R&D Intermitent wipers

[RootBeer 6117]

I read Thadious posts about the single speed wipers people are using from blazers. I guess these fit better than the ones from S10 trucks?
It got me to thinking and I wanted to see if I could come up with a multiple speed control for the wiper motors, After fixing my blower controls on my 95 Chevy an idea hit me, so I challenged two of my students that aren't scared of electrical project to work on this.
Plan A We have some donated vehicles one is a 97 dodge van it had a single speed wiper for the back glass so we took it and the fan control switch and blower resistors off and wired them together we got some speed control but it didn't make much difference.

Plan B So we went back to the drawing board and looked at the wiring diagrams for a 97 cadillac we are going to junk and saw the intermittent wiper use a higher resistance to run the different levels.It shows the switch as having the resistors in it, I thought it was part of the wiper motor we will find out for sure.

Plan C get the electronics class involved in making a "bread board" circuit using the resistance values for the caddy.
Today it was raining as I was driving into town I had the lowest setting and an idea hit me using a flasher as a way to pulse the lower setting.

[raycow]

I'm glad to see that the spirit of Rube Goldberg is still alive and well at GM engineering.

The original two speed wiper motor used a tapped field for speed control. This works better than a series resistance for maintaining the torque output at the lower speed setting. The reason your blower switch didn't work very well for speed control is that you need more resistance than the stock blower resistor provides. This is because the wiper motor draws less current than the blower.

I don't think the turn flasher is going to work very well as a pulse initiator if you just connect it in series on the ground side of the motor. The reason is that the park switch will be closed for most of the wipe cycle, so no current goes through the flasher during that time. It will likely cool off and be closed by the time the park switch opens again, causing the motor to keep running continuously. Of course if I wrongly assumed how you are going to connect the flasher, please let me know what you had in mind.

Ray

[Thadious]

One of the issues that I ran into with it is that you need a double gearbox drive on the wiper motor. I have yet to source a wiper motor that has a two speed self reversing rotary action. All vehicles (that I have found) use a full rotation wiper motor (an easy way to tell is that the wipers run parallel to each other and not opposing, as in the old trucks). If anyone has sourced one, PLEASE let me know and I'll see if I can find it and re-adapt it to our trucks! The controller doesn't seem to be much of an issue... but I'm really interested to see how this thread progresses!

Brain storming !

Cheers,
Ted.

[RootBeer 6117]

Ray
I figured the resistance wasnt enough for that reason, I knew a blower motor would run higher amps,it was a good ohms law lesson for them.
The flasher thing was just a thought, most I am fimilar with on GM are on the power side. I have plenty of spare parts to mess with.
I "WONDER IF" we were to build a "bread board" using resistor of higher values wired like the blower setup?
Im not sure how the 97 dodge mini van rear wiper returns.
I was hoping some one would reply to this so I could bounce ideas off them
Joe


<<I'm glad to see that the spirit of Rube Goldberg is still alive and well at GM engineering.

you are going to connect the flasher, please let me know what you had in mind.>>

[RootBeer 6117]

Originally Posted by Thadious

One of the issues that I ran into with it is that you need a double gearbox drive on the wiper motor. I have yet to source a wiper motor that has a two speed self reversing rotary action. All vehicles (that I have found) use a full rotation wiper motor (an easy way to tell is that the wipers run parallel to each other and not opposing, as in the old trucks). If anyone has sourced one, PLEASE let me know and I'll see if I can find it and re-adapt it to our trucks! The controller doesn't seem to be much of an issue... but I'm really interested to see how this thread progresses!

Brain storming !

Cheers,
Ted.

Ted I have been wondering why you chose the wiper motor you chose?
Would a regular S10truck one work?
I am far off from this in my build but I like figuring stuff like this out.

[Thadious]

Actually, I didn't choose the motor I used... someone else found that.

I stripped the S10 that I did with my swap and the wiper motor in the front is one of things that I kept. It was two speed, however.... most normal (haven't found any that don't) windshield wiper motors only go in one direction and complete full circular rotations.

The S10 Blazer rear wiper motor only completes about 120 degrees of sweep in one direction, then reverses itself back to the start point (parks itself). It's the way the gearing is set up in the motor. The end result is a linear movement of the arms in a specific orientation (opposing sweep) that vehicles today don't do.

The original vacuum motors were designed with the same function and the only addition that I added to my wiper design is the ability to increase the distance from the pivot point of the motor (center shaft) to the pivot point of the wiper arm... thus increasing or decreasing the linear distance achieved in a set sweep; which, in turn, increases or decreases the sweep angle of the wipers.

Hope this helps on the motor side and why the choice...

Cheers!
Ted.

[raycow]

Originally Posted by Thadious

I have yet to source a wiper motor that has a two speed self reversing rotary action. All vehicles (that I have found) use a full rotation wiper motor (an easy way to tell is that the wipers run parallel to each other and not opposing, as in the old trucks). If anyone has sourced one, PLEASE let me know and I'll see if I can find it and re-adapt it to our trucks!

I have run into the reversing motors on "depressed park" applications. These were all on passenger cars. I have never seen one on a truck. Look at the more expensive GM cars starting late 60s where the parked wipers are concealed below the cowl.

Ray

[RootBeer 6117]

[Hope this helps on the motor side and why the choice...

Cheers!
Ted.[/QUOTE]

Yep Ted that answered it Thank you. It make sense the wiper transmission would have to move quite a bit so clearance would be an issue.

[Dan Bowles]

I haven't drawn anything up yet but I was thinking of using the S10 from and making an adapter for the front that looks kind of like a bicycle crank. Rather than power it from the middle, I would power it from one end. This would allow the one side wiper to travel in the sweep like an old steam engine wheel. I would put a bushing through and bolt the rest of the crank system through it that would drive the second arm, just further out and 90 degrees out of phase like the vacuum motor. Basically, two laser cut blanks keyed to go onto the motor. The bushing would use milled flats in the ends to keep the two arms in time.

I would modify the steering column switch to pop up through the dash and a stock looking knob connected so it can be turned to use both the high and low as well as the intermittent functions.

I'm more the mechanical guy (BS Physics) than the electronic so I figured if I could mount it up and power it, the GM guys already had the switch figured out!

[dwcsr]

I hate to be the party pooper but buy this switch http://www.ryderfleetproducts.com/ry...oductDetail.do
and wire it up like this and use a 2 speed GM motor from a 67-72 truck

I don't remember where I got the diagram from but to whom ever did it thanks,

[RootBeer 6117]

Dave gotta be one in every crowd ;-) Thanks for the info,before I saw your post I was googling and found out
<<An electrically operated fixed interval intermittent rear wiper and washer system is standard factory-installed equipment on all Jeep Grand Cherokee WJ models 1999-2004>>
maybe worth looking into also.

[tobins 52 gmc]

I knew someone would figure it out .

[Thadious]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is still the same issue with the single speed wipers. I'm using the F**d intermittents with a slight mod (see my build) designed for 2 speed intermittent wipers, it was more a matter finding a motor that could do the 2 speed than the controller for it. You can buy the Cole Hersey switch for $100 up here, but the F**d intermittents for $30... so more cost and adapting than just outright tossing money at the parts stores.

Cheers,
Ted.

[dwcsr]

I'm a little confused. What action are you trying to get the wipers to do?

[RootBeer 6117]

Ted I guess I am confused to did you read what I posted about the jeep rear wiper motor? it should be the same set up as the blazer rear motor but two speed, I did some more searching and it seems jeep grand Cherokee used a two speed rear wiper for a few years Ebay has them for about $40.

[Thadious]

Now THAT I'll be looking into! If I can source one here... shouldn't be too much of an issues and the movements are right, I'll figure a way to meld it into our trucks!

Cheers,
Ted.

[solidaxel]

This has my interest, Thanks folks

[BIG CHEVY 3600]

You guys are all wet! lol

[MrDude_1]

im thinking im going to go the more modern route and just program a microcontroller to move the motor.
i noticed alot of the modern wipers in junkyards had a "controller box" and used a pot to tell the controller where the wiper is in its sweep...

but, im nowhere near that project yet on my truck... sometime, in the future, i'll get to it.

[1952ssr]

I pondered the thought of using a dodge caravan/chrysler town and country motor I'm not sure the exact year maybe early 2000's (the round body style). There wipers sweep from inside out, as ours do so the geometry should be the same. Then I realized mine had been converted to a new 12v motor so I never had the opportunity to try my idea.

[RootBeer 6117]

Originally Posted by 1952ssr

I pondered the thought of using a dodge caravan/chrysler town and country motor I'm not sure the exact year maybe early 2000's (the round body style). There wipers sweep from inside out, as ours do so the geometry should be the same. Then I realized mine had been converted to a new 12v motor so I never had the opportunity to try my idea.

Lucky, I have one off a 97 dodge van, I may try to use it haven't got that far.
I have nothing at all against the aftermarket it would be easier to buy one ready to bolt on but I can not afford it and I have access to a lot of parts just figuring out how to make them work.

[BIG CHEVY 3600]

Originally Posted by RootBeer 6117

Lucky, I have one off a 97 dodge van, I may try to use it haven't got that far.
I have nothing at all against the aftermarket it would be easier to buy one ready to bolt on but I can not afford it and I have access to a lot of parts just figuring out how to make them work.

I would be right there with you if I had the time, and fabricating skills. That's what it's all about with us isn't it? In fact we all have the skills just not the time. Retirement soon...

[RootBeer 6117]

Big
that's what I like about this forum every body has different skill level and shares what they've done. 10 yrs ago I would have never thought about doing this when I was owner operator of a repair shop. Now that I'm teaching I can challenge some of my better students to try to do this. Up to this point I feel like I'm just copy cat building.
But If I had not found this site I would not be at the point I am I would still be dreamin about it. I'm quite a few years from retirement (maybe a day or to from losing my mind) It would be cool to come up with a inexpensive set up as my way of giving back.
Joe