Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

BLT-NT-BOT · 03-19-2010, 07:22 PM

Im wondering what you guys think is better factory or aftermarket ac. As far as which one is cheaper, colder, easier, just all around the best way to go. Thanks in advance.

cdowns · 03-19-2010, 07:56 PM

new aftermarket stuff is far more efficent and robs less horsepower MPG
both will cool a well sealed insulated cab just fine

cparman · 03-19-2010, 09:36 PM

I agree with CDOWNS. I have Classic auto air in my 69 C-10, and in NE Fla it is 35 degrees at the vents. IMO the aftermarket pushes more air thru the vents. The OE can be troublesome because of availability of replacement parts. The negative to aftermarket is there is not a " blend'. Meaning that all of the a/c is full recirculation. The OE's have a way to allow fresh air to be cooled, but still allow outside air in. My 72 Blazer will have Classic air when finished. This old fat man wants to be cool, and LOOK cool driving a Blazer that is almost as old as I am.

Todersauce · 03-19-2010, 10:14 PM

There is really no difference, it is a chemical reaction of the freon gas that is the same in a new system or and old system. There are 5 major parts to a ac system the compressor, evaporator, condenser, dryer/accumulator, and expansion valve/ccot. The Huge difference is the freon. Pre 1995 the auto industry used all R12 freon. Post 1995 everyone uses R134 freon. Old R12 systems can use new R134 freon with a few adjustments. If you have a working R12 system you can convert it to R134 or have it converted. The main reason is the cost of the freon. R12 is spendy if you can get it, $75 per pound and R134 is much less about $12 and easy to get almost anywhere. A new compressor most likely won’t cost you as much horsepower to run and work better, but most old compressors can be rebuilt and work as good as a new one for less $$$.

In my opinion both are equal it depends on how deep your pockets are and your skill level. If you like new and shiny with the bells and buttons go new. If not go with the old stuff

chipflyer · 03-19-2010, 10:57 PM

It really depends on what you are building. As the others have said they both work well. I am into the stock look and put mine back as original and it works great, but again I wanted the original look. If I were building a custom I would definitely go aftermarket with the newer style components and not deal with the ugly old stuff that isn't as efficient from over 40 years ago.

Jeff

tcb-1 · 03-19-2010, 11:35 PM

imho, the aftermarket systems take up less space under the hood and, from what I have heard, is a bit more dependable and user friendly than the original Harrison units.

**70cst** · 03-19-2010, 11:42 PM

It also depends if one wants to keep the truck as close to factory as possible. To rebuild an OE AC will cost about the same as a new aftermarket AC system. I wanted to keep the Circuit Rider as close to stock as possible so I went with the OE AC system. If that wasn't important to me I would have gone aftermarket. JMHO

ERASER5 · 03-20-2010, 04:43 AM

Are you planning to drive your truck in the winter? If not, then the aftermarket stuff is great. If you are going to drive the truck, you will be disappointed with the aftermarket stuff. Not with the AC part, that is great, the heating part will be the trouble.

The V in HVAC is Ventilation. The aftermarket stuff does not vent, it only recirculates. In the winter, this will fog you windshield. You need outside air to keep the windshield clear. Every OEM, every single one, uses outside fresh air for heat. The fellows down south can get away with recirculated air. Us northerners cannot.

The recirculation only system do have their good, maybe great, points too. No outside air means that you can do a slick smoother cowl. Vent doors can be sealed and smoothed. Air boxes can be re-purposed to hide the AC/heater lines, wiring, fuse boxes.

For a winter driven truck, go with the OEM system. If you are parking the truck for the winter, go with what ever you want.

Just my 12+ years developing/testing HVAC stuff for F**D.

**70cst** · 03-20-2010, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ERASER5

Are you planning to drive your truck in the winter? If not, then the aftermarket stuff is great. If you are going to drive the truck, you will be disappointed with the aftermarket stuff. Not with the AC part, that is great, the heating part will be the trouble.

The V in HVAC is Ventilation. The aftermarket stuff does not vent, it only recirculates. In the winter, this will fog you windshield. You need outside air to keep the windshield clear. Every OEM, every single one, uses outside fresh air for heat. The fellows down south can get away with recirculated air. Us northerners cannot.

The recirculation only system do have their good, maybe great, points too. No outside air means that you can do a slick smoother cowl. Vent doors can be sealed and smoothed. Air boxes can be re-purposed to hide the AC/heater lines, wiring, fuse boxes.

For a winter driven truck, go with the OEM system. If you are parking the truck for the winter, go with what ever you want.

Just my 12+ years developing/testing HVAC stuff for F**D.

Good info...I never thought about fog city.

big_al_71 · 03-20-2010, 08:49 AM

I went with "Classic Auto Air" and in the miami heat it blows a cool 37 degrees and I have to keep it at medium speed because how cold it gets in there. It is super compact and I did not put the heater part in as in miami there is zero need for heat. Then install was super easy and clean...

BLT-NT-BOT · 03-20-2010, 09:10 AM

Thanks guys for all your input. I was also wondering if I can leave the factory system in and change the compressor to a new one that mounts low. My only concern with doing that is the hoses, will the old hoses work on a new compressor. When I say new I mean a Sanden compressor. Or will I have to get custom hoses made. What else needs to be updated to run R134a.

BLT-NT-BOT · 03-20-2010, 09:12 AM

Also I live in Utah, I dont think I will be driving this in the winter much but if I do I would like the heat and defrost to work.

mrein3 · 03-20-2010, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BLT-NT-BOT

Thanks guys for all your input. I was also wondering if I can leave the factory system in and change the compressor to a new one that mounts low. My only concern with doing that is the hoses, will the old hoses work on a new compressor. When I say new I mean a Sanden compressor. Or will I have to get custom hoses made. What else needs to be updated to run R134a.

You need to make ONE adjustment to make your current (OE) system work with R134a. Follow this link:
http://www.autoacforum.com/messagevi...&threadid=7567
It is WAY cheaper making your OE system work with R134a than to purchase an aftermarket system.
Do the procedure in the link above then:
Replace all your o-rings (approximately $10 at ackits)
Purchase a new receiver/dryer (about $40)
New hose assembly ($90 or so from LMC or other)
Get R134a at Wal*Mart. $3-$12/can. Get 4.
Purchase a bottle of R134a compatible oil - ackits has this on their website.

Flush everything. Fill everything with oil. The service manual tells you how much. Total is 10-12 ounces.

Evacuate the system. Fill with R134a. Use your extra $900 you saved over an aftermarket system to buy some really cool wheels or start paying on your kid's orthodontist bill.

I don't work for ackits, LMC, or Wal*Mart

*Shane* · 03-20-2010, 09:41 AM

Hey Al, can you use the stock control panel/unit with the Classic Auto Air kit or does it require their control panel/unit?

Thanks!

**leddzepp** · 03-20-2010, 11:14 AM

If you want fresh air to come into the cab while running the heater in an aftermarket system, simply reach down and pull open the drivers side air vent in the kick panel. Fogging problem solved.

suville · 03-20-2010, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leddzepp

If you want fresh air to come into the cab while running the heater in an aftermarket system, simply reach down and pull open the drivers side air vent in the kick panel. Fogging problem solved.

Do you know if the vacuum operated vent on the pass. side can be made operational thru the heat/defrost control lever? I've researched most of the aftermarket units and am most impressed with Classic Auto Air for the simple reason they are (to my current knowledge) the only unit to use two separate coils one for heat one for cool just as the factory units. those of you using CAA have you smoothed the firewall and do you have any pics? I'd like to do my firewall but dont have the ching for a AC unit just now so it would be most helpful if I could see how you did yours. Thanks

**leddzepp** · 03-20-2010, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by suville

Do you know if the vacuum operated vent on the pass. side can be made operational thru the heat/defrost control lever? I've researched most of the aftermarket units and am most impressed with Classic Auto Air for the simple reason they are (to my current knowledge) the only unit to use two separate coils one for heat one for cool just as the factory units. those of you using CAA have you smoothed the firewall and do you have any pics? I'd like to do my firewall but dont have the ching for a AC unit just now so it would be most helpful if I could see how you did yours. Thanks

Are you talking about the top lever on a factory A/C system? That is the one that controls inside/outside airflow, via a vacuum switch. All the way to the left is for A/C (pass side kick panel open for recirc, cowl vent closed) To the right is for heat (kick panel vent closed, cowl vent open for outside air) The other two levers operate cables.

big_al_71 · 03-20-2010, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shane

Hey Al, can you use the stock control panel/unit with the Classic Auto Air kit or does it require their control panel/unit?

Thanks!

The kit requires that you use your factory lever unit. My truck did not have a/c so I used the heater control unit. I think I could had bought one from the but you dont really need to.shane here are a couple of picts from when we were installing it.

ERASER5 · 03-20-2010, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leddzepp

If you want fresh air to come into the cab while running the heater in an aftermarket system, simply reach down and pull open the drivers side air vent in the kick panel. Fogging problem solved.

I'll take that as a joke. 0 degree air blowing on my leg. That's what I want.

A complete flush is OK, but not absolutely necessary. The mineral oil will just lay in the lowest point.

Every unit has a separate core for heat and cool.

Outside air for our trucks comes from the cowl. Smooth the cowl, no vents.

The vacuum controlled vent door part of the fresh air/recirc source, but some or all of that fresh air is then routed through the heater core. How much air is heated is determined by the temp selector.

*Shane* · 03-20-2010, 11:16 PM

Awesome Al! Thank you for the info & the pics!

Ryan Hubbard · 03-21-2010, 12:19 AM

When I installed my Vintage Air system in my truck, I did not block off the passenger side vent. I converted it to a manual opening vent just so I could open the vent when I needed fresh air and since the vent is right near the intake for the Vintage Air it works well for defrosting windows. But that is the one drawback to the aftermarket AC systems in not having a fresh air option.

**thelonerife** · 03-21-2010, 12:25 AM

I put vintage air on my truck and love it! I'll put it on every truck now. The older compressors will leak oil out of the clutch eventually and seem to take more from the motor imo.

4x4Poet · 03-21-2010, 01:50 AM

I'm also dissapointed in aftermarket A/C systems for our trucks that don't use cowl fresh air.

But I wonder if a little simple duct work would make either cowl or pass side vent fresh air flow through the evaporator. For the side vent, a drawback might be less leg room to accomodate the vent ducting. A fresh air/recirc flapper would be a greater challenge for the side vent.

Anyway BLT-, Since you have the factory system, to use R134 you just need to go throught the conversion process above to use R134. To use a Sanden compressor, the R134 conversion hoses must have correctly routed and configured compressor hose fittings since any retro-fit R134 hoses configured for the OEM piston compressor will have the wrong fittings and metal line bends for a Sanden. Hose lengths required can also differ.

Most A/C hose makers can make R134 hoses for Chevy trucks to SBC/BBCs. They'll need to know the truck, engine, pulley system, compressor location, etc. before making up a set. Classic Auto Air, Vintage Air, etc. can make up a set if local sources can't.

I prefer R12 for its superior cooling ability, but, as stated above, R134 can easily handle a pickup cab. I use R134 barrier lined hoses even for refurbishing an R12 system since they are superior for stopping leaks and the cost is comparable to non-barrier R12 hoses.

**leddzepp** · 03-21-2010, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ERASER5

I'll take that as a joke. 0 degree air blowing on my leg. That's what I want.

If you are wearing pants its not a problem.

Tkmadone · 03-21-2010, 11:16 AM

When I got my C20 it had the factory air stuff on the body but nothing on the engine. I bought all the stuff from here:

http://www.nostalgicairparts.com/

I believe I spent about $300, which included brackets, a new compressor, hoses, and the valve replacement thingie.

I work quite well, blowing 36 degrees. My only complaint is the factory center vent in the dash. It only blows straight ahead, which is annoying. I'm considering replacing it with 2 vents so I can aim one at myself and one at the passenger.

03-19-2010, 07:22 PM	#1
BLT-NT-BOT Registered User Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Lehi,UT Posts: 804	Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C Im wondering what you guys think is better factory or aftermarket ac. As far as which one is cheaper, colder, easier, just all around the best way to go. Thanks in advance.

03-19-2010, 07:56 PM	#2
cdowns Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: daytonabeach Posts: 22,956	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C new aftermarket stuff is far more efficent and robs less horsepower MPG both will cool a well sealed insulated cab just fine __________________ 71c-10 350/2004r/4:11 lowered3/4 longbed/dead by hurricane MEANING OF DEATH::::: SOMEBODY ELSE GETS YOUR STUFF DONT BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU THINK TAKE MY ADVISE;I DON'T USE IT ANYWAY

03-19-2010, 09:36 PM	#3
cparman sharp as a marble Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: atlantic beach,florida Posts: 1,082	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C I agree with CDOWNS. I have Classic auto air in my 69 C-10, and in NE Fla it is 35 degrees at the vents. IMO the aftermarket pushes more air thru the vents. The OE can be troublesome because of availability of replacement parts. The negative to aftermarket is there is not a " blend'. Meaning that all of the a/c is full recirculation. The OE's have a way to allow fresh air to be cooled, but still allow outside air in. My 72 Blazer will have Classic air when finished. This old fat man wants to be cool, and LOOK cool driving a Blazer that is almost as old as I am.

03-19-2010, 10:14 PM	#4
Todersauce Registered User Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Idaho Posts: 34	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C There is really no difference, it is a chemical reaction of the freon gas that is the same in a new system or and old system. There are 5 major parts to a ac system the compressor, evaporator, condenser, dryer/accumulator, and expansion valve/ccot. The Huge difference is the freon. Pre 1995 the auto industry used all R12 freon. Post 1995 everyone uses R134 freon. Old R12 systems can use new R134 freon with a few adjustments. If you have a working R12 system you can convert it to R134 or have it converted. The main reason is the cost of the freon. R12 is spendy if you can get it, $75 per pound and R134 is much less about $12 and easy to get almost anywhere. A new compressor most likely won’t cost you as much horsepower to run and work better, but most old compressors can be rebuilt and work as good as a new one for less $$$. In my opinion both are equal it depends on how deep your pockets are and your skill level. If you like new and shiny with the bells and buttons go new. If not go with the old stuff

03-19-2010, 10:57 PM	#5
chipflyer Registered User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Topeka, Ks Posts: 2,293	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C It really depends on what you are building. As the others have said they both work well. I am into the stock look and put mine back as original and it works great, but again I wanted the original look. If I were building a custom I would definitely go aftermarket with the newer style components and not deal with the ugly old stuff that isn't as efficient from over 40 years ago. Jeff __________________ I'm not a pessimist, I'm just optimistic that bad things are going to happen. 1971 Cheyenne Super K10 - tilt, cruise, air, am/fm, tow hooks, factory buckets! 1986 Jeep J10 pickup, - 5.3L Vortec with 4L60e and NP241.

03-19-2010, 11:35 PM	#6
tcb-1 Nothing to see here..... Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Shawnee, KS Posts: 4,625	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C imho, the aftermarket systems take up less space under the hood and, from what I have heard, is a bit more dependable and user friendly than the original Harrison units. __________________ Doug THANK YOU to our American Soldiers & Veterans - POW MIA "You will NEVER be forgotten". The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. Thomas Jefferson Last edited by tcb-1; 03-19-2010 at 11:52 PM.

03-19-2010, 11:42 PM	#7
70cst Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: New Madison, Ohio Posts: 21,372	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C It also depends if one wants to keep the truck as close to factory as possible. To rebuild an OE AC will cost about the same as a new aftermarket AC system. I wanted to keep the Circuit Rider as close to stock as possible so I went with the OE AC system. If that wasn't important to me I would have gone aftermarket. JMHO __________________ A husband can be right...or...A husband can be happy. 67-72 Chevy and GMC Trucks...The Classic Truck for the Classic Folk. 1970 CST Two tone green, 402BB, 400 Automatic, Tach, Buckets, AC, AM-FM, Tilt, GM CB, GM 8 Tract, LWB, etc JOHN 17:3...The better side of "LIFE" Remember: Everyday is a good day...Some are just gooder!

03-20-2010, 04:43 AM	#8
ERASER5 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Indiana Posts: 4,859	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C Are you planning to drive your truck in the winter? If not, then the aftermarket stuff is great. If you are going to drive the truck, you will be disappointed with the aftermarket stuff. Not with the AC part, that is great, the heating part will be the trouble. The V in HVAC is Ventilation. The aftermarket stuff does not vent, it only recirculates. In the winter, this will fog you windshield. You need outside air to keep the windshield clear. Every OEM, every single one, uses outside fresh air for heat. The fellows down south can get away with recirculated air. Us northerners cannot. The recirculation only system do have their good, maybe great, points too. No outside air means that you can do a slick smoother cowl. Vent doors can be sealed and smoothed. Air boxes can be re-purposed to hide the AC/heater lines, wiring, fuse boxes. For a winter driven truck, go with the OEM system. If you are parking the truck for the winter, go with what ever you want. Just my 12+ years developing/testing HVAC stuff for F*D. __________________ '70 GMC C1500 LWB Power disc brakes. WooHoo! Posi 6 Lug Dana 60 Last edited by ERASER5; 03-20-2010 at 04:44 AM.*

03-20-2010, 08:49 AM	#10
big_al_71 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: South Florida Posts: 11,375	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C I went with "Classic Auto Air" and in the miami heat it blows a cool 37 degrees and I have to keep it at medium speed because how cold it gets in there. It is super compact and I did not put the heater part in as in miami there is zero need for heat. Then install was super easy and clean... Attached Images __________________ Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please!!!!!. Sylvester's build thread >>>http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ht=big+rebuild

03-20-2010, 09:10 AM	#11
BLT-NT-BOT Registered User Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Lehi,UT Posts: 804	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C Thanks guys for all your input. I was also wondering if I can leave the factory system in and change the compressor to a new one that mounts low. My only concern with doing that is the hoses, will the old hoses work on a new compressor. When I say new I mean a Sanden compressor. Or will I have to get custom hoses made. What else needs to be updated to run R134a.

03-20-2010, 09:12 AM	#12
BLT-NT-BOT Registered User Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Lehi,UT Posts: 804	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C Also I live in Utah, I dont think I will be driving this in the winter much but if I do I would like the heat and defrost to work.

03-20-2010, 09:41 AM	#14
Shane Account Suspended Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: over yonder Posts: 14,270	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C Hey Al, can you use the stock control panel/unit with the Classic Auto Air kit or does it require their control panel/unit? Thanks! Last edited by Shane; 03-20-2010 at 09:42 AM.

03-20-2010, 11:14 AM	#15
leddzepp Moderator Join Date: May 2007 Location: Southern Cal Posts: 20,012	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C If you want fresh air to come into the cab while running the heater in an aftermarket system, simply reach down and pull open the drivers side air vent in the kick panel. Fogging problem solved. __________________ 1972 C/10 Cheyenne Super SWB. Restored, loaded, slammed. 1968 C/10 50th Anniversary LWB. Unrestored, stock, daily driver/work truck. RIP ElJay RIP 67ChevyRedneck RIP Grumpy Old Man RIP FleetsidePaul

03-20-2010, 11:16 PM	#20
Shane Account Suspended Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: over yonder Posts: 14,270	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C Awesome Al! Thank you for the info & the pics!

03-21-2010, 12:19 AM	#21
Ryan Hubbard Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Mission Viejo, CA Posts: 288	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C When I installed my Vintage Air system in my truck, I did not block off the passenger side vent. I converted it to a manual opening vent just so I could open the vent when I needed fresh air and since the vent is right near the intake for the Vintage Air it works well for defrosting windows. But that is the one drawback to the aftermarket AC systems in not having a fresh air option.



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03-21-2010, 12:25 AM	#22
thelonerife Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Clarksville TN 37043 Posts: 8,702	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C I put vintage air on my truck and love it! I'll put it on every truck now. The older compressors will leak oil out of the clutch eventually and seem to take more from the motor imo. __________________ Chuck 68swb Fleetside build ''Choncho'' http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=374892 My trailer redo http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...69#post5893869 Chuy my 59 bug http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=653798 Putnam 87 GMC Shop truck http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=707687

03-21-2010, 01:50 AM	#23
4x4Poet Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: "Under Montana skies." Posts: 1,836	I'm also dissapointed in aftermarket A/C systems for our trucks that don't use cowl fresh air. But I wonder if a little simple duct work would make either cowl or pass side vent fresh air flow through the evaporator. For the side vent, a drawback might be less leg room to accomodate the vent ducting. A fresh air/recirc flapper would be a greater challenge for the side vent. Anyway BLT-, Since you have the factory system, to use R134 you just need to go throught the conversion process above to use R134. To use a Sanden compressor, the R134 conversion hoses must have correctly routed and configured compressor hose fittings since any retro-fit R134 hoses configured for the OEM piston compressor will have the wrong fittings and metal line bends for a Sanden. Hose lengths required can also differ. Most A/C hose makers can make R134 hoses for Chevy trucks to SBC/BBCs. They'll need to know the truck, engine, pulley system, compressor location, etc. before making up a set. Classic Auto Air, Vintage Air, etc. can make up a set if local sources can't. I prefer R12 for its superior cooling ability, but, as stated above, R134 can easily handle a pickup cab. I use R134 barrier lined hoses even for refurbishing an R12 system since they are superior for stopping leaks and the cost is comparable to non-barrier R12 hoses. __________________ '71 GMC K20 Suburban, '71 GMC K10 Suburban, '72 Chevy C10 CST Suburban, '72 Chevy K20 clunker pickup. Last edited by 4x4Poet; 03-21-2010 at 02:04 AM.

03-21-2010, 11:16 AM	#25
Tkmadone Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Simi Valley, CA Posts: 193	Re: Factory A/C vs. Aftermarket A/C When I got my C20 it had the factory air stuff on the body but nothing on the engine. I bought all the stuff from here: http://www.nostalgicairparts.com/ I believe I spent about $300, which included brackets, a new compressor, hoses, and the valve replacement thingie. I work quite well, blowing 36 degrees. My only complaint is the factory center vent in the dash. It only blows straight ahead, which is annoying. I'm considering replacing it with 2 vents so I can aim one at myself and one at the passenger.

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