Body mount shim pain in the @$%!!!

[Critter]

I am about to pull my hair out! Here’s my situation. My blazer has had some (poorly done) body work by the previous owner, at least one of my doors isn’t the original, I recently found a nice double wall top, and I changed my old body mounts over to a poly kit a couple months ago. I can’t get the new mounts shimmed so that the top and doors are both happy. Everything that I have read here and in my assembly manual says to shim the mounts so that the doors close nicely, but as I remember, these hinges have a little bit of adjustment built in to the mounting holes. My question is if the previous owner mounted the doors with to the old worn out body mounts, wouldn’t I probably have to adjust them now that I have changed things around? If this is the case, I seem to have too many variables! Where do I begin as far as shimming these mounts??? By the way, the hinges don’t really have any sag to them, but the doors seem to be hanging too low at the striker area. However, the vent window area of the doors match fairly well with the windshield frame. What does this mean other than my body is a pretzel?

[vtblazer]

Is the hard top mounted?
Mounting the hard top will set the firewall/B-pillar alignment fairly well.

Hinges must be in good shape, if their not, now is the time to rebuild them.

Don't worry about the striker plates or latches yet, get the door gaps set first, then adjust the latches and how the door closes from there.

[Huck]

Need more info---front clip on? Torque boxes in place and good? YOu shim to get the body straight where it flexes at the front floor.
The door hinges give you front to back , tilt and forward and back at the A pillar!
The in/out at the door mount.
The shims will allow for door to quarter and door vent window to windshield frame alignment. If your door to quarter and door to fender seams are kaka, you will need both shimming and hinge to A pillar adjusting. Take your time and do one at a time. Sent you PM with my phone # for some verbal encouragement !!hehehe Huck

[Critter]

Originally Posted by vtblazer

Is the hard top mounted?
Mounting the hard top will set the firewall/B-pillar alignment fairly well.

That was one of my questions. My old top was cracked all to hell and now that I have a nice one, I didn’t know how much stress I should put on it. Sounds like I should completely bolt it up and go with it. Currently I have it bolted up at the windshield and at the very back metal brackets but no where else.

Originally Posted by vtblazer

Hinges must be in good shape, if their not, now is the time to rebuild them.

I’m sure they could use a rebuild like everything else on the truck, but the passenger seems to be tight, the driver does have a little play in it but not terrible. I am using the passenger more for fitment because of this reason.

Originally Posted by vtblazer

Don't worry about the striker plates or latches yet, get the door gaps set first, then adjust the latches and how the door closes from there.

Well, when I said it is hitting the striker area, I meant that it is hitting the TUB, not the striker itself. Don’t know if that makes a difference.

Originally Posted by Huck

Need more info---front clip on? Torque boxes in place and good? You shim to get the body straight where it flexes at the front floor.
The door hinges give you front to back, tilt and forward and back at the A pillar!
The in/out at the door mount.
The shims will allow for door to quarter and door vent window to windshield frame alignment. If your door to quarter and door to fender seams are kaka, you will need both shimming and hinge to A pillar adjusting. Take your time and do one at a time. Sent you PM with my phone # for some verbal encouragement!!hehehe Huck

My PM box was full so I didn’t get anything, but I cleaned it out this morning.

Front clip is on, torque boxes are in place and in good shape, floor pans have some rust but not as bad as some I have seen.

Keep in mind I think this thing has had a pretty rough life and I doubt any of the front sheet metal is the orignal. None of the gaps seem right anywhere on the truck. I am hoping to get this straightened out and then move forward.

I have been adjusting the main mount under the front floorboard and the next one back which is just behind the front seats. I have been doing things as the assembly manual says but it tells you to use the doors as a reference point. I think the hinges DO need to be adjusted so that tells me they aren’t a good tool to go by. My main problem is where do I start? Should I shim the body mounts so that the top fits? I finally got it where the bed rails and top are touching all the way down the sides. THEN should I adjust the door hinges accordingly? I just feel that there should be a definite pattern of steps to follow but maybe there isn’t. I’m a terrible body man, it requires WAY too much artistic talent!

One last thing. I did at one time have the mounts shimmed where the doors closed pretty good. When I put on the top, I bolted it at the windshield and at the very back and this created about 3/8ths of daylight between the tub and the B pillar, this didn't seem right so I continued to adjust shims.

Thanks for all your help guys, I really appreciate it!

[AJs72K5]

I'm about to go thru alot of the same grief you're feeling Critter. I have to align almost all my panels after pulling the body lift out.

Where did you get this assembly manual? I did a quick google search and found the 67-72 truck assembly manual. Is the K5 covered in the same manual?

[Critter]

Originally Posted by AJs72K5

Where did you get this assembly manual? I did a quick google search and found the 67-72 truck assembly manual. Is the K5 covered in the same manual?

You can find the manual on ebay and even the online book stores. I ordered mine from one of the site venders but honeslty, I don't remember which one.

The K5 is in the same manual as the trucks. It is very confusing and there is no order to the book, no page numbers, no index nothing! BUT it is very helpful when trying to figure what parts go where, once you find the right page. You are welcome to take a look at mine sometime if you like.

[Huck]

Looks like your door is a little too tight at the line between it and the rear quarter. The assembly manual gives you specific measurement recommendations at all seams. I like to get that seam good, then go for the vent window frame to windshield frame seam. Last is the front of door to fender---Your fender adjustment is infinite and easy once the stuff behind it is done. huck

[Jtrux]

I've been helping him out when I can and I can tell you this, it is a pain. Once we get one thing lined up the rest of it sucks and vise versa. I thought I woud bring up another point. The back of the top is very difficult to get lined up as well, like it hangs too much off the back. Critter, maybe you did something else recently to fix that but that's what I remember.

[Critter]

Originally Posted by Huck

Looks like your door is a little too tight at the line between it and the rear quarter. The assembly manual gives you specific measurement recommendations at all seams. I like to get that seam good, then go for the vent window frame to windshield frame seam. Last is the front of door to fender---Your fender adjustment is infinite and easy once the stuff behind it is done. huck

I agree about the specific measurments, but it doens't make sence to me to adjust the body mounts while using these door measurements when I KNOW that the PO moved the doors around to fit the old worn out body mounts. I have tried virtually every combination of shims between 0 and 3/4 inches and none of them made these gaps line up right. For that reason, I think I am going to ignore the doors, shim the body so the top is perfect, then pull the fenders and line the doors back up. I can't think of a better way.

Originally Posted by Jtrux

I've been helping him out when I can and I can tell you this, it is a pain. Once we get one thing lined up the rest of it sucks and vise versa. I thought I woud bring up another point. The back of the top is very difficult to get lined up as well, like it hangs too much off the back. Critter, maybe you did something else recently to fix that but that's what I remember.

I finally got the top to fall in place. It took alot of shimming but finally the windshield area matched up and I guess it "pulled" the back area to where it needed to be.

[BLUE THUNDER]

I think you should loosen all your body mount bushings and then put your top on. Then use a couple of floor jacks and some 4x4 scrap and jack up the body until the gaps between the body and the top are right and you can bolt the rest of the top to the body. Once you've done that, shim your body mounts properly and tighten them down. Then lower the jacks slowly. That should fix it. Let me know when you're gonna do it and i'll help. Later, Mario.

[Jtrux]

Originally Posted by BLUE THUNDER

I think you should loosen all your body mount bushings and then put your top on. Then use a couple of floor jacks and some 4x4 scrap and jack up the body until the gaps between the body and the top are right and you can bolt the rest of the top to the body. Once you've done that, shim your body mounts properly and tighten them down. Then lower the jacks slowly. That should fix it. Let me know when you're gonna do it and i'll help. Later, Mario.

Easier said than done, not only that but I think that puts a lot of stress on the top. The tops real nice so I don't think that he should be unnecessary stresses on it.

[swyfor5]

Man, this is a awesome thread! I have been researching this for a while. Got the poly body bushings, and etc, but don't really know where to start. I am really interested where your going!

[Jtrux]

Originally Posted by swyfor5

Man, this is a awesome thread! I have been researching this for a while. Got the poly body bushings, and etc, but don't really know where to start. I am really interested where your going!

Get some friends that like to help, you'll need 'em.

[Critter]

Originally Posted by Jtrux

Get some friends that like to help, you'll need 'em.

Don't scare them too much. I have a feeling that my blazer has just been so molested that it is worse than most. It's pretty apparent that mine has had some pretty questionable body work done over its life, not to mention sheet metal replacement and poor adjustment. Luckily, the mechanical and electrical are in pretty good shape. If the weather would ever dry up around here I would tear into it again.

[BLUE THUNDER]

Dude, if you shim it with the top on and compensate for body mount compression when you lower the jacks, your top will be fine. We'll lower the jacks slowly. Later. Mario

[AJs72K5]

I spent most of the day on Friday shimming the body mounts on mine. On the driver's side, I got the a-pillar, b-pillar, and rocker lined nice. The door closes beautifully. However, my gap on the windshield frame is off. It's good at the bottom, but is almost rubbing at the top. Suggestions?

[Critter]

Originally Posted by AJs72K5

I spent most of the day on Friday shimming the body mounts on mine. On the driver's side, I got the a-pillar, b-pillar, and rocker lined nice. The door closes beautifully. However, my gap on the windshield frame is off. It's good at the bottom, but is almost rubbing at the top. Suggestions?

From what little I know it would seam that you need less shims on the mount right below your feet (the larger bolts)and possibley the ones right behind the seats. Have you messed with it since this post?

[Jtrux]

Or we throw the tops away and cruise topless forever, seems to make the most sense to me.

[Critter]

Originally Posted by Jtrux

Or we throw the tops away and cruise topless forever, seems to make the most sense to me.

Yeah but still, it bothers the heck out of me to know that it isn't adjusted right! I have trouble sleeping at night if something is screwed up...I am a very tired guy lately.

[Huck]

Listen to Mario---he is pointing you in the right direction. Use his as a reference point. Don't worry about damaging the double wall top--around here we throw perfectly good one's away!! hehehehe Besides you really would be happier with a single wall. It cuts the weight by about 3 lbs! hehehehehe---
Oh yea, one more little tidbit about Blazers---let's just say after you spend a month or two trying to get everything lined up nice---and you get the bug to drive it topless---like some many things in life--topless will over time make things--well---sag a little!!hehehehehehe
You will have to put the blazer top bra back on to get things line up close to the "perky" way you had it before!! (:>)

[Critter]

Originally Posted by Huck

Listen to Mario---he is pointing you in the right direction. Use his as a reference point. Don't worry about damaging the double wall top--around here we throw perfectly good one's away!! hehehehe Besides you really would be happier with a single wall. It cuts the weight by about 3 lbs! hehehehehe---
Oh yea, one more little tidbit about Blazers---let's just say after you spend a month or two trying to get everything lined up nice---and you get the bug to drive it topless---like some many things in life--topless will over time make things--well---sag a little!!hehehehehehe
You will have to put the blazer top bra back on to get things line up close to the "perky" way you had it before!! (:>)

Thanks for all the help Huck. If I am hearing you (and Mario) right, you are telling me to loosen the body mounts and bolt the top up snuggly? So the top is strong enought to pull the body in to place??? I just have a bad feeling that everything would crack. Hopefully I am wrong.

[jcfoote60]

the other thing on door alignment, don't be afraid to hog the holes on your hinges at the A-piller just a bit to give you more adjustment for gaps, It makes it easier, and done easily with a good carbide burr on your die grinder.

On mine it was top on and bolted in place, original shims back into original locations and walla, just a bit of door alignment and good to go. I have a very rust free tub though and a good set of OEM doors.

[BLUE THUNDER]

Dude, let me know when and i'll help. Later, Mario

[Critter]

Originally Posted by jcfoote60

On mine it was top on and bolted in place, original shims back into original locations and walla, just a bit of door alignment and good to go. I have a very rust free tub though and a good set of OEM doors.

You just had to rub it in, didn't you?

[BLUE THUNDER]

You caught that huh? I'm still willing to help bro. Besides, I'm gonna put together a work day at my house in a couple of weeks for the motor install; and I'm gonna need help. Later Mario.