basic bagging Q's for my "new" k5...

[rjDub...]

1st off... I'm new to the forum and very new to trucks so let me apologize in advance if any of these questions are stupid or common knowledge... I've been trying to do searches and read up for a while now but there's a few things I'm just unclear on so I figured I'd ask.

I just picked up an '81 2wd K5 Blazer and I wanna get it bagged asap... just wanting to do a basic setup for now since the truck needs a lot of other stuff done, plus I'd still like to be able to haul crap in it and don't really wanna cut the back up too bad (yet) although I love how that looks.

My plan (so far) is 3" drop spindles in the front with some brackets I found on Suicide Doors... and a flip kit in the back with the air over leaf setup. I already have a buncha bag stuff I bought for my other cars and never installed so I'm trying to use what I can from that and keep this on a pretty tight budget.

Blah blah blah... here's my questions.

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1. When I do a search on Summit for spindles by make and model all that comes up for my truck are Belltech and Summit... I'd like to use DJMs since they're a lot cheaper and I've read that they're the same quality. I found some for C10s but I don't know if they have the same front end, would those work for me? Here's a link... C10 DJM 3" Spindles

2. Is there a way to tell how thick my rotor is by VIN# or something or should I just measure it? Not that big of a deal but just curious...

3. I'm having a hard time finding brackets for the air over leaf setup in the back. Really don't wanna drop the money for the AirRideTech kit, and I already have a buncha double convoluted bags laying around I'd like to use instead of having to get more sleeves. Can anybody point me to a bracket that would work for this?

4. I've never messed with a leaf spring rear-end so I'm a little confused with this. I'm planning on doing the flip kit and taking a few leafs out, but I've been reading about people also adding some lowering blocks to get a little lower... and somebody had drop shackles too I believe. I'd like to get it as low as possible with a basic notch but it seems like as close as the axle's gonna be to the frame at some point it's overkill and won't really matter what I add. What's the most I can get? I'll tub it if it's gonna sit on the tires but I don't wanna cut the floor out just get. If I ever go that far I'll do a 4-link but right now I'm trying to keep it simple / cheap-ish. And while I'm at it what flip kit? I was looking at Belltech since it seems to be the lowest (6") but I'm open to WC or DJM or whatever...

5. I forgot 5... hmmm.

Well this aughta get me started... any other advice or recommendations is very much appreciated and thanks in advance to anyone that can help. Oh and here's some pics of the victim... just because threads without pics bore me.





Little rough... I know I should probably be taking care of a few other things before bags but I really wanna get this done before I start driving it too much. Been wanting bags for years and always end up doing everything else BUT the bags. Had compressors and tanks and line and fittings and all this crap sitting in my closet for the last 3+ years so I'm determined to get this done... not used to riding around this high up in the air either.

-Reggie

p.s.
Sorry about the long post... I know I tend to ramble.

[rjDub...]

Ooh... just remembered #5! Do I need shock extenders? I read somebody saying they didn't like their drop shocks and just to stick with the stockers. May try to ride them out a little while either way but if I need to put extenders in there I'd like to do it all at once. Thanks again. =D

[OARNGESI]

thats a really nice blazer you got there heres also what seems like a pretty good deal if your interested i think i seen it on cl for like 800 by the same guy but this the one i found http://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/pts/1325985619.html

[rjDub...]

OARNGESI: First off... thank you for the compliment on my Blazer. You're the first person to say that hahaa... everybody I tell is like "You got what?? You really bought that?!" They just can't see my vision... nice to get some positive feedback from somebody though.

Secondly.... DAMN DAMN DAMNNNN!!! I love that setup... I got a notification on my phone that this thread was updated, read your post, and immediately got my tired a$$ out of bed to contact that guy. I emailed him and text him....... he hit me back and said he shipped it to Amarillo already. I work nights btw if you're wondering why I'm still in bed, I just got there.

Anyway, good lookin' out man... I would've really liked to run that setup but not trying to pay retail for it. Guess it wasn't meant to be. Appreciate it though. I'm going back to sleep lol...

[flamingbig10]

the spindles are the same as trucks but you have to measure what size rotors you have

[N2TRUX]

Originally Posted by rjDub...

...

1. When I do a search on Summit for spindles by make and model all that comes up for my truck are Belltech and Summit... I'd like to use DJMs since they're a lot cheaper and I've read that they're the same quality. I found some for C10s but I don't know if they have the same front end, would those work for me? Here's a link... C10 DJM 3" Spindles

All 73-87's suspension are the same with the exception of the HD brakes. You are correct that the DJM spindles are great quality for a good price.

2. Is there a way to tell how thick my rotor is by VIN# or something or should I just measure it? Not that big of a deal but just curious...

You can look on your SPID in the glove box. It might say, but I would measure to be sure.

3. I'm having a hard time finding brackets for the air over leaf setup in the back. Really don't wanna drop the money for the AirRideTech kit, and I already have a buncha double convoluted bags laying around I'd like to use instead of having to get more sleeves. Can anybody point me to a bracket that would work for this?
A Google search for "Air Over Leaf" will give you several options. Personally I prefer Air Ride Tech because they spend the extra time to engineer kits that work.
I do NOT recommend a doulble convulated bag for an AOL sset up.

4. I've never messed with a leaf spring rear-end so I'm a little confused with this. I'm planning on doing the flip kit and taking a few leafs out, but I've been reading about people also adding some lowering blocks to get a little lower... and somebody had drop shackles too I believe. I'd like to get it as low as possible with a basic notch but it seems like as close as the axle's gonna be to the frame at some point it's overkill and won't really matter what I add. What's the most I can get? I'll tub it if it's gonna sit on the tires but I don't wanna cut the floor out just get. If I ever go that far I'll do a 4-link but right now I'm trying to keep it simple / cheap-ish. And while I'm at it what flip kit? I was looking at Belltech since it seems to be the lowest (6") but I'm open to WC or DJM or whatever...

You can do a flip kit, and a shackle along with blocks. The first concern will be interference with the shackle and filler neck. It will take some mods to make it work.

Your next limitation will be the floor pan. You will have your pumpkin hitting it long before you need to tub it.

Here's pics of my 82 Blazer (Sold it) with the ART 4 link. Even with that small of a notch, the pumpkin hit the floor pan.

[tvblazer78]

Ken just said all the right things..

[rjDub...]

Thanks everyone for all the help... I'm loving this forum already! That being said I'm more confused than ever.

flamingbig10: Thanks for that info... that's what I was hoping. At least I have one easy thing to do.

N2TRUX(Ken?): Thanks for the very detailed response... that's exactly what I needed but waaay more than I expected. Really appreciate you taking the time. Now that you have though I have a few more questions... hope you don't mind.

1. If I did go with the AirRide over leaf kit... would this be the one to get? 3000lb Sideframe Kit...

2. What kind of mods would I have to do to get the shackles to work with the filler neck? I guess I can search it but just figured I'd ask... if it's nothing too major I don't mind moving some stuff around.

3. This is what's really got me on the fence now... that 4-link kit you had, is this it on the RideTech site? Triangulated 4-Link because if so, it's only $150 more than the over leaf setup and it'd negate the need for any flip kits / shackles / blocks etc... and if I'd be able to use the bags I already have it seems like I'd actually come out cheaper in the long run. I just kinda ruled out a 4-link from the jump for cost reasons but with all this I'm finding out maybe it wouldn't actually be that much different? Please let me know what you think about this... I wanted to do a 4-Link down the road and this was gonna be a kinda temp setup while I fixed everything else on the truck, but if it's close to the same $$$ and I can use stuff I already have I'd much rather just do it right now.

Oh and great pics btw... really helps to be able to see everything so clearly like that. Very much appreciated.

tvblazer78(Travis): I love your Blazer man... big fan. Just glad to see you in here. Thanks!

[tvblazer78]

Originally Posted by rjDub...

Thanks everyone for all the help... I'm loving this forum already! That being said I'm more confused than ever.

flamingbig10: Thanks for that info... that's what I was hoping. At least I have one easy thing to do.

N2TRUX(Ken?): Thanks for the very detailed response... that's exactly what I needed but waaay more than I expected. Really appreciate you taking the time. Now that you have though I have a few more questions... hope you don't mind.

1. If I did go with the AirRide over leaf kit... would this be the one to get? 3000lb Sideframe Kit... That looks like that would work.

2. What kind of mods would I have to do to get the shackles to work with the filler neck? I guess I can search it but just figured I'd ask... if it's nothing too major I don't mind moving some stuff around. I have them on mine and you have to add or move the neck out of the way, not hard to do.
3. This is what's really got me on the fence now... that 4-link kit you had, is this it on the RideTech site? He had it custome made I think.[url=http://www.ridetech.com/products/Air4Link_Triangulated-1376-77.html]Triangulated 4-Link[/url] because if so, it's only $150 more than the over leaf setup and it'd negate the need for any flip kits / shackles / blocks etc... and if I'd be able to use the bags I already have it seems like I'd actually come out cheaper in the long run. I just kinda ruled out a 4-link from the jump for cost reasons but with all this I'm finding out maybe it wouldn't actually be that much different? Please let me know what you think about this... I wanted to do a 4-Link down the road and this was gonna be a kinda temp setup while I fixed everything else on the truck, but if it's close to the same $$$ and I can use stuff I already have I'd much rather just do it right now.

Oh and great pics btw... really helps to be able to see everything so clearly like that. Very much appreciated.

tvblazer78(Travis): I love your Blazer man... big fan. Just glad to see you in here. Thanks!

Thank you, I did a air over leaf on my blazer too, I have a flip kit with 2" shackles. Let me see if I can find some pics for you.

Trav

[tvblazer78]

Here is one, the only bad thing the way I did mine is, you can not get it as low as Ken's. So if you do it like Ken's you will get about 1-2 lower then me. Hope that helps.

[N2TRUX]

The 4 link system on that Blazer started life as the ART Triangulated 4 Link. My buddies that did the install added a few changes. The C-notch, boxing plate, and crossmember were custom made.

I will say that in my opinion, the mounting points suggested for the bottom bars were to low. That was later changed. I also feel that the upper bars are not long enough for proper triangulation.

This is important as the degree of triangulation angle is relevant in limiting side to side travel.

I suggest you do some research starting with a phone call to Tony at ART.

This is how low you can go with that set up.

[tvblazer78]

Originally Posted by N2TRUX

The 4 link system on that Blazer started life as the ART Triangulated 4 Link. My buddies that did the install added a few changes. The C-notch, boxing plate, and crossmember were custom made.

I will say that in my opinion, the mounting points suggested for the bottom bars were to low. That was later changed. I also feel that the upper bars are not long enough for proper triangulation.

This is important as the degree of triangulation angle is relevant in limiting side to side travel.

I suggest you do some research starting with a phone call to Tony at ART.

This is how low you can go with that set up.

I would love to change mine up down the road. Maybe after we move next year. Or if some one starts making a kit.

[N2TRUX]

Originally Posted by tvblazer78

I would love to change mine up down the road. Maybe after we move next year. Or if some one starts making a kit.

Why? Yours has a perfect stance with the tire/wheel combo that's on it. Your going to do a lot of work for just a an inch or two.

[tvblazer78]

Originally Posted by N2TRUX

Why? Yours has a perfect stance with the tire/wheel combo that's on it. Your going to do a lot of work for just a an inch or two.

The main thing is for a better ride and ya a little bit lower would be cool too. But like I said down the road.

[rjDub...]

Hey guys... sorry I've been outta touch for a couple days. Busy weekend... thanks again for all the help though.

tvBlazer78: Thanks for finding that pic for me... I was wondering though, with the flip kit and the 2" shackles did you run into the problem with the filler neck Ken was talking about or is that just if you add in a block too? Also, were you running sleeves back there? The bracket in the shot looks like a reg air spring but not sure, thought I remembered someone on here with them on an air over leaf setup... just been reading so much lately it's starting to run together and I can't remember who it was.

I have to agree with Ken too... your ride looks perfect, if I ever got mine that clean I don't think I'd f**k with it at all! I wanna be as low as possible but man... doesn't get much better than yours.

N2Trux: I'm trying to find some time to run by this suspension guy's shop and let him take a look at my Blazer... I can't weld and I know some people are kinda particular about what they work with or they like to piece stuff together themselves. After what you said about the mounting points and the lengths of the bars I figured I'd just go bounce it off of him and see what I'm gonna be looking at for labor etc. Appreciate you letting me know about those issues though... hopefully I can get mine setup similar to your old one without breaking the bank.

I'll keep y'all updated whenever I find anything out... I work nights so it's hard to find time to run around and do this stuff sometimes but I'd like to get it done asap if my limited budget allows it. Probably be back to ask a few more dumb questions in the meantime too... thanks again.

[tvblazer78]

I did move the filler neck a little, but it rubs it a little now. It ok for now, I don't drive it that much anyway. Here is some more pics and plates that I used on the rear end.

[rjDub...]

Thanks! Y'all really make this a great site... I'm not used to getting this much feedback and so fast... really appreciate it.

Another question... I know I know. But you have a flip kit and shackles right? If you'd done 2" lowering blocks instead of shackles would you not have the issue with the filler neck? And is there an advantage to doing the shackles over the blocks that would make it worth the extra work? Just curious... trying to understand all of this.

Also one of the reasons you mentioned switching to the 4-link was for the ride... is it bad now or could it just be better? I'm hopefully gonna be putting some miles on this truck so I'd like it to be kinda comfy. My Caprice rides like a skateboard right now so I'm trying to avoid that. Ken was also saying he wouldn't recommend running reg bags on the back but to use sleeves... does that have anything to do with how the ride is? I've got 8 double convoluted bags in my closet so I was trying to avoid having to buy MORE bags but will if I have to. Still like to do the 4-link but like to know all this stuff so I can balance my options.

Thanks again... the pics really help too. Planning on downloading these to my phone and taking them to the suspension guy so he can see exactly what I'm talking about.

-Reggie

[tvblazer78]

Originally Posted by rjDub...

Thanks! Y'all really make this a great site... I'm not used to getting this much feedback and so fast... really appreciate it.

Another question... I know I know. But you have a flip kit and shackles right? If you'd done 2" lowering blocks instead of shackles would you not have the issue with the filler neck? And is there an advantage to doing the shackles over the blocks that would make it worth the extra work? Just curious... trying to understand all of this. Yep you can do that, I did put 2" blocks in mine and I think I was going to take the shackles out but did not get to it yet. So yes that would be best for you.

Also one of the reasons you mentioned switching to the 4-link was for the ride... is it bad now or could it just be better? I'm hopefully gonna be putting some miles on this truck so I'd like it to be kinda comfy. My Caprice rides like a skateboard right now so I'm trying to avoid that. Ken was also saying he wouldn't recommend running reg bags on the back but to use sleeves... does that have anything to do with how the ride is? I've got 8 double convoluted bags in my closet so I was trying to avoid having to buy MORE bags but will if I have to. Still like to do the 4-link but like to know all this stuff so I can balance my options. The air over leafs ride ok, but you get a lot better ride with a 4 link and sleeve bags. Don't get me worg mine is not a bad ride, but you know you always have to shoot for better. And you can run the bags that you have they will do fine, the sleeve bags can move more then what I have. I think 3"-5" more.
Thanks again... the pics really help too. Planning on downloading these to my phone and taking them to the suspension guy so he can see exactly what I'm talking about.

-Reggie

And no prob that is why we are here to help.

Trav

[N2TRUX]

The pro's suggest that if possible, you want a sleeved bag for the rear. It will give you a smoother ride, and much more travel.

[rjDub...]

I'm definitely keeping that in mind... don't think I'm not listening. Just trying to somewhat stick to a budget since I've got so much other stuff on the truck that actually needs to be taken care of. I keep accumulating bag parts so I really don't want to buy anymore right now if I don't have to. I've got 4 compressors, 8 bags, 3 tanks, 2 different sets of brackets for other cars plus electronic ride controllers and fittings and valves and all that junk. I keep talking to people and ending up with new stuff in the closet, meanwhile nothing's bagged.

I've heard the same thing about the sleeves though as far as ride quality and travel... just a few guys had problems and were cursing them but I'm pretty sure they just weren't setup right. Resting on the bag when the car layed out or not enough exhaust clearance or something... that was for my other cars though.

While we're talking about them though... I looked and I could only find them with 1/4" ports, is that all they come in? How quick do they air up? I've got all 1/2" line and fittings and valves so far... if I did do them I wouldn't want to have my front end pop up and then the back creep up ya know? I'm not trying to dance or hop or anything like that but I did want a somewhat quick setup. Do they just air up quicker than regular bags and there's not a need for a bigger port? Sorry if this is a dumb question...

[tvblazer78]

Originally Posted by rjDub...

I'm definitely keeping that in mind... don't think I'm not listening. Just trying to somewhat stick to a budget since I've got so much other stuff on the truck that actually needs to be taken care of. I keep accumulating bag parts so I really don't want to buy anymore right now if I don't have to. I've got 4 compressors, 8 bags, 3 tanks, 2 different sets of brackets for other cars plus electronic ride controllers and fittings and valves and all that junk. I keep talking to people and ending up with new stuff in the closet, meanwhile nothing's bagged.

I've heard the same thing about the sleeves though as far as ride quality and travel... just a few guys had problems and were cursing them but I'm pretty sure they just weren't setup right. Resting on the bag when the car layed out or not enough exhaust clearance or something... that was for my other cars though.

While we're talking about them though... I looked and I could only find them with 1/4" ports, is that all they come in? How quick do they air up? I've got all 1/2" line and fittings and valves so far... if I did do them I wouldn't want to have my front end pop up and then the back creep up ya know? I'm not trying to dance or hop or anything like that but I did want a somewhat quick setup. Do they just air up quicker than regular bags and there's not a need for a bigger port? Sorry if this is a dumb question...

They are just as fast or faster. Have you ever had a truck/car with air before? If not you will find out the faster it is the harder it is to get it set on a PSI number that you would like to drive at. I had to slow mine down, the back of my blazer just about come off the ground when I first built mine. Just a little heads up.

[rjDub...]

Originally Posted by tvblazer78

...Have you ever had a truck/car with air before? If not you will find out the faster it is the harder it is to get it set on a PSI number that you would like to drive at...

Nope... that's the problem, and why I'm trying to keep from just buying more stuff and not getting it done. I had a hydrolic setup back in '98 but the car got stolen from the shop before I ever got to drive it. And I've been accumulating this bag stuff over the last 3-4 years but stuff keeps happening to stop me from getting it done.

I'd heard that about the levels being hard to adjust if it was too quick.. why I got the lil digital controller thing for the other car so I can just program ride height and not have to worry about it. This one's not gonna have that but I figured it's easy to slow it down, little more work to speed it up. Plan on setting it down slow so I'm not slamming anything on the ground and hoped that'd help with getting my PSI right as well, just want it to get up kinda quick. Didn't wanna spend another $150 on bags and find out they were noticeably slower than the front (would bug the hell out of me) and end up stuck with them or selling for a loss and y'all be like "Oh... you didn't know that? It's a 1/4" port... thought that was obvious." Just want to make sure before I drop the money, especially since I don't really have it to spend in the first place. =/

Did you have sleeves before or just experience with other trucks?