Studebaker - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

VNMOUS · 11-14-2002, 01:02 PM

I HEARD A STORY ABOUT HOW OUR TRUCKS WERE ALMOST STUDEBAKERS. DOES ANYONE KNOW ABOUT THIS?

Blazer1970 · 11-14-2002, 01:13 PM

That story is not true.

ckhd · 11-14-2002, 01:29 PM

True or not, you gotta tell the story now!

VNMOUS · 11-14-2002, 03:41 PM

A GUY I WORK WITH WAS TELLING ME THAT THE 1967 MODEL DESIGN WAS ORIGINALLY GOING TO BE A STUDEBAKER BUT, IT WAS BOUGHT BY GM WHEN STUDEBAKER WENT UNDER OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. I DON'T KNOW IF THERE IS ANY VALIDITY OR NOT

Alexis · 11-14-2002, 03:44 PM

there was a thread about this and it's true, from what i recall if i'm wrong i'm going to blame it on the beers, lol. But yeah someone had pictures to back up this "story" too.

stllookn · 11-14-2002, 04:39 PM

The last "Stupidbaker" was built in 1966 so I guess it is possible that they might have been considering getting back into trucks but they quit truck production much earlier. They used independent design firms so it is also possible that the "design" was shopped around for other potential buyers. The designs precede produciton by about 5 years...I recall reading somewhere.

dubie · 11-14-2002, 05:25 PM

It is true.The design for the 67 Chevy was based on a Studebaker . Ryan68 posted a topic about it on the old message board a couple years back and it even had a pic of the truck. I don't know if anyone is able to search that far back though.

68 Suburban · 11-14-2002, 06:03 PM

IT IS NOT TRUE! Yes, there are some similarities in the way the front ends look, but there is not truth to the story. Chevy would have been working on the design of the 1967 truck long before the 66 Studebakers.

ckhd · 11-14-2002, 06:36 PM

If it was true, it would have saved Studebaker! Just think, the website would be 67-72studebakertrucks.com.

barn9 · 11-14-2002, 08:22 PM

O.T., but a coincedence! I was at a guy's shop today and he has a Studebaker pickup body (in nice condition), sitting on a frame and running gear from an International Scout. Said he has some big tires and rims ordered for it (it is already lifted). Cool lookin' ride!

68 Suburban · 11-14-2002, 08:32 PM

Dan69 step · 11-15-2002, 09:17 AM

As a member of the Studebaker Drivers Club and owner of some Studebakers, I believe there is some validity to this story, as I remember seeing some concept designs in the Studebaker "Turning Wheels" monthly magazine that I get. The time frame is is possible . The Avanti went from conception to production in a mere 13 months, a time line unheard of with the "big 3". After Studebaker closed its doors in South Bend in 1963, the 65 and 66 models were being produced in Canada with the cars having a GM 283 engine. I'll have to go back and see if I can find any info in my old mags.

Blazer1970 · 11-15-2002, 10:45 AM

There was a long thread on here a while back about that guy (name?) who was the designer that drew the concept that became the '67 GM pickup. He worked for GM, and there was absolutely no tie in to Studebaker. There was a drawing of an El Camino concept that was obviously the inspiration for this truck body style. The Studebaker thing was started by someone who saw some resemblance in the front end styling between some Studebaker and these trucks. The Studebaker photo was posted the last time this was beaten to death, and personally, I could not even see the resemblance.

billogna · 11-15-2002, 12:17 PM

The original '67 was designed by Harry Bentley Bradley. There was an interesting interview with him in the Jan '01 issue of Sport Truck mag, in which he talks about how he pushed for the small back window, and how GM thought the overall design was too car-like so they changed the hood in '69 to make it more truck-like, but he was working with the Cadillac team by then, and had no say in the new design. Anyway, this is the most convincing pic, to me, that suppports the non-Studebaker theory. It is obviosly a '67 Chevy design. I like the Chevelle body line on the forward front fender. It is signed by Bradley and dated 8/65. He had been with GM since '62.

68 Suburban · 11-15-2002, 12:42 PM

I owned a beautiful 64Studebaker for a time. I also belonged to the Studebaker News Group, which tends to be a very proud gorup that feels like the Studebaker has always been an over looked performance car. I remember when this came up before, I asked this question on the newsgroup. Everyone over there said it was non-sense.

Look at todays cars. There are a lot more similarities in designing than there was between the Stude and the Chevy Truck.

Here is a picture of my old Stude

I should have kept that one.

68 Suburban · 11-15-2002, 12:45 PM

By the way, in 1966 Studebaker had a skeleton crew of designers on staff, and was finding it hard to make designing changes to a "old" body style that had been around since the 50's. They carried the body style on as long as they could because of the lack of $$$ I doubt GM would have looked to Studebaker for some "fresh" ideas.

toms68cst · 11-15-2002, 04:15 PM

I remember that post by Ryan68. I think he posted a picture of a custom studebaker truck that had a 67-like chevy grill on it and posted the message as a joke. I even fell for it at first!

Bradley worked for GM through the 60's. I think he left GM around 68-69 to start making Hot Wheels. I don't think he had any ties to Studebaker. You could perhaps argue that some of the late Studebaker truck grills look similar to the 67-68 grills.

*Fast68Chevy* · 11-15-2002, 08:57 PM

the hood design change in 69 was in the article ??

anyone got copy of it ? i was around here when all the harry Bradley interview things were happening, and had information saved from that time, but have since lost it all, gotta love puters and unreliability of them..

thanks

**PICKMUP** · 11-15-2002, 10:47 PM

It has to be true. I read/saw/heard about it on the INTERNET! Right?

billogna · 11-16-2002, 12:49 AM

Fast68Chevy, I have the magazine pages scanned and will email the article to you if you want it.

ChevLoRay · 11-16-2002, 08:52 AM

Harry Bradley is the designer of the '67, just like billogna said. The article is very informative and explains why the changes and the thinking that went into the new design.

As for Studebaker engines for '65-66, which were built in Canada don' cha know, they had steel crankshafts (yep, forged) in the 283's. So, if you can find one in good condition you could have the basis for a nice 302 to build....if you can find a good builder 4-inch bore block, with small main journals.

Does anyone know if the Checker engines had steel cranks? They also used Chevy engines toward the end of their production. Just curious. The last Checker I saw was on Friends....Phoebe was driving it to the beach house where one of them got stung by a jelly fish and Joey peed on the sting.

11-14-2002, 01:02 PM	#1
VNMOUS Step Side's Rule Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: LEIGHTON,AL USA Posts: 227	Studebaker I HEARD A STORY ABOUT HOW OUR TRUCKS WERE ALMOST STUDEBAKERS. DOES ANYONE KNOW ABOUT THIS? __________________ DANO 07 Silverado Classic 67shortstep 76 stingray 95 cobra 66 Mustang Coupe 289

11-14-2002, 01:13 PM	#2
Blazer1970 Registered User Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Old Mission, MI, USA Posts: 2,507	That story is not true. __________________ Tim

11-14-2002, 01:29 PM	#3
ckhd Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: St. Johns, Arizona Posts: 2,660	True or not, you gotta tell the story now! __________________ my 2¢ - t.i.o.l.i. Bowen 1968 K20 fleet 1969 K10 swb fleet 1972 K10 Suburban 1972 C10 lwb step 1992 K1500 'burb 1995 K2500 'burb 1997 C1500 'burb 1999 K1500 2000 K1500 'burb Why do I own so many Suburbans?

11-14-2002, 03:41 PM	#4
VNMOUS Step Side's Rule Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: LEIGHTON,AL USA Posts: 227	A GUY I WORK WITH WAS TELLING ME THAT THE 1967 MODEL DESIGN WAS ORIGINALLY GOING TO BE A STUDEBAKER BUT, IT WAS BOUGHT BY GM WHEN STUDEBAKER WENT UNDER OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. I DON'T KNOW IF THERE IS ANY VALIDITY OR NOT __________________ DANO 07 Silverado Classic 67shortstep 76 stingray 95 cobra 66 Mustang Coupe 289

11-14-2002, 04:39 PM	#6
stllookn Saving 1 truck at a time! Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Kent, WA Posts: 6,465	The last "Stupidbaker" was built in 1966 so I guess it is possible that they might have been considering getting back into trucks but they quit truck production much earlier. They used independent design firms so it is also possible that the "design" was shopped around for other potential buyers. The designs precede produciton by about 5 years...I recall reading somewhere. __________________ '68 C20 Longhorn 50th Anniversary 400/TH400 '68 C20 Longhorn 50th Anniversary 468/TH400w/buckets '72 C20 Halfhorn (Longhorn w/o cab and front clip) '69 Flxible Cruiser (look up ugly in the dictionary)

11-14-2002, 03:44 PM	#5
Alexis Member since 2000 Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Mountain View Ca / Mexico Posts: 7,874	there was a thread about this and it's true, from what i recall if i'm wrong i'm going to blame it on the beers, lol. But yeah someone had pictures to back up this "story" too.

11-14-2002, 05:25 PM	#7
dubie Registered User Join Date: May 2000 Location: Flin Flon, Manitoba, Canada Posts: 8,853	It is true.The design for the 67 Chevy was based on a Studebaker . Ryan68 posted a topic about it on the old message board a couple years back and it even had a pic of the truck. I don't know if anyone is able to search that far back though. __________________ My name's Tim and I'm a truckaholic My 56 Chevy shop truck build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=562795

11-14-2002, 06:03 PM	#8
68 Suburban Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: From Chicago, Live in Phoenix, AZ Posts: 6,802	IT IS NOT TRUE! Yes, there are some similarities in the way the front ends look, but there is not truth to the story. Chevy would have been working on the design of the 1967 truck long before the 66 Studebakers.

11-14-2002, 06:36 PM	#9
ckhd Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: St. Johns, Arizona Posts: 2,660	If it was true, it would have saved Studebaker! Just think, the website would be 67-72studebakertrucks.com. __________________ my 2¢ - t.i.o.l.i. Bowen 1968 K20 fleet 1969 K10 swb fleet 1972 K10 Suburban 1972 C10 lwb step 1992 K1500 'burb 1995 K2500 'burb 1997 C1500 'burb 1999 K1500 2000 K1500 'burb Why do I own so many Suburbans?

11-14-2002, 08:22 PM	#10
barn9 Half a bubble off! Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Winfield, Ks, USA Posts: 5,588	O.T., but a coincedence! I was at a guy's shop today and he has a Studebaker pickup body (in nice condition), sitting on a frame and running gear from an International Scout. Said he has some big tires and rims ordered for it (it is already lifted). Cool lookin' ride! __________________ Just call me LB. '71 Cheyenne, 402BB, hauls blondes, brunettes, or redheads.

11-14-2002, 08:32 PM	#11
68 Suburban Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: From Chicago, Live in Phoenix, AZ Posts: 6,802

11-15-2002, 09:17 AM	#12
Dan69 step Registered User Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Fullerton,NE Posts: 380	As a member of the Studebaker Drivers Club and owner of some Studebakers, I believe there is some validity to this story, as I remember seeing some concept designs in the Studebaker "Turning Wheels" monthly magazine that I get. The time frame is is possible . The Avanti went from conception to production in a mere 13 months, a time line unheard of with the "big 3". After Studebaker closed its doors in South Bend in 1963, the 65 and 66 models were being produced in Canada with the cars having a GM 283 engine. I'll have to go back and see if I can find any info in my old mags. __________________ 69 short step 68 50th Anniversary Gold/ White lwb 72 2wd Blazer 63 Studebaker Avanti 85 Avanti 66 Studebaker Cruiser 49 Studebaker pickup 3-49 Studebaker 1 1/2 truck 94 White/ GMC coe (cabin hauler) 95 chev 2015 chev Duramax 2500

11-15-2002, 10:45 AM	#13
Blazer1970 Registered User Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Old Mission, MI, USA Posts: 2,507	There was a long thread on here a while back about that guy (name?) who was the designer that drew the concept that became the '67 GM pickup. He worked for GM, and there was absolutely no tie in to Studebaker. There was a drawing of an El Camino concept that was obviously the inspiration for this truck body style. The Studebaker thing was started by someone who saw some resemblance in the front end styling between some Studebaker and these trucks. The Studebaker photo was posted the last time this was beaten to death, and personally, I could not even see the resemblance. __________________ Tim

11-15-2002, 12:17 PM	#14
billogna Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Choctaw, OK Posts: 235	The original '67 was designed by Harry Bentley Bradley. There was an interesting interview with him in the Jan '01 issue of Sport Truck mag, in which he talks about how he pushed for the small back window, and how GM thought the overall design was too car-like so they changed the hood in '69 to make it more truck-like, but he was working with the Cadillac team by then, and had no say in the new design. Anyway, this is the most convincing pic, to me, that suppports the non-Studebaker theory. It is obviosly a '67 Chevy design. I like the Chevelle body line on the forward front fender. It is signed by Bradley and dated 8/65. He had been with GM since '62. Attached Images __________________ '69 Chev Cust/10 swb, 350/700R4, 5"/6" '70 Chev C10 swb, 67 front, 454/700r4, 4"/5" '73 Chev stepper, 350/3 spd '84 Chev K20 350/4 spd '91 GMC 1500 Suburban 4x4, 350/700R4

11-15-2002, 12:42 PM	#15
68 Suburban Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: From Chicago, Live in Phoenix, AZ Posts: 6,802	I owned a beautiful 64Studebaker for a time. I also belonged to the Studebaker News Group, which tends to be a very proud gorup that feels like the Studebaker has always been an over looked performance car. I remember when this came up before, I asked this question on the newsgroup. Everyone over there said it was non-sense. Look at todays cars. There are a lot more similarities in designing than there was between the Stude and the Chevy Truck. Here is a picture of my old Stude I should have kept that one.



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11-15-2002, 12:45 PM	#16
68 Suburban Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: From Chicago, Live in Phoenix, AZ Posts: 6,802	By the way, in 1966 Studebaker had a skeleton crew of designers on staff, and was finding it hard to make designing changes to a "old" body style that had been around since the 50's. They carried the body style on as long as they could because of the lack of $$$ I doubt GM would have looked to Studebaker for some "fresh" ideas.

11-15-2002, 04:15 PM	#17
toms68cst Registered User Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Bismarck, ND Posts: 4,296	I remember that post by Ryan68. I think he posted a picture of a custom studebaker truck that had a 67-like chevy grill on it and posted the message as a joke. I even fell for it at first! Bradley worked for GM through the 60's. I think he left GM around 68-69 to start making Hot Wheels. I don't think he had any ties to Studebaker. You could perhaps argue that some of the late Studebaker truck grills look similar to the 67-68 grills. __________________ Unrestored 68 C-10 CST. Original 327. 4-Speed CH465. 50k or so miles. TREASURER, Drum Brake Club.

11-15-2002, 08:57 PM	#18
Fast68Chevy Account Suspended Join Date: May 2000 Location: IL Posts: 0	the hood design change in 69 was in the article ?? anyone got copy of it ? i was around here when all the harry Bradley interview things were happening, and had information saved from that time, but have since lost it all, gotta love puters and unreliability of them.. thanks

11-15-2002, 10:47 PM	#19
PICKMUP "Trucks with Class" Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: OLYMPIA, WA, USA Posts: 8,158	The start of a new "Urban Legand"! It has to be true. I read/saw/heard about it on the INTERNET! Right? __________________ Email: frankeham@comcast.net Phone: 360-956-7170

11-16-2002, 12:49 AM	#20
billogna Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Choctaw, OK Posts: 235	Fast68Chevy, I have the magazine pages scanned and will email the article to you if you want it. __________________ '69 Chev Cust/10 swb, 350/700R4, 5"/6" '70 Chev C10 swb, 67 front, 454/700r4, 4"/5" '73 Chev stepper, 350/3 spd '84 Chev K20 350/4 spd '91 GMC 1500 Suburban 4x4, 350/700R4

11-16-2002, 08:52 AM	#21
ChevLoRay Old Skool Club Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Benton, AR "The Heart of Arkansas" Posts: 10,880	Harry Bradley is the designer of the '67, just like billogna said. The article is very informative and explains why the changes and the thinking that went into the new design. As for Studebaker engines for '65-66, which were built in Canada don' cha know, they had steel crankshafts (yep, forged) in the 283's. So, if you can find one in good condition you could have the basis for a nice 302 to build....if you can find a good builder 4-inch bore block, with small main journals. Does anyone know if the Checker engines had steel cranks? They also used Chevy engines toward the end of their production. Just curious. The last Checker I saw was on Friends....Phoebe was driving it to the beach house where one of them got stung by a jelly fish and Joey peed on the sting. __________________ Member Nr. 2770 '96 GMC Sportside; 4.3/SLT - Daily driven....constantly needs washed. '69 C-10 SWB; 350/TH400 - in limbo The older I get, the better I was.

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