pulleys not lining up...help

[RexDodge]

I thought I would post some engine bay pics for interest and see if someone could help me figure something out. The engine pics still show some work to be done but it's coming along. I installed this engine about 8 years ago and it has sat until about 6 weeks ago. I cannot figure out the pulleys. In the pics I think you can see that the power steering and alternator pulleys do not line up with the crank pulleys. I am sure these are the same pulleys that where pulled off. I am wondering about short water pump vs long water pump? Could that be it? Even if the water pump needs to be a long the power steering pump pulley does not line up either. I plan to pull the water pump and pulleys to paint them once I figure this out but...what gives? Any thoughts?

[68shortfleet]

Rex, i dont really have an answer for you except to say that i am dealing with mine having issues too. However this truck was purchased as a basket case and has not been licensed since 1979. No telling when it last had a motor, needless to say, i did not get a motor or any pullies with mine.

To maybe be of help, i have a short water pump pulley and both crank pulleys in the mail from teeitup. You are reasonably local if you want to come take a look at them or compare to what you have already. I should also end up with a spare cast crankshaft pulley for power steering that i know is for one of our trucks.

[mud.man.rj]

Install small washers behind top pulley on back of bolts.

[sbc10guy]

I had the same problem and installed washers on mine. It was simple and worked great.

[RexDodge]

Originally Posted by 68shortfleet

Rex, i dont really have an answer for you except to say that i am dealing with mine having issues too. However this truck was purchased as a basket case and has not been licensed since 1979. No telling when it last had a motor, needless to say, i did not get a motor or any pullies with mine.

To maybe be of help, i have a short water pump pulley and both crank pulleys in the mail from teeitup. You are reasonably local if you want to come take a look at them or compare to what you have already. I should also end up with a spare cast crankshaft pulley for power steering that i know is for one of our trucks.

I'll take you up on that. It's always fun to look at another project and swap notes. I am out of town through Sunday but we could set something up for next week.

[GASoline71]

Does your rig have a/c? Wondering why the need for so many pulleys.

Gary

[RexDodge]

Thanks for the tip(s) on the washers. I had not thought of that. I guess as long as the stack is not more than 2 or three it would be ok. I tend to drive with a heavy foot . The more the pulley hangs out on those bolts I would think the force would increase a bunch.

[Scott Webster]

Yup - washers. I painted the back side of my pulley and set washers on before it dried so they would stay on place.

[mrein3]

I for one would NOT use washers to line stuff up.

When I bought my truck it was a basket case. One of the many issues was the pulleys on the engine. I tried washers, other pulleys, every trick I could think of. NOTHING worked.

What I finally did, and I suggest you do, is find a matching set from an unmolested truck and use them.

What I found with the washer thing is that at 500-800 rpms in the drive way everything looked good. However at certain other (usually much higher) rpms, harmonics would set up and the alternator bracket would vibrate like when we do vibration testing on airplane parts here at work. It was incredible. No wonder why I BROKE two alternator brackets before I got everything straightened out with matching pulleys.

And don't forget if you lose your alternator on an AC-less truck, you also just lost your water pump so even though your truck will run for a while on the battery you got about 5 minutes of movement under its own power before you overheat.

Since I got my matching set I haven't had one issue. Even after I added that big drag of an A6 air conditioner compressor off the other side.

[longbed67]

I would not recommend washers either but they do make shims that are for adjusting pulleys that are a lot better.

[RexDodge]

Originally Posted by GASoline71

Does your rig have a/c? Wondering why the need for so many pulleys.

Gary

Hi Gary. Yes, this is an ac truck. I havn't gotten as far as rebiulding\installing that yet.
Posted via Mobile Device

[RexDodge]

Originally Posted by mrein3

I for one would NOT use washers to line stuff up.

When I bought my truck it was a basket case. One of the many issues was the pulleys on the engine. I tried washers, other pulleys, every trick I could think of. NOTHING worked.

What I finally did, and I suggest you do, is find a matching set from an unmolested truck and use them.

What I found with the washer thing is that at 500-800 rpms in the drive way everything looked good. However at certain other (usually much higher) rpms, harmonics would set up and the alternator bracket would vibrate like when we do vibration testing on airplane parts here at work. It was incredible. No wonder why I BROKE two alternator brackets before I got everything straightened out with matching pulleys.

And don't forget if you lose your alternator on an AC-less truck, you also just lost your water pump so even though your truck will run for a while on the battery you got about 5 minutes of movement under its own power before you overheat.

Since I got my matching set I haven't had one issue. Even after I added that big drag of an A6 air conditioner compressor off the other side.

I was thinking the same thing (locating a set of pulleys or going aftermarket).
Posted via Mobile Device

[FrankieD]

I had the same problem I went from a 70 307 to a 72 350 both short shaft and swapped the pulleys from the 307 for the power steering and they were 1/2 groove off couldn't figure it out except the 350 and 307 harmonic balancers are different so I went to the bone yard and took the pulleys, belts and alt brackets from a 86 impala and mounted the alt on the right side put a long shaft pump on that I had and all is good now. I needed the long shaft any way because the back of short shaft hit the Edelbrock 2 piece timing cover

[rsavage]

I too would not use washers. Measure the depth of your water pump to make sure it is a short pump. The pulleys on the water pump are not different sizes as yours seem to be. Get part numbers off your PS pulley and the pulleys on the balancer. Call this guy - Jim at either 480-981-3096 or 602-751-0454. He sells on ebay as "gotpulley", is extremely knowledgeable and will know exactly what you will need to do it right.

[Andy4639]

I always was told a short water pump you can't stick your finger between the motor and back of pump.
101 trucks, always get all the brackets, and anything else that comes with the said motor when swapping it.

[midniteblues]

I wouldnt use washers either maybe make some spacers for the brackets if you can I have seen the water pump shims they sell might help a little

[Husker]

I used a shim kit I got from Summit or such. I think it was Moroso brand.
Ron

[Husker]

http://www.jegs.com/webapp/wcs/store...him+kit+pulley

http://www.summitracing.com/search/?...20pulley&dds=1

[GuyO]

Not an uncommon problem when doing a swap. I went to a performance shop and they had the billit 3 groove pulley hanging on the wall. No shimming, no washers or spacers. To my way of thinking, for everything you do there is an unintended consequence. Personally I wouldn't do it. Looking more closely at your picture, your power steering alignment looks OK, you could do away with the double water pump pully and leave a groove on the crank pully as a spacer. Something to consider is running two belts to the alternator especially if you get up towards 100 amps alt. It looks cool and takes up some of your extra grooves. Just a thought!

[RexDodge]

I am definitively leaning towards getting a set of aftermarket pulleys. I will be re installing the factory ac too so that will take up the other grooves. I am doing a wrecking yard run this weekend to gather a few miscellaneous things. You never know what you may find!

[Husker]

I have been running shims/shim on my crank pulley for a few years with no problems.
Ron

[Sammy]

Do the serpentine swap and forget all this alignment stuff. V6 or V8 small block at the junk yard. Get everything water pump crank pulley, ac, alternator n snip the wire connector, all the bolts, washers, belts n hoses upgrade ur system with the higher amperage and be trouble free. Get the alternator tested at a chain store on the way home. Much cheaper than aftermarket n have all the pulleys n brackets powder coated. It will be easier and only a one time headache.

[Sport/Truck]

Originally Posted by rsavage

I too would not use washers. Measure the depth of your water pump to make sure it is a short pump. The pulleys on the water pump are not different sizes as yours seem to be. Get part numbers off your PS pulley and the pulleys on the balancer. Call this guy - Jim at either 480-981-3096 or 602-751-0454. He sells on ebay as "gotpulley", is extremely knowledgeable and will know exactly what you will need to do it right.

Originally Posted by Husker

I used a shim kit I got from Summit or such. I think it was Moroso brand.
Ron

I've used both to fix this common problem. I used the shim to fix the crank pulley alignment, and Jim help me get the proper power steering pulley.
s/t

[Andy4639]

Looking at this again. Why is the outter water pump pulley bigger than the inner one?
I have also noticed you have 4 pulley's on the crank, why you only need 3 for a truck setup with AC.




Here is mine.

[RexDodge]

Tonight I had a chance to look closer at the pulley situation. I had a major duh moment. The harmonic balancer is not completely seated so the crank pulley set is not lining up . I only need another .25 inch to make it all work. But the mystery continues...
1. Why do I have a 4 groove pulley set on the crank? It is two sets of two groove cast pulleys. From what I have found I should have a three groove pulley set. Could this be from a cali vehicle (air pump vehicle? Where there air pumps on these in 71?)
2. Why does my water pump (2 groove) pulley have that gap. In all the other pictures I have seen there is no gap. The front pulley is also a larger diameter that the back.
3. I have a power steering pump that only has one groove. The ac trucks I have seen all have a 2 groove power steering pump.
From what I have seen I should have a three groove crank pulley, a two groove water pump pulley with no gap and a power steering pulley with two grooves.
Is that correct? I will get the numbers off the pulleys tomorrow. I still plan to get a serpentine set up in the future but the budget says to make this work for now and concentrate on other things.