85 crew cab long bed project

[Wincks2]

A thread by one of the rest of us.

This thread would be to rebuild as chevette is to truck.

Many threads here are by people capable of taking a truck apart to its last bolt and then putting it back together.

This thread is by one whose accumulated automotive experience ends at having had a second key set made in case the first were lost.

But, I have recently purchased a great big beautiful old truck to ride my family along in style while pulling our house trailer to some of the lakes in Manitoba and to help my sons learn to maintain a truck.



Several photos are in my album at http://67-72chevytrucks.com/gallery/...y.php?cat=1016

Our truck was purchased from a Manitoba farmer. That means he had a fully equipped work shop. That means that if he wanted to he could take a truck apart to its last bolt and then put it back together. And he wanted to.

And that means he loves trucks. That means he did unusual things to them. Our truck was originally built with a 5.7 liter gas engine. Now it has a 1986 6.2 diesel engine supplemented with a Banks Sidewinder Turbo kit (said to increase horsepower and torque), a torque converter (said to help the transmission originally made for the lesser torque of the 5.7 gas engine handle the greater torque of the 6.2 diesel engine, and a shift kit (said to preserve the transmission by causing it to abruptly switch between gears rather than being simultaneously in two gears at once while slowly switching between gears), and a 1992 belt system.




But I don't really know whether any of what is said is true. In fact, as far as I really know, the 5.7 gas engine could still be in the truck. But Manitoba farmers tend to be good people, so I am confident in believing what has been said. Another thing in which I am confident is that the modifications from stock mean that when they falter I will not be able to rely on the original factory service manuals (which I have ordered).

A local garage has told me there are a number of repairs required to pass the Manitoba safety inspection so I can drive her:

Windshield washer wont spray

Dash lights don't work

Horn does not work.

Sway Bar bracket is bent.

Sway bar bushings need replacing.

Outer tie rods need replacing.

There are also a number of other things I have in mind:

Replace bucket seats with bench so we can drive a sixth person with us.

Replace the seat covers.

Attend to some rust that is present.

Check the trailer and electric brake wiring for pulling out trailer.

Add a missing dome light.

Remove some metal things from the bed that helped a prior owner pull a fifth wheel.

Rewire the truck and rebuild the engine.

Just kidding on those last two.

Probably other things as the need arises or they occur to me.

Folks with experience will probably see plenty of mistakes here as I muddle through. Don't be shy about offering suggestions.

So let the fun, and this thread, begin.

[Wincks2]

Modification 1: Dash instrument panel lights

The service shop that inspected my truck for the provincial safety requirement said the dash instrument panel lights did not work. I recalled driving in from the farm with lights on the instrument panel. I also recalled that the shop had inspected it during the afternoon, possible outdoors with snow everywhere and the bright prairie sun shining off the snow. So, my first repair involved waiting until dark and then turning on the lights. They worked. Job well done! Perhaps I am a natural and am getting the hang of this truck maintenance thing

[Wincks2]

Modification 2: Something to do with the horn.

The horn did not work. When pressed there was a buzzing sound. After a couple of hours of looking around the internet, I guessed the horn may be located up front near the grill. And there it was. Somewhere on the internet was the suggestion of running wires from the battery terminals directly to the wires entering the horn. So, I unscrewed the grill (which had only two screws holding it rather than the five that it looked like it should have based on the holes on the grill that looked like they should have screws in them)



and there was what looked like the pictures of horns. I connected one wire to each of the two battery terminals while the other ends were connected to where the original horn wires entered the horn. It made a sound (and one time also some sparks from the battery terminals - so I suggest doing additional reading about this before trying it).



So, the horn works when electricity reaches it.

I had heard that fuses often wear out and thereby cease allowing electricity to continue along the intended path. In this case, I figured, possibly to the horn. On many fuse boxes (often located under the dash) are labels describing what is affected by each fuse. Sadly on mine some labels are worn off.



Decision time. Be intrepid and figure out a way to understand the fuse box or move on to something else. Like water, I moved on to something less daunting than trying to understand a fuse box. Too bad water and electricity don't mix . Turns out the buzzing was coming from something on a separate fuse box at a point labeled "horn relay". It is the little black box shown below.



A quick internet search suggested these sometimes fail thereby preventing electricity from reaching the horn. But it could also be a broken wire anywhere along the system between the horn relay and the horn. Decision time. Be intrepid and test and follow the wires from the horn relay to the horn or move on to something less daunting. I have a multimeter (which is said to help diagnose electrical problems. So I began by trying to test the wires coming out of the fuse box holding the horn relay. Bad news. There were several wires going in, and none coming out. Or else one or more were going in and one or more were coming out. Or else all were coming out. Or something. Besides, when I did manage to get my multimeter prongs to touch the wires (there is not much room left for moving arms while lying on one's back on the floor of the truck under the dash) it seemed to show a number of readings for a number of different prong insertions. No idea what they mean. (Note to self: learn to work and understand my multimeter) In addition, the wires lead to a lot of other wires which were taped together and leading farther up behind the dash.



That would mean I would have to take off the dash to get to the wires. Conclusion: move on to something less daunting. Hey, rather than see where the electricity stops after it reaches the horn relay, maybe it stops out near the more accessible horn. So, I took off the grill again, and followed the wires from the horn. Bad news. They seemed to emerge from a black tube of other wires. No problem. Some people rebuild trucks. Therefor I could certainly open the tube to inspect the wires. Bad news. Where the horn wires met the other wires was covered by electricians tape. Decision: Be intrepid and remove the tape and perhaps discover which wires the horn wires connect to or move on to something less daunting. Besides, even if I took of the electrician's tape, these little black tubes are hard to open, and to follow it to the fire wall would be difficult and involve cutting or opening several plastic ties tying it to the truck. (I think that with more experience, these things wont be as daunting.) So, maybe it is the horn relay after all. Off to the parts store for a new horn relay. Unplugged the old horn relay and plugged in the new. Bad news, no longer any buzzing, just a faint click when I push the steering wheel horn pad. Major disappointment. Somewhere I had read that a clicking sound wasn't a definitive answer to the question of whether the thing works. So, back to the drawing board.

Hey, although my official shop repair manual has not yet arrived, and so I can't confirm whether my fuse box is original or a modification, perhaps, I thought, I could photograph it and ask the nice people here whether it looks familiar. Than I realized that, although the labels are illegible, the fuses are not. Somewhere on the internet was written that the horn fuses are often a 15 amp fuse. So I began pulling out each 15 amp fuse to see whether it was broken. The second one was broken.



Happened to have some 15 amp fuses handy. Stuck one in. Tried the horn. And the dome light suddenly worked too. So I guess both the horn and the dome light rely on electricity going through the same fuse.

[Wincks2]

Modification 3: Replace seized air conditioner compressor with a by-pass pulley

The air conditioner compressor had a circular spinning thing on the front around which ran the belt. When the compressor seized, the belt would be pulled over a non-moving thing and quickly wear out. So I had to find a replacement compressor or at least the circular thing on the front of it that the belt goes around.

The compressor was a couple of hundred bucks for a refurbished one and more for a new one. None of over a dozen yards around here had an 85 truck from which I could get a replacement (and I didn't want to look to other trucks that the internet said used the same compressor because at the time I had not taken the compressor off of my truck so I didn't have the original to carry around yards looking for a match). On our truck the air conditioning had been disconnected by a prior owner. Fine with us as we prefer 2 x 60 air conditioning. So on our truck the compressor was used only to hold the spinning circular thing. Turns out there are things called by-pass pulleys that replace the non-working compressor and the spinning circular thing. Mine cost about 70 bucks. You can see it in the picture as the new looking gray metal thing holding the circular shaped pulley on the left around which the belt now runs.



All I had to do was unscrew the old compressor from the engine and screw this by-pass pulley in in its place. In the photo above the old compressor, with the spinning thing on its front, is held above the new by-pass pulley.

So, if your air conditioning compressor seizes or the bearings holding the spinning thing jam, and you don't mind riding with the windows open, this by-pass pulley seems like a pretty slick alternative. Just like an older truck - fewer moving parts means fewer things to go wrong.

My belt system may not look normal for the 86 6.2 diesel engine. The farmer told me the owner before him had replaced the original belt system with one from a 1992 engine. Next time I see him, I should ask him why. Here is the 92 belt system (with the cool new bypass pulley on the left) on the 86 engine.

[tswore]

looks like a fun project. Your play-by-play auto repair commentary made me laugh, keep up the good work. No better way to learn than to jump right in!

[Wincks2]

Thanks for your encouragement. If all goes well, including parts ordered from the States that I couldn't find in Canada, She might even be legal to drive here within two weeks.

By the way, last night I was admiring your work shortening the frame on your project. That will turn a lot of heads.

[joe231]

Man i love your posting, very entertaining.
just remember that everyone started somewhere, and these trucks are as good as any to start with

oh and we all are here to help

[Stitch]

just FYI, that IS a 6.2l with a Banks sidewinder turbo kit on it and a serpentine pulley system off a newer truck...very nice upgrades and look to all be done well...

[Wincks2]

Thanks guys for letting me know.

After it is mechanically sound, the rust will need attention. Not much there. They don't use much salt on the country roads where she has been. Now in the city she will see some.

I hope to remove the current rust and then try to prevent future rust.

The farmer said he had considered coating the first few inches along the bottom with a rust protector coating.

I suppose it would go in an even width (I suppose the width from the truck's bottom to the bottom of the doors) all along the bottom of the metal, even over the wheel areas. Sort of like about an 8 inch wide stripe of some rubber compound running all along the bottom of the truck.

I suppose it could be matched or color coordinated with the truck's current or future color.

On the internet I have seen people doing frame off restorations remove rust from the frames and then coat them in rust preventing compound or paint. So, I suppose, it would be possible to apply something similar to the entire underside of the truck if all of the dirt and rust were first removed.








One particularly bad spot where I guess I will be ordering new body panels as the hole goes all the way through and we can see the ground:




Is it common to apply rust deterrent in this way? Completely cover the underside and also up several inches all along the body? Is there a reason it isn't commonly done?

The plastic things over the wheel wells on some trucks seem to let water and salt collect behind and cause rust at the edges of those plastic things. Maybe the same thing would happen along the upper edge of this anti-rust coat.

[Wincks2]

Reprinted official service manual has arrived and the local library has been raided. Somehow I still have the feeling that I have more to fear than fear itself. But, I can read, and the manual description of changing the outer tie rod ends looks doable. So will probably start there while waiting for sway bar bracket and bushings to arrive from the States.

[Wincks2]

Modification: Washer pump

My washer pump sits in an indentation behind the washer fluid container.

It has a tube at the very bottom that sucks the fluid from the container.

It has a tube near the bottom that the fluid goes through to enter the tube that goes up to the windshield.

It has a plug on the top that plugs into a connection on the end of a wire that, I guess, comes from the battery and the windshield washer fluid control on the lever near the steering wheel.



I took off the canister and took out the pump and listened while I had a friend turn the controller on. No sound. So I unplugged the pump from the wire and used a multimeter to to test the plug on the wire to learn whether electricity was getting to the plug. It was. So, I suspected the pump.

But buying a new pump would involve expense and learning from the horn relay affair I thought to first check the tube going to the windshield. Perhaps it was blocked. Very difficult to see the very end of that tube. It forks into two and goes up under the metal screen between the hood and the windshield.



Looking at the bolts and screws holding that screen in place, I again moved to avoid what appeared to be the real work of removing the screen and instead began to suspect the pump again.

But due to the horn relay affair I first tested to see whether the tube was blocked by assuming the pump worked regardless of my earlier sound test. I put the pump's bottom tube back into the canister, plugged the pump back in, added fluid to the canister, then had my friend turn on the pump with the controller near the steering wheel. Nothing came out up by the windshield. But I figured if there were a block up by the windshield, and the pump worked, there would be fluid in the tube leading to the windshield. So I pulled the tube leading to the windshield off of the pump. When very little fluid flowed out I assumed the pump had not put any into the tube. So, I figured I needed a new pump.

The local suppliers had pumps they said would work, but each pump looked different from the old one. Then I saw in a mail order catalog a drawing of a pump that looked just like mine. As their catalog seemed exclusively about my type of truck, I took a chance and ordered their pump. It arrived today and works just fine causing fluid to spray on my windshield.





The pump came in a box with the ordered sway bar bracket, bushings, rivets, and dome light cover. So the mechanical work should begin tomorrow. The bracket to frame is bent and held onto the frame with rivets.



Learning to chisel, hammer, grind, and/or drill the old rivets off and then use a ball-peen hammer on the buck-tail end of the new rivets to add the new bracket should be interesting.

[TheSunDanceKid]

cool find
check with your local emissions on those things i work for the arizona emissions as an inspector and not a single thing that local shop said you need is checked here
the only things you need on an older truck is a cat evap carbon test from the tail pipe and a check on the gas cap and tank pressure if the original emissions lable from the factory doesnt say it came with a cat or evap then its not required

if its a car above 96 all we do is check it threw the obd 2 connector for codes and make sure the check engin light is funtioning and of course on all cars the gas cap is checked
give them a call and they have to tell you what is required for the truck in your state

[Wincks2]

Thanks TheSunDanceKid

Will call our public insurer.

Modification: Replace frame bracket and sway bar bushings (Part 1)

This bent frame bracket had to be replaced:



It had pulled the driver side end out of the bushing. Decided to replace all four bushings.

Had to remove one of the bushings to reach the frame bracket.


Began with a breaker bar and wrench:



Lesson learned #1: That righty tighty lefty loosy concept is a lot more complicated while simultaneously working on both ends of the bolt.

These things were on harder than I had guessed.

Lesson learned #2: Use chemistry if possible. In this case liquid wrench to loosen things up:




That let me eventually use my new ratchet set



Although it took a long time because about half of the time I was accidentally doing righty loosy lefty tighty or something, with science and leverage the bushings and brackets came off pretty well. The first one too well and quickly.

Lesson learned #3: Never lie beneath what you are unscrewing.

[Wincks2]

Modification: Replace frame bracket and sway bar bushings (Part 2)

Sway bar is off:



I immediately carried it over to show my kids.

Lesson learned: When you remove pieces that could go back either upside down or upside right and either left to right or right to left, label them so you know which way they go back on the truck.

Next was the frame bracket.

On this board I had read rivets could be removed with a cold chisel and hammer.



This I tried.

For too long.

I've a vague recollection of, at some point during those hours, floating above my body as it lay under the truck. I thought I saw, in the fog of exhaustion, tears and despondency, as final desperate measures my body's nose twitch, then my body fold its arms, nod its head, and blink its eyes, both to no avail. That rivet wasn't budging.

Crawling out from under the truck then crawling into the kitchen for water and a pain killer I remembered reading that an alternative to the cold chisel is a grinder. I happen to have an angle grinder.

It worked great!




Here is what it did to the rivet head:



Lesson learned #4: Use electricity if possible. It works like magic ... doesn't.

Between a grinder and a cold chisel, I go with grinder:



In this case the rivet head was next to the bracket I was removing. So the accidental damage to the surrounding metal didn't matter. I guess if the rivet head were next to the frame or a part I were going to reuse, the grinder might not have been an option. On this board there was also a suggestion to use a grinder or something to cut the head into four parts, then to use the chisel to remove the parts. So, maybe I didn't give the chisel a fair shot.

Several hours after this experience I also read that cold chisels could be sharpened

After the rivet head was gone I removed the bent bracket. This left me with an exposed portions of the rivets.



I hit it with a hammer to try to pop it out. Then I remembered that rivets are soft metal and thought that hammering it may just put another head on it.

On this board is a suggestion to drill up the middle of the rivet. I did this for a couple of hours.

Lesson learned: Drill bits designed for wood working don't work well on steel.

Eventually, after using successively wider drill bits, then using the cold chisel to collapse the exposed sides away from the surrounding frame to decrease the amount of rivet metal touching the frame, I used a metal tool for insetting nails in hardwood, stuck that up into the rivet head, and was able to punch it out, after laying under the truck for most of a day and doing much swinging of my big orange mallet.

Lesson learned: The sound of your first rivet popping out is beautiful.



One thing I can say for using the mallet and chisel for most of a couple of days: This morning when I stumbled into the bathroom for another pain killer I was shocked to see in the mirror, for the first time in my life, a body with a chest and shoulders and upper arms.

But my guess is it is temporary swelling.

[Wincks2]

Watching her white exhaust fumes I decided to name our diesel truck, "Old Smokey".

Tie Rods

Decided to replace tie rods before adding frame bracket and sway bar as there would be easier access to the tie rods without the sway bar.

Read somewhere that wheels had to be removed before doing tie rods. So,



This required putting Smokey up in the air. Which required using a jack and jack stands. Which required chipping away the ice under Smokey.



My first truck up in the air! Note the use of four jack stands. One can't be too careful.



Four jack stands or not, no sense being reckless. Note the use of a long breaker bar to allow me to work under Old Smokey without actually being under Old Smokey.



Alas, this state of grace was not to last.

Some work need careful manipulation and close access to the tie rods.



At some point someone had to actually get under Old Smokey and hope the jack stands would do their jobs. Both my sons declined. So it was left to me.

The official manual suggests using a hammer and a heavier hammer to dislodge the tie rods. Nonsense. After trying the suggested method, I went with a pickle fork and Big Orange.



Lesson learned: Sometimes the official manual omits information.

[Wincks2]

New inner and outer tie rods and sleeve:



The driver side threads are at 8 and the passenger side threads are at 13. Seems to me I should have changed both to 10 or 11 to make everything even. But a couple people I asked said 8 and 13 are fine. So, I left them as they were.

Then I installed the new frame bracket and sway bar bushings:



So, I had fixed everything that had been identified for the provincial safety inspection. Just to be safe I checked everything one more time.

And this happened:



Still haven't figured out how changing the tie rods caused my windshield wiper sprayer to spray out over my hood.

So, looked up how to fix it.

Tried pulling the wiper back and using the spring to remove the wiper blade. Wasn't sure whether I was doing it right. Then I found a youtube video of a guy removing a blade from a blazer.

Lesson learned: Sometimes the correct way of removing things is to simply pry them off.

Two days of laying on my back under Old Smokey later, everything was in and it was off to the provincial safety inspection office.

Old Smokey passed!

[Wincks2]

Got her home and was going to take the kids for a celebratory cruise.

Ever since we got her Old Smokey had been difficult to start, so I suspected I would have to do some work on the glow plug system. But on this night, the button installed to turn on the glow plugs didn't cause the traditional clunking sound from under the hood.

So no celebratory ride, and I would have to look into this glow plug system.

Several diagnostic procedures are in my manuals.

I decided to try the simplest as I understood it. It was to use an ohmmeter to test each of the glow plugs. First I noticed that two of them were not even plugged in.

The ohmmeter readings showed that one did not work. So I removed it.

and noticed that its tip was missing.

I knew from earlier reading that missing glow plug tips is not good.

Now it looks like to retrieve it from the pre-combustion chamber or cylinder I will have to remove the exhaust manifold, intake manifold, rocker arm cover, and heads.

Hmmm. Not on my original to do list.

Lesson learned: Now I know why these are called projects.

Funny thing about the glow plug. On it it says 11 volts. My reading suggests the 6.2 engine uses a 6 volt plugs. One manual says the 6 volt plugs are fast glowers and the 11 volt plugs are slow glowers. It also says that when 11 volt slow glowers are used in a 6 volt fast glow system, they wont warm up enough to reach the temperatures required for combustion.

In fact, my ohm readings on all of the plugs were between 1 and 2 ohms. The manual says those readings are acceptable for 11 volt slow glowers. The 6 volt fast glowers are to measure under 1 ohm.

So it looks like someone put the wrong glow plugs in the 6.2 engine.

That would explain the engine not starting well in the cold.

Yikes! I am going to try to remove remove the exhaust manifold, intake manifold, rocker arm cover, and heads to retrieve a broke glow plug tip from a pre-combustion chamber or cylinder!

OK, No more Mr. Nice guy.

[joe231]

I give this thread
nice work and determination

[Stitch]

you might want to check the Diesel Place before you go tearing everything apart for that glowplug tip...you might be able to find out how to get it out without removing all of that...at the very least, you could post a thread and see if anyone could help you...

[Wincks2]

Thanks.

Will do.

[81K5Blazer]

Awesome thread! Nice looking truck!
I am kinda new to all of this too. I bought my K5 "in good shape" about 2 years ago and have so far done all types of little things. I did manage to take off the heads and have them rebuilt, even put on a new intake and somehow rebuilt the carb (although I haven't got the carb back on yet so we will see how that works out ). Anyway good to see another who is learning as he goes like I am. Although reading on this site I am starting to feel a little more confident in my abilities, which could be a bad thing as I tend to jump head first into stuff. Frame off here I come!

[Wincks2]

Hey great! There are at least a couple of us here!

Love your blue and white blazer.

If I can get Old Smokey running well enough to let us camp this summer, I might be brave enough to try to find a blazer to drive through the winter. Looks big and safe and unlike Smokey we would be able to fit it in a parking space downtown.

[Stitch]

Originally Posted by Wincks2

Thanks.

Will do.

looks like you made it over there alright...did you find out about getting that tip out...

also, being that you're a Canuck, I'd replace your glow plugs with some 60gs and replace that crusty relay you have with a new ford starter relay...you're talking total around $110 US dollars for that stuff and you won't have to worry about it again...

[bluex]

Wincks2

Your orange hammer is not suited to pounding out rivits. It is more for hitting things you dont want to mess up and is generally called a dead-blow or soft face hammer. Next time you want to drive something out your not worried about messing up use a small 2 lb sledge hammer or a ball peen.

[Wincks2]

Thanks Fat Hoe,

Hope to go after the tip tomorrow. Have posted results of my reading at http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=393548

Yes, those self limiting plugs sound idiot proof - making them ideal for my application.

Thanks bluex, Happen to have acquired a ball peen recently. Will give it a try the next time serious hammering is required.