Opinions on overdrive transmissions

[BrianV]

Hey guys

i am getting ready to put a 4 speed automatic in my 72 shortbed and need some opinoins on what transmission is the best

i am going to be doing some towing but mostly just driving around town/roadtrips

right now i am going between a 2004r, a 700r4, or a 4l60

i appreciate any opinions

thanks
brian

[rsavage]

I put a 200 4R in my Burb this past winter and I like it. I have 3.07 gear ratio so around town I use 3rd gear (1:1) and a manual torque converter lock up switch. When on the highway I use OD and it locks up automatically. Last week I took it for a 60 mile run each way and it was cruising at 1750 rpms at 65-66 mph. On the 200 4R or 700R4 transmissions, the throttle valve cable adjustment is critical. Because I kept the two barrel on my 307, I had to fab up a bracket. If you have a 4 barrel, there are companies that make specific brackets and cable cams for Q jets, holleys, etc. Old mid 80's olds, caddy's, montes, etc with v-8s had 200 4R's so you could get a q-jet bracket off one of them. If you are towing, you can add some beef to the transmission and obviously, an auxiliary cooler would be necessary. Take a look at the BowTie Overdrives site as there is a lot of info there on both. The older 200 4R's and 700 R4's still have the mechanical speedo cable hook up. I know nothing about the newer OD's and when they went to electronic speedometer provisions which is an additional hurdle. The 200 4R is just about the same length as a TH350. Check the past discussions too, as there is lots of info on the site on these swaps. Good luck - keep us all posted on your choice and the change over.

[POPO1984]

Im going to the 200r4. I chose this because of the better 1st gear ratio as opposed to the 700r4. I will be running a 383 420 + hp with 3.73:1 gears and 275/60 tires

[sgaylord]

I just completed this mod on my 69 c-20 burb (replaced Th400 with 700r). I have a 396 with 3.55 gears in the Dana 60. I bought the TVEZE bracket from BowtieOverdrives to link the Q-Jet to the TV Cable of the 700r. I also purchased the Painless lockup kit from Summit. I had to shorten the front driveshaft 2/5" because the 700r is a little longer than the th400.

Last night I conducted a test and my RPM's were;
2150 @ 75
2000 @ 70
1900 @ 65
1750 @ 55

Steve

[chevy_mike]

Originally Posted by POPO1984

Im going to the 200r4. I chose this because of the better 1st gear ratio as opposed to the 700r4. I will be running a 383 420 + hp with 3.73:1 gears and 275/60 tires

x2

I had a 700R4 in my first '68 with the factory 4:10 and first gear was about useless.... unless you wanted to smoke the tires which it could do at a whim. The 200R4 is basically like a TH350 with an extra OD gear. Now that said, if you tow a lot of heavy loads, the deeper 1st of a 700R4 would be a benefit. When built right, both are good trans.

[BrianV]

I really appreciate all the info - i am leaning a little more toward the 2004r due to the fact i currently have a th350 and from what i can tell this will be an easier swap - i think i am going to get the tveze from bowtie but just use a toggle for the lockup.

Does anyone know if there are any disadvantages to the 2004r for towing vs the th700

thanks for all the input - i am pretty new on here but everyone is really helpful and i do appreciate the help

[srhart71]

Both can be built to handle about the same amount of torque. The 200 is geared better for towing due to the closer gear spacing, not as much RPM drop between gears. The 700, with its' lower first gear, will start off better. I have a 700 behind my non-stock 402 and it has done very well. Of course, I spent quite a bit to get it to live there.

[gonzo6869]

I say go with the 2004r, you can get them built to handle a lot of power (500+HP). As far as towing you should not have a problem with your stock rear end, unless you have changed it for say a 3.08. Another plus to the 2004r, is that it is just about a direct bolt on, all you really have to do is reverse your tranny cross member and your set.

[gkesseru]

Why reverse the crossmember?
Moves tranny up or down?
I do know you have to move the crossmember back, but haven't heard about flipping it.

[mrein3]

Just don't tow in overdrive and you'll be fine with either. The 3rd gear in each is 1:1 - just make sure you have a coverter/lock-up setup so you lock the converter in 3rd which will reduce heat and prolong the life of the transmission you end up with.

[Ackattack]

I've had a 700r4 and 4L60E in one of these trucks, and I'd pick the 4L60E any day over the 700R4, even though they are very similar. As stated above, the TV cable adjustment on the 700r4 is critical. On the 4L60E you don't have to mess with it. Of course its computer controlled, which for me with a fuel injected engine, the ECM is running both, so it wasn't a big deal....just plug it in.

I have friends running 600+ HP in their cars running 4L60Es, so they can be made to handle power.

[BrianV]

Great info guys - i think for my current engine the 2004r is gonna be the tranny to go with - when i upgrade to my 6 liter i think i may also have to get the 4l60 if i can buy one right .

Anyone know where i can get a decent price on a 2004r

[63chevyll]

ive benn running 700's with out the lock up and been fine

[gonzo6869]

Originally Posted by gkesseru

Why reverse the crossmember?
Moves tranny up or down?
I do know you have to move the crossmember back, but haven't heard about flipping it.

Your right, I knew it called for something like that. I think it calls for moving it back 6"

[raycow]

If you move the crossmember back to the stock holes for the TH400 it will be in the right place for the 200-4R.

Ray

[wwotr]

Originally Posted by BrianV

Hey guys

i am getting ready to put a 4 speed automatic in my 72 shortbed and need some opinoins on what transmission is the best

i am going to be doing some towing but mostly just driving around town/roadtrips

right now i am going between a 2004r, a 700r4, or a 4l60

i appreciate any opinions

thanks
brian

I'm running a Turbo 350 and was gonna go to a 700R4.
But I got to thinking this past weekend, that I don't Tow anything, and long road trips are few and far between.
I like the sound of my Truck when its rolling down the Highway at about 2300 RPM at 55-60 MPH, also it'll save me about $1700.00, if I just keep the Turbo 350.

[BrianV]

Originally Posted by wwotr

i'm running a turbo 350 and was gonna go to a 700r4.
But i got to thinking this past weekend, that i don't tow anything, and long road trips are few and far between.
I like the sound of my truck when its rolling down the highway at about 2300 rpm at 55-60 mph, also it'll save me about $1700.00, if i just keep the turbo 350.

good point but i dont like the 8 mpg on the road trips which i do quite often up the hill almost every weekend to get to the cool country.

Wont take me long to spend that 1700 in gas

[mrein3]

Originally Posted by BrianV

good point but i dont like the 8 mpg on the road trips which i do quite often up the hill almost every weekend to get to the cool country.

Wont take me long to spend that 1700 in gas

Do the math. You'll be surprised how long it will take you to recoup your $1700 in gas.

I'll help. If you're getting 8 now, the VERY best you'll do with a 200 4R or a 700r4 is 10.4. That is your 8 plus 30% which is 2.4. (you get .68:1 and .7:1 final ratio with the above two overdrive autos).

So if you drive 200 miles at 8 mpg you burn 25 gallons. Same trip with 10.4 burns 19.23 gallons.
At $2.79/gallon:
8mpg = $69.98
10.2mpg = $53.83

you saved $16.15.
$1700 / $16.15 = 105.26.

After 106 two hundred miles trips you'll have just paid for the tranny. You'd have to go EVERY weekend for two solid years (plus two more weeks) on a 200 mile trip or 21,200 miles for it to start to save you money.

I drive my truck around 2000 - 3000 miles per year. It would take me 10 years or better to see my money back. However most of my mileage is pulling a boat or pushing a plow. Neither of which would benefit from overdrive so it would never pay back.

All that being said, those few times I drive down the slab without my boat in tow it sure would be nice to not have the engine turning so fast.

[67ChevyRedneck]

I did it for drive-ability. A 350 with dual exhaust running down the interstate for 2+ hours at 75mph gets pretty f'in loud with a 3 spd. With my 700R it just hums now.

I bought my 700R from Advance and with the TVmadeEZ and TC lock up kit I only spent a hair over a grand on my set up. I think I'm over 15K miles and almost 4 years on the trans.

I find the cost to recoup fuel mileage comments funny (they've shown up in a lot of threads). These trucks are a hobby. If someone wants to blow 20-30K restoring a truck and put a TH350 in it, that's their choice, but so was spending 20-30K restoring their truck. I already have so much $ into my truck, I was sure as hell going to make it fun to drive. Between the OD and Vintage Air A/C, I spent an "unnecessary" $2,500 on my truck, but I love every mother f'in second of driving it, especially going down the interstate when it's 90 degrees out It's also easy to spend 3-4K on just a set of wheels/tires, but people do it anyway. You can also get a nice set of new rallys and tires for around $600. You can also go so far and ask why people spend up to a grand or more just to lower their truck a few inches. It's all in what the owner wants

Not trying to be an ass, but sometimes being able to enjoy something is worth more than the cost. Isn't that what this hobby is about?

[mrein3]

Originally Posted by 67ChevyRedneck

I did it for drive-ability. A 350 with dual exhaust running down the interstate for 2+ hours at 75mph gets pretty f'in loud with a 3 spd. With my 700R it just hums now.

I bought my 700R from Advance and with the TVmadeEZ and TC lock up kit I only spent a hair over a grand on my set up. I think I'm over 15K miles and almost 4 years on the trans.

I find the cost to recoup fuel mileage comments funny (they've shown up in a lot of threads). These trucks are a hobby. If someone wants to blow 20-30K restoring a truck and put a TH350 in it, that's their choice, but so was spending 20-30K restoring their truck. I already have so much $ into my truck, I was sure as hell going to make it fun to drive. Between the OD and Vintage Air A/C, I spent an "unnecessary" $2,500 on my truck, but I love every mother f'in second of driving it, especially going down the interstate when it's 90 degrees out It's also easy to spend 3-4K on just a set of wheels/tires, but people do it anyway. You can also get a nice set of new rallys and tires for around $600. You can also go so far and ask why people spend up to a grand or more just to lower their truck a few inches. It's all in what the owner wants

Not trying to be an ass, but sometimes being able to enjoy something is worth more than the cost. Isn't that what this hobby is about?

We fully agree which is why I added my last statement above,
"All that being said, those few times I drive down the slab without my boat in tow it sure would be nice to not have the engine turning so fast."

I just hate to see somebody think an overdrive is going to instantly save them a ton of money. It isn't.

Did you get your 700r4 shipped from Advanced? How did that go?

[67ChevyRedneck]

I picked it up at the local store. I put an old core on a pallet and gave it back for the core fee.

[BrianV]

Originally Posted by 67chevyredneck

i did it for drive-ability. A 350 with dual exhaust running down the interstate for 2+ hours at 75mph gets pretty f'in loud with a 3 spd. With my 700r it just hums now.

I bought my 700r from advance and with the tvmadeez and tc lock up kit i only spent a hair over a grand on my set up. I think i'm over 15k miles and almost 4 years on the trans.

I find the cost to recoup fuel mileage comments funny (they've shown up in a lot of threads). These trucks are a hobby. If someone wants to blow 20-30k restoring a truck and put a th350 in it, that's their choice, but so was spending 20-30k restoring their truck. I already have so much $ into my truck, i was sure as hell going to make it fun to drive. Between the od and vintage air a/c, i spent an "unnecessary" $2,500 on my truck, but i love every mother f'in second of driving it, especially going down the interstate when it's 90 degrees out :d it's also easy to spend 3-4k on just a set of wheels/tires, but people do it anyway. You can also get a nice set of new rallys and tires for around $600. You can also go so far and ask why people spend up to a grand or more just to lower their truck a few inches. It's all in what the owner wants :d

not trying to be an ass, but sometimes being able to enjoy something is worth more than the cost. Isn't that what this hobby is about?

amen brother!!!!!!!!!

[xludan]

I picked up a 200R4 yesterday. I will keep my build thread updated with opinions on the tranny after I finish the install.

[gonzo6869]

Originally Posted by BrianV

amen brother!!!!!!!!!

X2. This is why I really don't care if I get less then 10MPG. I just want something I am happy with and can enjoy it (city and highway)

[special-K]

Overdrives are great on the hiway.But,I enjoy a roar over a hum any day.These trucks aren`t a hobby for me,but a part of my life that will always be there,always has been.They`ve never been cheap on gas and that`s just the price to pay for that wonderful sound.The fact is true that you don`t instantly start saving money when you install an overdrive.It takes many many (trouble-free) miles.You can save money instantly by driving slower if saving money is your objective.I know I`ve never blown a direct drive transmission and have had quite a few overdrives die on me.