Pls check my thinking on a starter problem

[CCCC]

A 72 Chev BB here spins and starts like a champ about 95% of the time. Occasionally and intermittently, whether cold or hot, the turn of the key results in NOTHING except an ammeter pegged to total discharge. A few more turns of the key and it spins and starts. No "clicking", or slow turning or any other odd sound when it does not spin - just dead. The battery is fully charged and when the starter spins, it is fast and strong.

At first I thought maybe bad ignition switch, but the total discharge on the meter seems to say that it is more than a matter of no contact at the switch. Could it be intermittent short at the switch?

Thinking solenoid malfunction, I remember that problem in the past seemingly accompanied by some clicking, or slow grinding etc., and usually the bad solenoid acted up almost every time it was started. Ever had one act dead intermittently, and be great the rest of the time?

I also have heard that a starter (rotor/field coil) can have a dead spot somewhere in its rotation and, if it lands there when it stops spinning, will act in this manner on the next start.

Anybody agree or disagree with any of the above - or have other insights? Thanks in advance.

[El Jay]

Originally Posted by CCCC

A 72 Chev BB here spins and starts like a champ about 95% of the time. Occasionally and intermittently, whether cold or hot, the turn of the key results in NOTHING except an ammeter pegged to total discharge. A few more turns of the key and it spins and starts. No "clicking", or slow turning or any other odd sound when it does not spin - just dead. The battery is fully charged and when the starter spins, it is fast and strong.

At first I thought maybe bad ignition switch, but the total discharge on the meter seems to say that it is more than a matter of no contact at the switch. Could it be intermittent short at the switch?

Thinking solenoid malfunction, I remember that problem in the past seemingly accompanied by some clicking, or slow grinding etc., and usually the bad solenoid acted up almost every time it was started. Ever had one act dead intermittently, and be great the rest of the time?

I also have heard that a starter (rotor/field coil) can have a dead spot somewhere in its rotation and, if it lands there when it stops spinning, will act in this manner on the next start.

Anybody agree or disagree with any of the above - or have other insights? Thanks in advance.

I would definitely lean towards a something wrong in the starter motor since you're going to full discharge on the ammeter.
It's drawing a ton of amps, but not doing anything.
The solenoid ain't nothing but a switch when you get right down to it.

[JimKshortstep4x4]

If your truck has the stock ammeter setup in it then I would be looking at the solenoid as a possibility of being bad. The stock ammeter reads the resistance over a length of the main positive feed wire that supplies power to the fuse panel. The stock ammeter only reads the power going into the fuse area or back to the battery from the alternator. It does not read the current going to the starter.

Jim

['68OrangeSunshine]

My guess is solenoid and starter. I had something like that same problem. ['71 GMC Jimmy [K/5] w/ 350 V8 4x4] Sometimes it started right up. Sometimes it clicked a few times first. Sometimes no click. After a wait, first it was 30 minutes then an hour, finally overnight -- it would start again. More prevalent with hot weather or after an hour's run on the freeway.
Starter was 12 years old and solenoid was 8. So I guess I got my money's worth.
I have Heddman hedders which are right close to the starter/solenoid assembly, and have to be pulled to get at the starter. Cook-off is the most probable cause.
Currently I have a new starter to install, with an Accel Hi-Tork solenoid, and a Ford-type remote solenoid [on the inside passenger fender] and my headers are out getting sandblasted so I can spray them with this ceramic coating stuff. Then I'm going to wrap the headers with 2" heat tape.
I know -- I went nuts, but it was high time to paint the fender skirts, rebuild the battery box, change the water pump and replace the valve covers. All corrosion victims from a battery that tipped over for a few days before I caught it. Since I'm in there, I'm replacing the radiator hoses too.

[72gmcworker]

Having the same issue with my '80 Chev.
Turn key and nothing...no click... no notta and only is intermittent.

Pulled starter, check/cleaned the terminals and pulled the end cap on the solenoid to check the "washer" to see if it was burnt....all is good. Put it back in and worked...intermittent again.
My guess now is it is the neutral switch acting up..last time it did it I held the key turned and moved the shifter from P to D and back and starter clicked in when the switch engaged.

Electrical..lots of fun.......

[CCCC]

Thanks to those responding - good stuff. The ammeter is aftermarket SW under dash. This is a 4speed - no neutral safety switch.
Looks like I will have to take it all out, so will be able to inspect/test the solenoid as needed. Anybody know how to bench test the starter for such shorting? Yes, it might be simpler to buy a new solenoid and starter, but am not eager because both of these have very little use/wear - one year of mostly long highway miles on the new solenoid and remanufactured starter. Thanks again. Any more?

[Wrenchbender Ret]

I agree you don't have to go out & buy a new one. They are easy to take apart & clean up. Take the nut off the selenoid at the S term. & off the term that hooks to the starter. Remove the 2 screws holding the cover on & remove the cover. If the inside of the term that hooks to the bat cable is burnt, you can loosen the nut & turn it around using the other side.

[LockDoc]

Originally Posted by CCCC

Anybody know how to bench test the starter for such shorting?

Almost any auto parts store can check electrical components for you and most don't charge anything to do it..

LockDoc

[cdowns]

i'd start by taking apart the ground wires and cleaning them up nice and bright to eliminate that as the cause of your high amp problems