Transfer Case is Out - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 12:44 AM

Got the transfer case out today. PO told me the adapter was cracked and leaking trans fluid into the transfer case.
I think maybe the seals are bad since the adapter appears to be in good shape. I think I'll rebuild the trans while I'm in this far.

Made a little fixture with some angle iron and the welder to keep the TC under control on the floor jack.

72armyswbtruck · 11-13-2007, 12:55 AM

Thats pretty snazzy

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72armyswbtruck

Thats pretty snazzy

Not really, just functional. Welds are kind of ugly as it's been awhile since I've have the nee to run the mig welder. Did the job though.

earl87gta · 11-13-2007, 02:59 AM

thats a cool idea I aways lower them down through the trans cover with my engine hoist.

**jaros44sr** · 11-13-2007, 06:38 AM

Nice work. How is that flooring to roll a floor jack and a creeper around on? I was thinking of that stuff or painting my floor

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by earl87gta

thats a cool idea I aways lower them down through the trans cover with my engine hoist.

Thanks. I had to do something since I wasn't going to try to bench press the TC.

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaros44sr

Nice work. How is that flooring to roll a floor jack and a creeper around on? I was thinking of that stuff or painting my floor

I used to epoxy paint my garage floors. Every time I moved I had to leave it behind.
The floor jack rolls ok on the floor and it's not so hard and cold like the concrete. The one drawback is that you'll need to put something under the floorjack to spread out the load when you raise a vehicle and the same goes for under the jackstands. i've rolled a complete Corvair driveline out before on that same jack with no problems.

**jaros44sr** · 11-13-2007, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdflstf

I used to epoxy paint my garage floors. Every time I moved I had to leave it behind.
The floor jack rolls ok on the floor and it's not so hard and cold like the concrete. The one drawback is that you'll need to put something under the floorjack to spread out the load when you raise a vehicle and the same goes for under the jackstands. i've rolled a complete Corvair driveline out before on that same jack with no problems.

Thanks for the input, I wasn't sure if it would handle a load. Looks really nice!! At least this time you can take your floor with you

My floor really takes a beating, chucks of rust and metal, plus the usual grease and other liquids. My truck is on rollers so I don't think they would work[ small workshop]

I also just dropped my TC last week, leaky seal. Spent 2 weeks derusting frame, cleaning up crossmember and other stuff. Almost ready to put it back in...mind if I post up a pic. of mine coming out?

BTW, you have one really nice truck, well 2, but I mean the old one. J.

BTWW, welcome to the boards from Philly, Pa.

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaros44sr

Thanks for the input, I wasn't sure if it would handle a load. Looks really nice!! At least this time you can take your floor with you

My floor really takes a beating, chucks of rust and metal, plus the usual grease and other liquids. My truck is on rollers so I don't think they would work[ small workshop]

I also just dropped my TC last week, leaky seal. Spent 2 weeks derusting frame, cleaning up crossmember and other stuff. Almost ready to put it back in...mind if I post up a pic. of mine coming out?

BTW, you have one really nice truck, well 2, but I mean the old one. J.

BTWW, welcome to the boards from Philly, Pa.

Go ahead and post your pix - no prob. I'll be putting some updates as I go. For now I'm just trying to get all the mechanical stuff squared away. Need all the u-joints, change fluid in the axles, change brake fluid, new PS box, drop the trans and go through it, new mounts bushings etc. Depending on parts I hope to be running by about the end of the month. We'll wait and see how good a guess that is......

**jaros44sr** · 11-13-2007, 03:07 PM

Thanks just got this at Harbor Frt. appreciate you letting me show it off, hydraulics are way better than the bench press...I look forward to following your thread

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaros44sr

Thanks just got this at Harbor Frt. appreciate you letting me show it off, hydraulics are way better than the bench press...I look forward to following your thread

Cool setup, I was considering the same but the $$ won out for the essentially free setup.
PO was wrong the Trans to TC adapter is not cracked so this will turn into a clean and reseal exercise. I'll get some more pix up later..

**jaros44sr** · 11-13-2007, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdflstf

Cool setup, I was considering the same but the $$ won out for the essentially free setup.
PO was wrong the Trans to TC adapter is not cracked so this will turn into a clean and reseal exercise. I'll get some more pix up later..

I was considering doing what you did, but I'm old and can't take chances anymore, plus my boys get good tools, someday but not yet...

Good deal on the seal, much cheaper. You can't imagine how much ATF was spun around under mine, nevermind you probably can

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 08:43 PM

Got al the brake fluid changed - it was black - yuk! I can hear the brakes actuate in the right rear but not the left so a couple more items to investigate..
Pix
1 The adapter - not cracked or broken.
2 The coupler - I can feel a slight groove where the TC side seal was. I'll polish and smooth out this one, should be good to go. Any contrary opinions out there?
3 Front diff draining. Not too bad clean inside and all the gears look good. Got 45 teeth on the ring and counted pinion turns so it looks like a 4.10.

mrein3 · 11-13-2007, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdflstf

Got al the brake fluid changed - it was black - yuk! I can hear the brakes actuate in the right rear but not the left so a couple more items to investigate..
Pix
1 The adapter - not cracked or broken.
2 The coupler - I can feel a slight groove where the TC side seal was. I'll polish and smooth out this one, should be good to go. Any contrary opinions out there?
3 Front diff draining. Not too bad clean inside and all the gears look good. Got 45 teeth on the ring and counted pinion turns so it looks like a 4.10.

If your adapter is not cracked or broken, it is leaking past the seals because of that groove. As you discovered the coupler aka "drive sleeve" gets a groove like the front oil seal on your engine. There are many fixes for the front oil seal on an engine, offest replacement seal or that sleeve you whack over the harmonic balancer. However on your transfer case adapter there are no such nice and cheap fixes. To do it right you need to replace the seals in the adapter, both front and back, and get a new sleeve. I bought a new drive sleeve over the counter at GM less than 5 years ago. If I remember correctly it was just under $100.

68C15 · 11-13-2007, 10:20 PM

first off I like your ingenuity with the T case tool for the floor jack. KUDOS!!

but the front diff fluid looks brown. kind of like when it gets water in it. I would do another diff. service in a week or so.

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 68C15

first off I like your ingenuity with the T case tool for the floor jack. KUDOS!!

but the front diff fluid looks brown. kind of like when it gets water in it. I would do another diff. service in a week or so.

Already planning on that once I get it on the road again. Funny though, it didn't have an water related nasty buildup in there. Maybe just caught it in time. I'll just put the cover back on with some RTV and when I do the second fluid change, I'll use the gasket..

Now to find a gasket and seal kit for the TC a couple of u-joints, steering box, drain the rear diff, do some cleanup... lots of work for the next couple of weeks.

hdflstf · 11-13-2007, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrein3

If your adapter is not cracked or broken, it is leaking past the seals because of that groove. As you discovered the coupler aka "drive sleeve" gets a groove like the front oil seal on your engine. There are many fixes for the front oil seal on an engine, offest replacement seal or that sleeve you whack over the harmonic balancer. However on your transfer case adapter there are no such nice and cheap fixes. To do it right you need to replace the seals in the adapter, both front and back, and get a new sleeve. I bought a new drive sleeve over the counter at GM less than 5 years ago. If I remember correctly it was just under $100.

Thx.. The 'groove' is where the TC seal rides as i the seal has worn into the sleeve enough to feel it with my fingernail. Trans side is ok. I'm curious though as it seems that they don't seal the splines so there is still a potential leak path even with good seals.

mrein3 · 11-14-2007, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdflstf

Thx.. The 'groove' is where the TC seal rides as i the seal has worn into the sleeve enough to feel it with my fingernail. Trans side is ok. I'm curious though as it seems that they don't seal the splines so there is still a potential leak path even with good seals.

I wondered about that myself.

My theory is, that 205 is such a beast to get in and out, you don't want to do it again any time soon.

For sure I'd replace both seals in the adapter. If you have the cash, I'd get a new sleeve and put the grooved one on the shelf. If the budget is tight, I'd just put it back and consider changing the gear oil in the transfer case every once in a while. You can buy a lot of gear oil for $100 (the price I think I paid for my last new drive sleeve).

68C15 · 11-14-2007, 08:11 AM

I'm thinking a good machine shop could weld up that groove and spin it flat again for about $30 or so. otherwise you can find a good parts store (not one of these big named chain stores where they hire McDonalds flunkies) to look in the back of the National seal book for a speedisleeve that will fit. they have listing by size.

1-tonmudder · 11-14-2007, 08:04 PM

Unless you have removed the sleeve support bearing that is the wrong style sleeve for that style adapter.Might be part of the problem.That is an early style sleeve and it appears to be a late style adapter.

hdflstf · 11-14-2007, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1-tonmudder

Unless you have removed the sleeve support bearing that is the wrong style sleeve for that style adapter.Might be part of the problem.That is an early style sleeve and it appears to be a late style adapter.

Ok. I'm not familiar with the differences between early and late parts for this. Any help with identification?

The O.D. of the sleeve is exactly 2 inches and the 'groove' is 1.9980. Two pix, first is sleeve and bearing. Second is hard to see but upon closer inspection, the transfer case seal is split right by my fingertip. I'm 99.99% certain that is the problem.

1-tonmudder · 11-14-2007, 09:42 PM

As pictured in your last post you have the early style adapter and sleeve.The late style(post 77ish) will not have the bearing and snap ring on the sleeve.The sleeve will be the same diameter on both ends and not kneck down like the one you pictured.

hdflstf · 11-14-2007, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1-tonmudder

As pictured in your last post you have the early style adapter and sleeve.The late style(post 77ish) will not have the bearing and snap ring on the sleeve.The sleeve will be the same diameter on both ends and not kneck down like the one you pictured.

I think I have the proper parts for the '72 based on the pictures of the replacement parts on the advance adapters website for the 71-79. Mine look to be the same configuration.

Adapter http://72.20.96.178/commerce/catalog...=1194923745792

Sleeve http://72.20.96.178/commerce/catalog...=1194924000709 with the exception that the pictured sleeve is not the correct spline for the TH350. SM465 type pictured.

mrein3 · 11-15-2007, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdflstf

Ok. I'm not familiar with the differences between early and late parts for this. Any help with identification?

The O.D. of the sleeve is exactly 2 inches and the 'groove' is 1.9980. Two pix, first is sleeve and bearing. Second is hard to see but upon closer inspection, the transfer case seal is split right by my fingertip. I'm 99.99% certain that is the problem.

As 1-tonmudder pointed out, you have the "early style" adapter. When I swapped from 3-speed manual to th350, I bought used stuff out of a 72 Blazer. The adapter had the bearing. However I discovered the adapter housing was cracked.

I spent a lot of money at the GM counter for a new housing and drive sleeve. A lot. They are the newer style and bolt right up to the tranny and t-case.

Since you found a split in the oil seal you may want to just replace it. The only flaw I can see in your logic is that the break in the seal you identified is at the top of the adapter. You would think that it wouldn't leak much if any up there. Now that you are an expert at removing the t-case (nice floor jack fixture fab) by just replacing that seal what have you got to lose other than time and a little tranny fluid?

OLDCHEV4X4 · 11-15-2007, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Thx.. The 'groove' is where the TC seal rides as i the seal has worn into the sleeve enough to feel it with my fingernail. Trans side is ok. I'm curious though as it seems that they don't seal the splines so there is still a potential leak path even with good seals.

There should be a o-ring on the output shaft of the trans or the input of the TC to seal the splines. I can't remember witch it is.
My original sleeve had the shoulder and the bearing too. When i got the new one i was a little dissapointed. I liked the idea of the extra support in the middle. But so far so good on the bearingless sleeve.
One more thing, the first time i put it together i put the sleeve in backwards and it filled the TC with ATF. Don't do what i did.

11-13-2007, 12:44 AM	#1
hdflstf Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Desert Southwest Posts: 540	Transfer Case is Out Got the transfer case out today. PO told me the adapter was cracked and leaking trans fluid into the transfer case. I think maybe the seals are bad since the adapter appears to be in good shape. I think I'll rebuild the trans while I'm in this far. Made a little fixture with some angle iron and the welder to keep the TC under control on the floor jack. Attached Images

11-13-2007, 12:55 AM	#2
72armyswbtruck Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Idaho Posts: 4,033	Re: Transfer Case is Out Thats pretty snazzy __________________ "Remember, They can Kill You, but they can't eat You, That's against the law!!!!!!!!!"

11-13-2007, 02:59 AM	#4
earl87gta Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Kingsport TN Posts: 4,641	Re: Transfer Case is Out thats a cool idea I aways lower them down through the trans cover with my engine hoist. __________________ Earl 68 2500 4x4 GMC Burb

11-13-2007, 06:38 AM	#5
jaros44sr Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Philadelphia, Pa. 19454 Posts: 9,766	Re: Transfer Case is Out Nice work. How is that flooring to roll a floor jack and a creeper around on? I was thinking of that stuff or painting my floor __________________ Semper Fi...Uncle Sam, you da man All parts offered to help are free, unless otherwise noted Dont try this stuff in my build thread, unless you have 55 years of mechanical OTJ training SAFETY FIRST AS usual, off topic They say your mind goes second, can't remember the first Jim Last edited by jaros44sr; 11-13-2007 at 06:40 AM.

11-13-2007, 03:07 PM	#10
jaros44sr Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Philadelphia, Pa. 19454 Posts: 9,766	Re: Transfer Case is Out Thanks just got this at Harbor Frt. appreciate you letting me show it off, hydraulics are way better than the bench press...I look forward to following your thread __________________ Semper Fi...Uncle Sam, you da man All parts offered to help are free, unless otherwise noted Dont try this stuff in my build thread, unless you have 55 years of mechanical OTJ training SAFETY FIRST AS usual, off topic They say your mind goes second, can't remember the first Jim

11-13-2007, 08:43 PM	#13
hdflstf Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Desert Southwest Posts: 540	Re: Transfer Case is Out Got al the brake fluid changed - it was black - yuk! I can hear the brakes actuate in the right rear but not the left so a couple more items to investigate.. Pix 1 The adapter - not cracked or broken. 2 The coupler - I can feel a slight groove where the TC side seal was. I'll polish and smooth out this one, should be good to go. Any contrary opinions out there? 3 Front diff draining. Not too bad clean inside and all the gears look good. Got 45 teeth on the ring and counted pinion turns so it looks like a 4.10. Attached Images

11-13-2007, 10:20 PM	#15
68C15 blood type; Retumbo Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: next to my reloading bench Posts: 10,269	Re: Transfer Case is Out first off I like your ingenuity with the T case tool for the floor jack. KUDOS!! but the front diff fluid looks brown. kind of like when it gets water in it. I would do another diff. service in a week or so.

11-14-2007, 08:11 AM	#19
68C15 blood type; Retumbo Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: next to my reloading bench Posts: 10,269	Re: Transfer Case is Out I'm thinking a good machine shop could weld up that groove and spin it flat again for about $30 or so. otherwise you can find a good parts store (not one of these big named chain stores where they hire McDonalds flunkies) to look in the back of the National seal book for a speedisleeve that will fit. they have listing by size.

11-14-2007, 08:04 PM	#20
1-tonmudder Modern day Fred Sanford Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Greeneville,TN Posts: 330	Re: Transfer Case is Out Unless you have removed the sleeve support bearing that is the wrong style sleeve for that style adapter.Might be part of the problem.That is an early style sleeve and it appears to be a late style adapter.

11-14-2007, 09:42 PM	#22
1-tonmudder Modern day Fred Sanford Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Greeneville,TN Posts: 330	Re: Transfer Case is Out As pictured in your last post you have the early style adapter and sleeve.The late style(post 77ish) will not have the bearing and snap ring on the sleeve.The sleeve will be the same diameter on both ends and not kneck down like the one you pictured.



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