questions on bagging '67

[The Big Green]

My friends that are bagged told me to stay with a 2-link, and build brackets for the back bags to be mounted further up on my stock 2-link for now. This would allow it to be raised higher. I can use a little help.

[jlaird]

If your'e bagging it, why the need for the extra lift?? None really IMO. Just put the bags in place of your coils and be done with it. There's lots of info here on how do that. Check in the FAQ's under suspension. There is a step by step i think. Good luck!

Here's a link.

[ChiefRocka]

Personally, I would want my suspension to have a nice "lift" to it as well. Closer to the pivot point, IMO, would be a simple way to give you more lift, and drop however much you want.

[Shane]

The small amount of additional lift is not gonna be enough to justify fabricating all the bracketry that is gonna be needed to move the bags from the stock coil spring location.

In other words it's a lot of extra work for very little pay back.

[ChiefRocka]

Well, it all depends on what you want to do. To me, its no big deal to move the bags forward....to some people, even an additional 1" is worth the extra hour or two of fabrication.

Some people are satisfied with laying rocker....then airing up 6" barely clearing anything. Personally, I want that thing to 'lock up' extremely high.

[XXL]

Originally Posted by Shane

The small amount of additional lift is not gonna be enough to justify fabricating all the bracketry that is gonna be needed to move the bags from the stock coil spring location.

In other words it's a lot of extra work for very little pay back.

Actually... you get the benefit of the lever when you move the bags forward... just sliding them up 8" or so will get you an extra couple of inches of overall lift, and you stll get all the drop. When you get ultra-low, every little bit helps. Having said that, the law of diminishing returns is real, and so as you say, it can be lots of work with not a lot of payback.

[The Big Green]

First off, they are talking about moving them halfway up the 2-link. I just want to know if its safe.

You guys that are saying I would get much more lift, did you not take Geometry? I'm pretty sure if I could move them, and do so safely, I would gain a lot of lift. I don't want to bag, and when fully raised be only 6in up. I want to be low, and still get up high when driving down, lets say, a dirtroad.

[Shane]

last sentence of your first post you asked for help ... several folks here offered their input ... now you say they don't know what they are talking about. maybe they don't, but you're probably not gonna get much help by telling them they don't know what they are talking about.

[The Big Green]

Originally Posted by ChiefRocka

Personally, I would want my suspension to have a nice "lift" to it as well. Closer to the pivot point, IMO, would be a simple way to give you more lift, and drop however much you want.

Yes, that's right, more lift, because its closer to the pivot point.




Bad thing about the stock location, is that you can only drop so far, then your sitting on the fully aired out bags, moving would allow to get higher, and sit lower, if thought out, when you mount the bags.

[The Big Green]

Originally Posted by Shane

last sentence of your first post you asked for help ... several folks here offered their input ... now you say they don't know what they are talking about. maybe they don't, but you're probably not gonna get much help by telling them they don't know what they are talking about.

Look again, first post on here, I said "This would allow it to be raised higher.", meaning I know, it would get me higher, but would it be safe, if done right?


Second post, meant nothing bad towards these guys. I juat asked of they had Geometry in school, because it would explain WHY, I would get up higher.


Again, none of the posts meant anything against anyone. Everyone has different advice, and some will agree, and disagree.

[The Big Green]

Is there anyway to keep the stock 2-link, and lay out? It will hit the frame, but not sure how low one can go before it does.


Thanks for your help.

[FnLow69]

every situation is different but it all depends on tire size to see how low you can go. with that said, i would say within 2-4 inch of the ground....

[The Big Green]

Originally Posted by FnLow69

every situation is different but it all depends on tire size to see how low you can go. with that said, i would say within 2-4 inch of the ground....

I have a 275/60/15 now, but want to go to a 255/35/20, maybe. They should be an inch difference, the 60, is 28 something, and 255/35 is 27in. I'm looking into a 20x8 +30, if I'm right, and if it fits, I'm bad with wheels that offer mm offsetting, and not inches...lol. 2inch sounds good, 4in iffy, I want to be pretty low. I do have 2in blocks on the rear. How about the front? I have stock front parts, would I just need spindles, 2, or 3in? I'm not even sure what my truck offers in a spindle.

[XXL]

Originally Posted by The Big Green

You guys that are saying I would get much more lift, did you not take Geometry? I'm pretty sure if I could move them, and do so safely, I would gain a lot of lift.

As a fellow toofless idiot on the board, I don't know this "Geometry" of which you speak, but I do know that...

you can generalize the increased force (and subsequent air pressure on the bag) of moving the bags forward applying the 'moment arm' formula. This indicates that there is an increase in force equal to the fulcrum delta length of the moment arm x the force. The moment arm is the trailing arm, and the delta length of the fulcrum is measured from the pivot point (center xmember) to the stock spring location - the measurment from pivot point to the new spring location.

This, however, is a simplistic model of linear force. Since the pivot point of this lever causes an actual "pivot" to occur, an accurate formula necessarily considers angular rotation (torque). Shall we dive in? Or...

Consider the "weight" the vehicle appears to be on the stock spring location. Know that when you move the spring forward, the truck appears to be getting heavier from the spring's perspective. The more forward, the heavier it gets. How much "weight" do you want to put on those air bags before you're worried about failure? Not concerned yet? Think about how "heavy" the spring thinks the truck is when you hit a bump at speed and the spring as to rebound in a millisecond to address the bump.

If you get into calculations, you'll find you don't want to move the bag very far forward, if at all (as noted earlier, I moved mine forward about 8"-- that's absolutely as far as I'm willing to tax them). Or, get some bags with higher pressure ratings than the "standard" units.

Originally Posted by The Big Green

Is there anyway to keep the stock 2-link, and lay out? It will hit the frame,

I wish people wouldn't call the factory suspension a "2-link." There are 3 obvious links, the third being critical for reducing lateral deflection, which is the bane of a 2-link setup (actually, the existence in the real world of a 2-link vehicle is the bane of thinking people, but that's another toofless discussion for another day).

You will find that the stock trailing arms contact the frame rails long before your frame hits the ground. To learn exactly where, install your tire height of choice, then pull your rear springs and slowly lower the truck with a floor jack until you find that contact point. Happy with the height? Then you're all set. Otherwise, read more posts in this forum.

[dirtyd_nd]

I'm not sure on how much additional lift you want or what bags you plan on using. But I have an full size '89 with an over axle set up and switched to the following bags. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/13-li...mZ250310526204
I had the cali lean when aired up and didn't like it. These gave me the lift that I was looking for. Oh and I've had them on my truck for a little over two years with no problems at all.
Dale

[FnLow69]

they make 2.5" and 3" spindles, did you do the disc brake conversion? as for the front the lower control arm mounts are going to hit the ground before the frame rails will. you need to Z the frame if you wanna lay out. i would still say you'd be in the 2-4 in range...

[Shane]

... or just purchase bags with a taller inflated height

[The Big Green]

Originally Posted by FnLow69

they make 2.5" and 3" spindles, did you do the disc brake conversion? as for the front the lower control arm mounts are going to hit the ground before the frame rails will. you need to Z the frame if you wanna lay out. i would still say you'd be in the 2-4 in range...

I don't have the skill to Z the frame, and I don't think I would anyways. I'd be happy with 2-4in. Yes I have disc.

[The Big Green]

I say 2-link, because I'm simply talking about the (2)links where my bags will be installed, the 3rd has nothing to do with any of this. I can read on link that has further instructions.

Back to this tread.
Ok, I have crappy dial-up, and I try to look things up, but its hard, and takes a lot of time, so I'm sorry...lol.

When I get spindles, I'll go 3in, turn radius doesn't matter, because I hardly drice this truck anymore, but her, gas is going down, so that may change, $2.45 here, but thats a different tread.

As far as bags go, I have the Slam RE-7's all around. I'll just take what you guys said, and mount in the coil places. I can always add, and upgrade things later on.

Whats a cheaper guys fix to getting as low as I can in the back? I can't spend 2 grand more for the back to get lower. I have a step notch, I'm taking, I add cross bars for strength, but whats other things for getting lower?



Whats the inflated height on the RE-7, and deflated. Lets say, stock truck height. I heated my coils, because I had bags on the way, and I wanted to see how low it got. I'm an inch from the frame, lets say I put the bags in place of coils, how much lower can I get without the frame in the way? I'm guessing, maybe 2 more, before I need other things.

[FnLow69]

Min Height 2.9"
Max Height 11"

[The Big Green]

Originally Posted by FnLow69

Min Height 2.9"
Max Height 11"

Thanks. Plus whatever the bag brackets thickness's are. I should have my kit in around a week.

[leftcoast66]

Originally Posted by The Big Green

I say 2-link, because I'm simply talking about the (2)links where my bags will be installed, the 3rd has nothing to do with any of this. I can read on link that has further instructions.

Back to this tread.
Ok, I have crappy dial-up, and I try to look things up, but its hard, and takes a lot of time, so I'm sorry...lol.

When I get spindles, I'll go 3in, turn radius doesn't matter, because I hardly drice this truck anymore, but her, gas is going down, so that may change, $2.45 here, but thats a different tread.

As far as bags go, I have the Slam RE-7's all around. I'll just take what you guys said, and mount in the coil places. I can always add, and upgrade things later on.

Whats a cheaper guys fix to getting as low as I can in the back? I can't spend 2 grand more for the back to get lower. I have a step notch, I'm taking, I add cross bars for strength, but whats other things for getting lower?



Whats the inflated height on the RE-7, and deflated. Lets say, stock truck height. I heated my coils, because I had bags on the way, and I wanted to see how low it got. I'm an inch from the frame, lets say I put the bags in place of coils, how much lower can I get without the frame in the way? I'm guessing, maybe 2 more, before I need other things.

Your gonna find that you will have to mess with the panhard bar, you can't ignore that w/ the drop you want on the stock suspension. You can shorten it, but it will have to be changed, otherwise when you dump it down it will get caught on the bed side because of the arc it is following.

You can do all the calculations in the world, but your still gonna get stuck and have it be completely different when you tear into the truck. Don't worry about all the numbers now. Get your kit in, and then work from there, because not many people remember exact measurements and there are always things where you thought there weren't and issues like that when you tear into the suspension. Not being negative, just being realistic, I've been there done that, had it all planned out, and your plans and time frames will get shot to hell the first time you work on the suspension.

[ENHANCED AIR RIDE]

Just my .02 but these trucks ride awesome with the bags on the stock trailing arms in the stock coils place. I have done dozens and all ride nice with the proper bag. If you want lift the new Dominator bag does 10" of lift 2.9-13.0". I have these setups if needed.

Just my .02 but these trucks ride awesome with the bags on the stock trailing arms in the stock coils place. I have done dozens and all ride nice with the proper bag. If you want lift the new Dominator bag does 10" of lift 2.9-13.0". I have these setups if needed.

Just my 0.02 but I have a dozen or so of these with the bag on the trailing arms in stock coil spot and had great lift and ride quality. I have used the new Dominator bags and they have 10" of travel 2.9-13.0" if lift is a concern. I carry all this if needed.

[ChiefRocka]

Originally Posted by ENHANCED AIR RIDE

Just my .02 but these trucks ride awesome with the bags on the stock trailing arms in the stock coils place. I have done dozens and all ride nice with the proper bag. If you want lift the new Dominator bag does 10" of lift 2.9-13.0". I have these setups if needed.

Originally Posted by ENHANCED AIR RIDE

Just my .02 but these trucks ride awesome with the bags on the stock trailing arms in the stock coils place. I have done dozens and all ride nice with the proper bag. If you want lift the new Dominator bag does 10" of lift 2.9-13.0". I have these setups if needed.

Originally Posted by ENHANCED AIR RIDE

Just my 0.02 but I have a dozen or so of these with the bag on the trailing arms in stock coil spot and had great lift and ride quality. I have used the new Dominator bags and they have 10" of travel 2.9-13.0" if lift is a concern. I carry all this if needed.

OK...we get your point.

[XXL]

Originally Posted by ENHANCED AIR RIDE

I have these setups if needed.

I have these setups if needed.

I carry all this if needed.

Especially the "I'm not a supporting vendor but I'm hawking my wares" part.