nv4500 question

[61K10]

sent an e-mail to A/adapters asking about their adapter plate to mount a dodge nv4500 to a chevy bell/h. (stock 61 hyd clutch). their reply was that i would have to mod my b/h, but he didn't say what or how to mod. is it to openthe hols up to the bigger bearing retainer size? anybody done this swap?

[franken]

You need to figure out the differences in the various years on NV4500, and then the differences between GM and Dodge.

I think there were only 2 bolt patterns. The early GM 93-95 and the rest. The early GM pattern is like the standard GM pattern from earlier years.

The later GM bolt pattern to the BH is the same as all Dodge.

Have a look at AAs website, and P/N 712756, which is a BH kit for the later GM trans to bolt to a Chevy engine, with the clutch fork on the left. Best price I've found lately is from northwestfab.com, but it's not cheap ~$350. There may be other options for the Dodge to Chevy route.

This is just what I think is true--do the research...

From the AA conversion guide:

"Dodge NV4500 (93-2006): This trans is the same as the 96-99 Chevy version; however, the only difference is the input shaft, output shaft, and tailhousing. The 2001 and newer Dodge transmissions were changed to a 29 spline input shaft."

AA will mail you the conversion guide and a catalog if you ask.

So, the Dodge trans and 96 and up Chevy transmissions won't bolt to you're BH.

[dieseldude4bt]

The adapter from A/A has a 5.125 retainer size your bell housing is smaller 4.8 something? otherwise it should work.

[franken]

Sorry, I looked on AA and see the plate...now.

http://www.advanceadapters.com/produ...ter-plate-kit/

The pdf has more info:
http://www.advanceadapters.com/downloads/712550.pdf

['63GENIII]

Do I see a NV4500 swap thread on the horizon?

[61K10]

thanks for the reply's. dieseldude that's what thought might be the case. don't want to cut up my truck with new x-members and such. anybody ever mill out the small b/h? I would think the adapter would add some strength----

63G--just thinken--an OD would be nice

[dieseldude4bt]

You could use a bell housing from the next generation truck it still used bell housing mounts and larger index hole but clutch lever is on drivers side. Hydraulic bracket mounts are available for them.

['63GENIII]

Do you have the 4500 yet? Also, what transfer case do you have and which are you thinking of using? I used a 93 2wd with the BH that it came with. I kept the t221 ( way less headaches) divorced
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[61K10]

what year is the later bell? 70/72? yes i could use A/A hyd bracket. could i use my org master cyl with it? will be using my t221 t/c, and no i don't have a trans yet.

[bhc41051]

I wonder how you would mount the transfer case shifter on the new transmission....

['63GENIII]

Other than the AA BH and the stock (non Ls) BH, I'm not sure what the options are for bell housing. Having the T case divorced made my swap easier though. I liked the early 2wd GM 4500 because it does have the lower 1st gear and is pretty compact (in length). It also seemed cheaper than the Dodge ones and they don't seem to have the main shaft issues either.
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[dieseldude4bt]

My bell housing is cast iron and has mount pads and 5.125 bore. I was told it came from the first chevy trucks to use the sm465 trans so i would assume 69-70?

[burnin oil]

Originally Posted by '63GENIII

Other than the AA BH and the stock (non Ls) BH, I'm not sure what the options are for bell housing. Having the T case divorced made my swap easier though. I liked the early 2wd GM 4500 because it does have the lower 1st gear and is pretty compact (in length). It also seemed cheaper than the Dodge ones and they don't seem to have the main shaft issues either.
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Put the chevy version behind a Cummins and it will have the same issue. Vibration from low RPM torque. Either way a great transmission

['63GENIII]

Originally Posted by burnin oil

Put the chevy version behind a Cummins and it will have the same issue. Vibration from low RPM torque. Either way a great transmission

What I had found while doing research when I rebuilt mine was that they are conservatively rated at 425-450 ft.lbs. While the 2wd main shaft seems to be supported differently than the 4wd model ( which seems a little more rigid) , it does seem that the ones behind Cummins engines tend to suffer from deflection of the main shaft or bending from the torque of "turned up" Cummins engines. The deflection then leads to fretting which I think is fracturing of the splines and loosening of the tolerances between the ms and 5th gear. Once the nut loosens enough... 5th gear is gone. I don't know of a lot of 800-1100 ft.lb Chevys but it seems like everyone knows someone with a Cummins layin down numbers like that. I agree, its a great transmission that's stronger than I need for any big block that I will ever have AND its got OD. If you can get into one cheap, I'd do it in a heart beat. Don't be afraid of the GM 4500's either. They are plenty strong and seem to be less sought after for the tractor pull guys ( which makes em cheaper!)
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['63GENIII]

Man that was a long post! Check out Quad 4x4 for some great info. I rebuilt mine with their book.
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[61K10]

the reason i said dodge is, doesn't it have a longer input shaft that works with the aa/plate?

[dieseldude4bt]

Yes Dodge gas engine is longer, 1 1/8 dia.

[burnin oil]

I beat the crap out of a NV4500 for years behind a Cummins 12v. Easily over 1100 ftlbs of torque and full power blasts through the gears daily. Trans still worked fine when I swapped to a 6spd. Even towed a 16k lb trailer a few times. That trans will be going into my 72 one of these days with the above adapter and dodge input gear. Going to use factory dodge parts to marry the 205 case also but I will have to make an adapter plate to cobble it together. Got the parts other than the rebuild kit for the 205 on hand and just need more time. Way to many projects going on!

['63GENIII]

I didn't realize the Dodges were longer. The 1-1/8 input is nice too. If youre ever down by the Bay Area, come by and check out my swap. I love mine and wish I did it a long time ago.

[61K10]

63GENIII--------have any pics of your setup?

[Iron Hauler]

63Geniii, I would really like to see some pics of your setup as well.

[burnin oil]

Originally Posted by '63GENIII

I didn't realize the Dodges were longer. The 1-1/8 input is nice too. If youre ever down by the Bay Area, come by and check out my swap. I love mine and wish I did it a long time ago.

Dodge input shafts are longer with a different throwout bearing size. Overall the 4x4 trans is smaller than a chevy. The tail section that covers the 5th gear is more compact. Dodge and chevys have different mainshaft spline counts for the output. V10 and diesels have a larger diameter input gear and the diesel guys tend to put an even larger aftermarket input gear in there.

[dieseldude4bt]

360 (5.9) Gas Dodge and Chevy have the same spline count, the Dodge is just longer, it allows for use of the AA/adapter on a Chevy bell with the Chevy throw out bearing and fork.
Dodge used two different input shafts depending on the application.

[61K10]

for my swap these are 2wd trans as i have a divorced t/c

[burnin oil]

Originally Posted by dieseldude4bt

360 (5.9) Gas Dodge and Chevy have the same spline count, the Dodge is just longer, it allows for use of the AA/adapter on a Chevy bell with the Chevy throw out bearing and fork.
Dodge used two different input shafts depending on the application.

Different pilot bearing. A/A special as far as I can tell. I couldn't find it speced anywhere else. I have the adapter kit collecting dust in a corner until I have a chance to check out my spare transfer case and build an adapter plate. As you said same diameter input for the chevy and dodge light duty 4500 with the dodge being longer (and different input bearing size). V10/diesel are the larger input size in the 4500 HD version. The inputs are 100% interchangeable with the exception of the early GM case. My swap will eventually be with the Dodge 4500HD with the LD Dodge input installed with the advance adapter. Going this route because I already have it from a 6spd swap in another truck.