal as I might be able to add some performance enhancements. What should I consider when it comes to performance upgrades?

With either of these options, I'm in the San Fran Bay area. Anyone know of good resources (machine shop, engine shop, salvage/junk yards) up here?

And lastly, what are the options for someone who just doesn't have the time/money and wants to get out from underneath this? I hate this option, b/c my family has a love affair with this truck, and I've already spent some time/money (including a trans rebuild) on it.

['68 longbed]

sounds like a "should I fix it or sell it " kind of question!

I managed to do a motor change with little tools no help and in a campground on a four day weekend. with a 600 dollar junkyard motor. don't underestimate what you can pull off.

['68 longbed]

oh and with the junkyard swap I ended up with almost 2 grand in it by the time I was done . that includes multiple trips to the parts store, changing all the pumps, timing chane, fresh distributor, i bought a complete engine gasket kit to save me the hassle of looking for misc. gaskets, paint, fluids, plugs wires cap and rotor, and a misc. assortment kit of bolts came in handy too.

just fyi. i

f you have the time and the parts layin around you may want to consider a crate motor. i was in a hurry and had to have it on the road to get back and forth to work. in the end it may have cost more but time was an issue.

[Austin C10]

I think that the rebuild is going to take too long and my wife, the CFO of our family gave me the thumbs up on replace v. sell.

I'm looking at the GM 290, 260, and 330HO. I'll probably get the best mileage out of the 260, right? But the 290 and 330HO would be the most fun. What type of drop off in mileage would I expect from the 260 to the 290/330?

Should I expect to replace the water pump on any of these to push more water? What about any other upgrades that might be necessary? e.g. bigger oil pump?

Any tip would be welcome at this point. This project will get things going, probably repaint the firewall while the engine is out.

[OLDIRON69]

I'd replace the water pump, oil pump, both with high volume. I'd do that even with a stock motor. I just bought a 30 over 350 rblt long block and went high volume all the way. There are only a few bucks difference and well worth it.

On the motors, I was looking at a GM crate motor that advertise 5/50,000 warranty...COOL..buy it....WRONG. Dealer said only if installed by GM! 12mo/12,000 if done by someone else. They wanted 2K to install their motor and mine was already out! What a crock of $hit. I can buy 4 more rblt long blocks and still be out less money!

[rophle1]

If you can't rebuild it yourself, I'd just check with a parts store like Advance, O'Reilly's, Autozone ect. and get one of their rebuilt engines. They have 350's which you can just drop right in with no problem. All you'd have to do is swap over the bolt-on items like the alternator and carb. If you can't do that yourself, find a mechanic in your area that you trust and he should be able to change it over in less that a day.

[Austin C10]

Originally Posted by rophle1

If you can't rebuild it yourself, I'd just check with a parts store like Advance, O'Reilly's, Autozone ect. and get one of their rebuilt engines. They have 350's which you can just drop right in with no problem. All you'd have to do is swap over the bolt-on items like the alternator and carb. If you can't do that yourself, find a mechanic in your area that you trust and he should be able to change it over in less that a day.

That was my first instinct, but their engines weren't exactly cheap. I checked a couple of places, including Napa, which my neighbor manages. Well, the price with core exchange was not all that far off something a little high-performance.

[piecesparts]

Should you consider a rebuilt motor from a supplier? In my area, the suppliers (autoparts outlets) will sell a motor for around $800.00 to $1000.00, depending on the quality. A NEW motor, from Chevrolet, is around $1500.00 and is exactly that ---A NEW direct replacement motor not some far away shop's idea of bolting a motor together with whatever amount of slop that they deem adequate for a rebuild. I mean slop in the clearances in the bearings and piston gaps, Valve grind quality, or even oil pump quality ( how about a crank journal one size and the others all another size or even a piston that is bored .060 over and the others are at the standard bore--been there and seen it). I say this because of longevity issues that I and some of my friends have experienced in the last few years with the rebuilt motors. We won't go there again, in the near future. I would spend the extra bucks for a replacement motor that stands up to normal driving and will take your intake and other parts without problem. If you desire to bump the performance later, the motor stands up to it and will give you a 100.000 miles plus without problem. I have installed a couple for myself and put many in, while working at the County Highway shop that i used to work at.

[Billla]

I think you're on the right course with factory crate engine - it's the cheapest, lowest-risk option. Figure an overhaul at about $2K unless you get really lucky. IMHO, I'd stick with the 260HP.

IMHO, I'd swap over all the stuff from your current engine. A water pump is an easy swap later. Spend as little money as possible right now to get the thing running - and you can upgrade when money permits later. I've seen a lot of these go bad from "while I'm in there" kind of thinking.

I absolutely wouldn't put on a high-volume oil pump. These are crutches for older engines or racing engines with opened clearances - for a street engine they're not needed and steal HP. Also - you'd need to install the pump and pickup...and if you haven't done that before it's an easy place to make a mistake.

[Austin C10]

If I go with a replacement (e.g. a crate motor), is there an advantage to going with a mail order or a local sale? It seems the ones on the internet are cheaper than what I am finding locally.

Other than JEGS and Jasper, can anyone recommend any other vendors?

By the way, I've relocated to the SF Bay area if anyone has any recommendations for up here.

[retodd7711]

http://www.precisionengine.com/rebui...gmc/index.html
This is just a place I was looking at.
For information and comparison purposes only.
I haven't bought anything from them.

['68 longbed]

NEVER USE PARTS STORE MOTORS!! they cost nearly as much as a gm crate motor and I know at least a dozen people who had horrible problems with them. depending on the supplier they often just "fix" not "rebuild"

[bad6772]

id say go with a crate engine from Chevrolet. i put my ZZ3 in about 4 years ago. it came complete carb to the oil pan, and packed 345 horse out of the box. And at that time you could by a extended warranty also. i baught a the ZZ3 and the 3 year 36 thousand mile warranty and was in total for about $3000.00. it has yet to see 36 thousand. but i ran out on years. they also aloowed me to do things to the engine that would not void the warranty,as far a fuel pump upgrades and changed the dist. about a year ago i had the heads ported and polished, and also had the intake port matched to the heads and polished. it runs real strong, knowing guys that still work for a chevrolet dealership. there isnt a big differnce in the bottom end of the blocks, with some head work maybe later on you could buy the 260 horse engine now, and do some upgrades as time and money permitted.........just my two cents...........tony

[Billla]

Your safest bet is the GM factory engines. Many other crate engine companies (Edelbrock, Pace, etc.) use the GM shortblock. That's not to say that the local rebuilders can't be good, but I've worked with 20+ of these from vendors all over the map and the GM engines are universally pretty good. Also, they're usually available at your dealer...so you can just go down and pick it up with no shipping. GM lists their "high performance" dealers that more commonly have this stuff in stock and offer "trade price".

There are a few things that need to be done before installation that aren't in the docs that make for a better experience, such as lubing the front and rear seals.

You could always buy the GM shortblock, then put on upgraded cam, heads and intake...but when you're on a limited budget this stuff adds up quickly! Remember that you can always make changes later...

[piecesparts]

The direct replacement 350 engine is about as cheap as you can go. I had one that ran 80,000 in one truck and then another 50,000 in another truck without problem. I replaced it with another 350 just like it and my Son's truck is running great. I took the chance and upgraded my cam and put on an Edelbrock intake, as I put it in (that will end the warranty but it was worth the extra hump in the driving of it. The truck rates around 300 HP and is very stout on the street. As I said the price for these is around $1500.00 from GM Performance Parts and is easy to deal with.

[retselgerg]

GO CRATE, i went throught what you are going through and me and my girlfriend weighed my options and we both decided a goodwrench grate was by far my best bet. sounds like it maybe yours 2,

[N2TRUX]

Originally Posted by Austin C10

.....
Other than JEGS and Jasper, can anyone recommend any other vendors?
....

First off, if your knowledge, time and tools are limited forget rebuilding it. There in no way you can get around the advantages of a GM crate motor.
Shop around the internet for the best deal, then call Summit Racing and have them match the price and throw in the free shipping. You end up with a dyno tested package from GM. You can not beat that deal....

[Pyrotechnic]

The good ol' 260HP Goodwrench 350 would be your best bet. The 290HP version is the exact same motor with a different cam.

[lazybra1n]

I'd go w/ the 260HP crate from GM also. Especially if you're on a budget. They DO run almost forever and they ARE way better than a "parts store" motor. Rent an engine hoist- thats the only way you'll get the old one out. Swap accessories off of your old motor; clean em up- maybe a fresh coat of paint- thats cheap!; new mounts. put 'em on the crate motor and drive it for a while. You could probably do it yourself even w/ limited tools. Good luck and keep us posted...

[63 & 64 Bowties]

I don't know if this is just a "local custom" or if there's something like this going on in SanFran, but there's a couple junk yards around here that sell used motors INSTALLED. The junk yard acutally teams up with a local repair shop to do the install. You drive/tow your car to the junkyard, pay a set price to the junkyard, they send their used motor and your car to the repair shop, the shop installs it. The nice part about this set-up, the junkyard guarantees the motor. So, they have a real incentive to pick a good motor for you, it's not real expensive and if the alternator, starter, etc are bad on the motor, that's the junkyard's problem, not yours.

['68 longbed]

Originally Posted by 63 & 64 Bowties

I don't know if this is just a "local custom" or if there's something like this going on in SanFran, but there's a couple junk yards around here that sell used motors INSTALLED. The junk yard acutally teams up with a local repair shop to do the install. You drive/tow your car to the junkyard, pay a set price to the junkyard, they send their used motor and your car to the repair shop, the shop installs it. The nice part about this set-up, the junkyard guarantees the motor. So, they have a real incentive to pick a good motor for you, it's not real expensive and if the alternator, starter, etc are bad on the motor, that's the junkyard's problem, not yours.

thats a great idea. probably worth it for a junkyard since the biggest problem for customers is finding a way to get the motors swapped. I'd settle for a set price to just pull the old motor and set the new one in!

trailor the vehicle back home make the connections and GO!

[jhow66]

Originally Posted by Billla

I think you're on the right course with factory crate engine - it's the cheapest, lowest-risk option. Figure an overhaul at about $2K unless you get really lucky. IMHO, I'd stick with the 260HP.

IMHO, I'd swap over all the stuff from your current engine. A water pump is an easy swap later. Spend as little money as possible right now to get the thing running - and you can upgrade when money permits later. I've seen a lot of these go bad from "while I'm in there" kind of thinking.

I absolutely wouldn't put on a high-volume oil pump. These are crutches for older engines or racing engines with opened clearances - for a street engine they're not needed and steal HP. Also - you'd need to install the pump and pickup...and if you haven't done that before it's an easy place to make a mistake.

[72 68 andmore]

This is funny because I was just talking to my buddy who put a GM crate the 260 in a snow plow truck a few years ago. He beat the hell out of it. He sold it for 900 bucks and well I think he paid 1500. He put almost 100g miles on it. The guy who bought it just threw it in an older camaro and dynoed it and got 250 at the rear wheels. All the compression was good and even. He feels he got a good buy. I forgot my buddy did a cam upgrade a year after he got it. I never understood, it was a snow plow truck. I had an 85 that could plow circles around his hot rod

[Sinister]

I would tend to agree on the GM crate motor. Before I new any better, I had a remanufactured motor put in my '72, it lasted all of 10,000 miles.

['68 longbed]

as for the high flow pumps, I've been told by those much smarter than myself and who are very knowlegable that high flow water and oil pumps negate much of the natural cooling ability of the fluids. if the oil and water get crammed back into the motor very quickly then they don't have a chance to shed as much heat.

like said above, they are a crutch for motors that are on their way out of service when you can't maintain pressure.