factory a/c or after market

[70CHEVYBB]

I have a 70 lwb that needs a/c. It is a non a/c truck. I need to know if I should try to buy a factory set up used or go with vintage air for it. I am always looking to save a buck even if it requires a little more work but have no problem spending the money for a good a/c kit. I am running a 468 with a sbc serpentine belt drive.

[cdowns]

i would buy a new modern state of the art system any day over a 40 year old designed unit// just the amt of gas you wood save wood more than make up for any cost difference

[mrein3]

Originally Posted by 70CHEVYBB

I have a 70 lwb that needs a/c. It is a non a/c truck. I need to know if I should try to buy a factory set up used or go with vintage air for it. I am always looking to save a buck even if it requires a little more work but have no problem spending the money for a good a/c kit. I am running a 468 with a sbc serpentine belt drive.

Originally Posted by cdowns

i would buy a new modern state of the art system any day over a 40 year old designed unit// just the amt of gas you wood save wood more than make up for any cost difference

I would respectly have to disagree with cdowns if you are looking to save a buck. I have $350 into converting my non-AC cab to a factory AC cab. I'm running all factory or factory replacement parts for that $350. NOTHING cools better than a stock GM air conditioner filled with R12 in these trucks. Aftermarket systems start at $1000. That is a $650 savings to begin with. How much gas can you buy for $650? Then there is the whole parts thing. I was able to buy replacements components from suppliers for a 40 year old system. Where are these $1000 fly-by-night aftermarket companies going to be in 40 years? Will components be available or will you have to buy another whole $1000 system if you need a receiver/dryer or a hose?

My $1000 price point is a guess. I remember one guy on this forum got his $1000+ system shipped to his door only to find out he had to scrounge up more parts to make it work.

Now being that you have a serpentine system complicates things. They don't make A6 (stock) compressors that have a serpentine pulley on them. If they did or if you could swap a pulley on there it probably wouldn't fit your belt system. I have a serpentine system including AC compressor off of a 99 Suburban in my shop waiting for a project. I was thinking about this the other day. I think if you have an AC hose making shop around (my town of 4400 has one) I think you could have a hose set fabbed up to mate your modern compressor to a stock POA and TxV. I bet that custom hose set would cost about what a stock replacement set costs, keeping you in that $350 guesstimate. Then except for that custom hose set you'd be still using all stock parts which means future system maintenance is assured.

[SS Tim]

One of the facts I uncovered researching this is the aftermaket systems don't have the fresh air mode the stock system has. They are always in a recirculation mode. Really think the factory system might be the best choice but more work. Also there is the choice of the factory suitcase on the firewall or loosing most of the glovebox.

[68gmsee]

Another opinion. I have to agree with Downs on this one. The reasons:

Unless you want the truck to look period correct, the new systems are a lot more efficient and will cool the small cab area (providing good insulation) in a very short time.

It's a pain to cut the dash like the factory did and if not done correctly, it's looks like a hack job. (ask me how I know)

You get everything you need in one kit instead of having to scrounge around salvage yards for good parts.

If you need fresh air, and you haven't blocked the vents, you can just crack them open.

The refrigerant used on the newer systems is quite a bit cheaper than R12 and if you are environmentally conscious, it's better for the environment.

I am in the keep it stock as much as possible crowd so in my case when I add A/C, I will not cut up the dash but instead use the under the dash vents.

[SS Tim]

While trying to find a relevant posting by clinebarger from earlier this year when I found this. Good reading on building a better "Fixed Orifice" type system.
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s....php?p=4787946

[cdowns]

i have to say that people up in the frozen north like minn aint got much of a clue when it comes to the true cost of running an air conditioner// running nonstop 10=11 months a year is a heck of alot costlier than a weekend or two a year if they have some spring like weather to deal with

a 40year old AC really takes close to a 30% or more bite out of gas mileage the new systems are far less than 10% even in the worst stop n go type traffic so fer sure that $650 is a slight drop in the bucket

[mrein3]

Originally Posted by 68gmsee

Another opinion. I have to agree with Downs on this one. The reasons:

Unless you want the truck to look period correct, the new systems are a lot more efficient and will cool the small cab area (providing good insulation) in a very short time.

It's a pain to cut the dash like the factory did and if not done correctly, it's looks like a hack job. (ask me how I know)

You get everything you need in one kit instead of having to scrounge around salvage yards for good parts.

If you need fresh air, and you haven't blocked the vents, you can just crack them open.

The refrigerant used on the newer systems is quite a bit cheaper than R12 and if you are environmentally conscious, it's better for the environment.

I am in the keep it stock as much as possible crowd so in my case when I add A/C, I will not cut up the dash but instead use the under the dash vents.

Originally Posted by cdowns

i have to say that people up in the frozen north like minn aint got much of a clue when it comes to the true cost of running an air conditioner// running nonstop 10=11 months a year is a heck of alot costlier than a weekend or two a year if they have some spring like weather to deal with

a 40year old AC really takes close to a 30% or more bite out of gas mileage the new systems are far less than 10% even in the worst stop n go type traffic so fer sure that $650 is a slight drop in the bucket

A couple of points to ponder as you figure out which way to go on this...

I don't want to step into too much here but there is some debate as to whether or not R12 is hard on the environment. I won't argue for or against that point. However I do run R134a in my truck because it is a small area to cool and R134a is available on the shelf at most auto parts stores. A simple adjustment to your stock POA will allow you to run R134a in a stock system. I've been doing just that for a couple of years now.

I find it interesting that now they are saying R134a is hard on the environment.

I cut the dash myself. A hole saw properly positionted did the side vents. A dremmel tool with a cutoff wheel did the center. I purchased an AC dash with the intent of cutting it under the dash pad but later figured it was easier to cut what I had.

Contrary to popular belief, it does get quite warm up here in Minnesota. We don't advertise that fact because it keeps the riff raff down south. While I'm not running AC for cooling purposes 10-11 months out of the year I do run it April/May through October to keep the cab cool. That is seven months for the math challenged. The other months one needs a properly running AC system to take the moisture out of the cab thus clearing the windows faster and keeping them clear. I had a heck of a time getting the fog off the INSIDE of the windows in my truck when it was non AC. Now a couple of seconds with the AC on and I'm good to go.

FWIW, my 1972 Chevelle going down the slab with the windows up and AC on gets better fuel mileage than the same car going the same speed with the windows down.

All that being said, after experiencing a non AC truck heater then switching to a factory truck heater, there is no comparison. The heater GM put in these trucks that came with AC is something. When I'm plowing the driveway I usually have to open a window.

Oh. One more note. I was wondering around Sam's Club the other day. They had 12 can boxes of R134a for $54 dollars. That is $4.50/can which is a pretty darn good price. I've seen it as high as $12 -$15/can at autoparts stores. I haven't bought R12 since it was legal for back yard guys like me to purchase it in the small cans. Back then I could buy it for $1/can and installed it at the shop I worked at for $2/can.

[big_al_71]

"Classic auto air" was my choice four years later I am beyond satisfied..

[68gmsee]

Originally Posted by mrein3

A couple of points to ponder as you figure out which way to go on this...


I cut the dash myself. A hole saw properly positionted did the side vents. A dremmel tool with a cutoff wheel did the center. I purchased an AC dash with the intent of cutting it under the dash pad but later figured it was easier to cut what I had...........

Contrary to popular belief, it does get quite warm up here in Minnesota. We don't advertise that fact because it keeps the riff raff down south......

Not to get too personal, but not everyone is able to do a good job of cutting and make it look original. If you were able to, good for you. The main point of my post was not the cutting of holes but the effort involved in finding good 40 year old components to use.

Re. the rif raf comment... No need to get personal with your post. However, I will say that here in Texas there are literally tens of thousands of people from up north and your part of the country. My deceased old neighbor was one of them. Too cold up there for him so he came to enjoy the mild winters we have in my area. I guess to each his own.

[Rreemo]

Having worked as an AC Electrical wrench in a dealership and now doing restoration work (in Texas) I've been through this more times than I can count. Do yourself a favor and just buy a good quality after market system from someplace like Vintage Air or Classic Auto Air out of Fort Worth where they have plenty of 100+ degree temps (read: plenty of experience with AC). Trust me, these systems are so much more efficient, actually pretty simple, and as packaged comparably way lighter than what the factory installed 40 years ago. Not being able to find replacement parts is absolutely a false statement.....to the contrary, aside from the plastic molded stuff like the box itself, these newer systems are generally assembled from parts supplied by huge international vendors.....the same who supply the big auto manufacturers for our new cars. Therefore, much of the stuff (like the Sanden compressors they all use) will more likely continue to be available well after all those old clapped out Frigidaires and POA valves have been remanned 2-3 times.

[mrein3]

Originally Posted by 68gmsee

Re. the rif raf comment... No need to get personal with your post. However, I will say that here in Texas there are literally tens of thousands of people from up north and your part of the country. My deceased old neighbor was one of them. Too cold up there for him so he came to enjoy the mild winters we have in my area. I guess to each his own.

Sorry man. Just taking a friendly swipe back after the comment shot at me for not knowing about AC because I choose to live up north.

I guess what it boils down to if you want to keep your truck for the long haul you might want to consider stock. If you change your truck as often as you change your underwear an aftermarket system might be the way to go. Let the next guy worry about servicing it.

[ERASER5]

The problem with no outside air is not with AC. It is a big problem with heat in the winter. Running heat in recirc will fogg up the windows. That is why EVERY OEM has fresh air. Bar none.

So the big question becomes are you going to be driving your truck in 10 degree weather? If you are you need outside air. Opening a vent at 10 degrees would be extreamly uncomfortable.

[Lemield]

Originally Posted by ERASER5

The problem with no outside air is not with AC. It is a big problem with heat in the winter. Running heat in recirc will fogg up the windows. That is why EVERY OEM has fresh air. Bar none.

So the big question becomes are you going to be driving your truck in 10 degree weather? If you are you need outside air. Opening a vent at 10 degrees would be extreamly uncomfortable.

That was my concern with a Vintage Air or OAP unit too. I chose the NAP underdash unit. Works well, I like the retro look and I still have my fresh air heater.