Doing A Valve Job

[Ardee83]

I am going to do a complete valve job my 305. I believe I have all of the parts needed to complete this job, but can I get everyone to take a second look at my parts list and make sure that I have everything?? I am not sure if I need exhaust and intake valves? On my list is also oil and snake oil. My list is attached in a jpeg. A mechanic quoted me $1,500-$1,600 for this to be done and if I can do it for parts and my time I stand to save about $1,300. If I have difficulty doing this or cant get it quiet right, I will be purchasing a crate 350, but I want to learn and here is my chance. Thanks for every ones help Ryan

[LynnJr]

Another option would be to pull the heads yourself and take them to a shop then re-install them.You will still save $900 and know they are right.

[mongoose]

well a valve job consists of cutting seats and grinding valves, then lapping.. after checking for excess play in the guides etc etc....


what youre doing is.. a lot of work for nothing? especially if you're not putting in a new cam..

but yeah, why are you exactly doing this?

[Ardee83]

Ok let me add some more information. I have a tick, that tik is caused by a bent push rod, my lifter in the #5 cylinder is collapsed. Because the mechanic had to open everything up to replace the collapsed lifter he wanted to do a complete valve job, I am not about to put 1500 into a 305. I don want to replace a bent push rod just for it to bend again. So what other options do I have? I am just learning here
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[INSIDIOUS '86]

A lifter tick can be three things two of which are common. 1: low oil 2: high mileage and worn or stick internals. Or misadjusted which creates to much lash

What you need to figure out is why the pushrods bent in the first place. Also tell us which pushrod bent

Also. A valve job is completely unnecessary. If everything is going to be pulled off you pretty much may as well rebuild or replace all.

Another part is that having the heads all re done on a worn motor will spike cylinder pressures and may create more blowby and unseats the rings. This will cause excessive oil/carbon deposits in the cylinder which also cause accelerated wear. I don't know what the mileage is on your motor but I wouldn't suggest a shot of adrenalin to the old lady in lamen terms haha

There isn't anything wrong with replacing the faulty parts. If the cam love is decent and the lifter is not damaged just soak it in some high detergent for a day or so and re assemble it. Replace your pushrod and make sure the valve isn't bent. Make sure that the whole assembly of valve train in that trouble area is sound. Even the valve springs and rocker
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[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by Ardee83

Ok let me add some more information. I have a tick, that tik is caused by a bent push rod, my lifter in the #5 cylinder is collapsed. Because the mechanic had to open everything up to replace the collapsed lifter he wanted to do a complete valve job, I am not about to put 1500 into a 305. I don want to replace a bent push rod just for it to bend again. So what other options do I have? I am just learning here
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Also number 5 and number 7 cam lobes like to round out on sbc. Don't know why but they do. Make sure it's not a flat cam lobe
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[manimal]

If you dont want to put any kind of money into a 305, then why not do he work yourself, just LAP in the valves by hand...you can pour some alcohol into the ports to make sure they arent leaking. I wouldnt spend any more money than absolutely necessary to make it run again. Then save your money for the engine you really want.

[mopar346]

The first and most important question is mileage, as Insidious stated tighting up the top end and blow out the bottom end on an old engine. Since it is a 305 and given the fact (by your disciption) that you aren't experienced in internal diagnosis, I would suggest replacing the engine with a 350 from the get go. It will save you through good money after bad in the end. Even if it is a junk yard or used engine, as long as you can verify the vitals and get a quarantee. Best bet is to buy a quality rebuilt and have at it. If you have the extra money most places will up grade you to cams and tru-roller chains for not too much extra. Performance upgrades really depends on your pocket book and intended purpose of the truck.

As far as learning, you can them take the old engine and do all the disassembly and reassembly you want for fun in your time. If you need it as a core then find you one for cheap. There is a lot to building and engine or doing a real valve job but you gotta start somewhere, we all did.

If you have to fix the 305 then have a skilled ear diagnosis it for you and then replace the minimum.

[Ardee83]

INSIDIOUS '86 you have been awesome, you have replied to almost every single one of my posts. I know that low oil is the not the issue, but that high miles and sticking internals could be the issue. I bought the truck after a rebuild supposedly the engine was rebuilt as well, it is not. I have no idea how many miles are on it but I do know its the original motor after tracking down the shop that did the rebuild. The bent push rod is in the #5 cylinder, I was told that the push rod is bent because the valve seal is mushroomed over and causing the lifter to stick and that the lifter in the #5 cylinder is collapsed (by the mechanic and he is a great mechanic, just to expensive for my taste but anything above free makes me cringe) Logically thinking if this is the issue and is what is causing the push rod to bend, then why would I replace the push for it just to bend again? I want to solve the issue that is causing the push rod to bend. If I have to replace one valve why not replace them?

manimal I most definitely want to do the work myself. If I am going to pursue this new passion of mine I would like to know them inside and out. I even ordered a book how to rebuild your chevy small block, should be here this week, cant wait!

mopar346 I use the truck as a daily driver, but also have another little truck I can use as a daily driver if I had to keep this one in the garage for a few weekends. I have the money set aside for a GM crate 350, headers, new water pump and manifold, but because I am eager to learn I wanted to try and fix the issue at hand. If I failed well then I will purchase the new crate motor. I do not need to return the 305 as a core and planned on keeping it just to tear it apart and become familiar with the motor since the 305 and 350 arent so different. So in the future when the 350 is no longer under warranty I would feel a lot more comfortable working on and upgrading the 350.

So now that I have answered the questions, what do you guys suggest I attempt?

[Dead Parrot]

For the new engine, might want to add new starter, fuel pump, flex plate, radiator hoses, heater hose, spark plugs, plug wires, distributor cap and rotor. Don't forget the cost of 2 gallons antifreeze, 5 quarts oil, filter, pvc etc. Plus at least $100 for "I don't want to put that old thing on my new motor." items.

On the 305, if the head is still on, see if the mechanic would be willing to part with a used lifter, push rod and rocker arm for you to practice with. And does he have an already opened set of valve seals? Or consider getting same from a pull-a-part yard. Used parts will let you gain experience just as well as new. Any money spent on the 305 is money lost when you do swap it out for the 350. The mixing of used lifters and cams is normally considered a bad thing but in this case, sounds like the 305 is near end of life anyway.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

I wouldn't suggest mixing new with old or used with unoriginal used. You can buy a single new lifter off summit which will will solve any lifter issues. When inspecting your old lifter it shouldn't have a recessed ring or any scraping marks otherwise those are signs the cam may be on the way out. Use a flashlight to look at the top of the came lobe. It should be smooth and shiny with no scuffing.

If all that checks out you can replace the lifter and pushrod. Now here's the lowdown on new lifters on old cams. They will either mate to each other and establish a matching wear pattern orrrr they will not mate and it will accelarate the wear rate of the cam. Camshafts are only surface hardened so depending on how worn that cam love is will determine the success of a new lifter repair so if its in good condition chances are it will all work out. But there's always a chance it may wipe the lobe. So when you do this add break in oil or zinc additive to help it succeed and run a cam break in procedure.

So now that section is good. Now focus on the valve and guide. Your mechanic can fix this without pulling the head which will save you a lot. You can put the #5 cylinder up to the top and fill it with nylon rope through the plug hole which will prevent the valve from dropping into the cylinder. The valve spring and retainers can be taken off and you can inspect the head and the guide and rotate the valve to check its straightness. If it checks out replace the guide seal and put it together and it should run fine.
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[LynnJr]

For the money and labor your putting in this set of heads have you considered buying a set ready to go?
It would solve all your current problems and you can build a short-block in your spare time as money allows and have your dream engine.
I won't recommend any particular head after the last debacle on this forum but click on this link and scroll down a page or two.;
http://www.ebay.com/sch/Cylinder-Hea...+heads&_sop=15

[Jewbacca]

Spend your time and money on that new motor. Then when you are done with that take the 305 apart to learn on. If you do it right and runs good. Toss it in a beater truck to flip and make so money on.

[mopar346]

Originally Posted by Ardee83

The bent push rod is in the #5 cylinder, I was told that the push rod is bent because the valve seal is mushroomed over and causing the lifter to stick and that the lifter in the #5 cylinder is collapsed (by the mechanic and he is a great mechanic, ..........

No offense but not if he told you that.

Once again Insidious is giving you good advice. You can replace the seals fairly easily with a few special tools with the head on the engine, the key is the guide inspection if there is play in the guides then the seals will only hold short term.

[Rufton]

I would dissect "collapsed" lifter to determine what is going on. I would prefer using repaired/cleaned "collapsed" lifter instead of new lifter on used cam.

I don't follow the connection between collapsed lifter and bent PR.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by Rufton

I would dissect "collapsed" lifter to determine what is going on. I would prefer using repaired/cleaned "collapsed" lifter instead of new lifter on used cam.

I don't follow the connection between collapsed lifter and bent PR.

True. The callapsed lifter will creat excessive lash and this can really beat the valve train. If it was bad the pushrod can possibly just callapse and bend especially at higher rpm. I've never heard or seen this happen but it's possible
If the insides just got stuck then a good dissecting and cleaning like I suggested will do fine
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[mopar346]

Callapsed will mushroom a valve stem, stuck will bend a push rod.

Maybe that is what the mechanic said mushroomed valve stem instead of mushroomed valve seal, still wouldn't cause a push rod to bend though.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

If the rocker jumped to the side and got smacked right it could bind and bend. Slots possible when the valve train isn't working right and unstable. But that's why I would check that whole valve train in that section
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[mopar346]

Not completely impossible I guess.

[Desert1957]

Not trying to kill your project. IMO having that mush $$$$ tied up in a 20 plus year 305 is a waste of money.New top end with a high mileage bottom end????

305 engines were not that great to start with , had no power and camshaft issues.

I just went through this on my 83 and found out it was cheaper by far just to put a NEW GM crate motor in. You can get deals on free shipping sometimes, upgrade to a 350, and be much happier.

You are prepared to spend possible $1500 per your previous post.


Desert

[truckdude239]

http://www.jegs.com/i/Chevrolet-Perf...oductId=752506

[Desert1957]

Originally Posted by truckdude239

http://www.jegs.com/i/Chevrolet-Perf...oductId=752506

Yes, that's the one. I got an additional $200 off that price for a one day "Black Friday" deal.

Desert

[Ardee83]

Thank you everyone!! That 350 is already in my cart from JEGS. I am going to do the swap and I will become familiar with the motor on the 305 as it sets in my garage and I begin to tinker on it. I get the best of both worlds a good solid motor and a motor to learn on. Thank you everyone for the advice and help. I love this forum!!!

[Rufton]

Originally Posted by Ardee83

Thank you everyone!! That 350 is already in my cart from JEGS. I am going to do the swap and I will become familiar with the motor on the 305 as it sets in my garage and I begin to tinker on it. I get the best of both worlds a good solid motor and a motor to learn on. Thank you everyone for the advice and help. I love this forum!!!

Smart decision. Congrats

[Ardee83]

Thank you! I just purchased it from JEGS eBay store. They are runnin a special right now, $200 off still free shipping got it for 1,299.99. Now to find a cherry picker..... Anyone?
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