goose neck towing with K20

[K20chevy]

Does anyone use a goose neck on their 73-87 chevy? I was wondering which one is the best and also what the tow ratings are for a setup like this.

I do have a class 5 hitch below the bumper, which is rated at 12000 lbs (15000 lbs weight distributing), however I know the original tow rating is not as high.

Not sure how much a 78 K20 was rated for towing from the factory. Granted I have a D60 front with 08 F550 brakes and a 14 bolt rear with 08 3500 Dodge brakes, so the brakes and axles can handle way more than what the truck came with stock.

As for the goose neck, were these trucks ever rated for goose necks back then? Or do the hitch manufacturers factor the truck capability in, when they release a hitch for a specific truck? Or is the rating just for the hitch itself?

Just trying to figure out if a goose neck is worth the extra work on these old trucks or not...

[Chevy3+3]

My 87 K20 had a gooseneck plate with a welded ball in it when I got it. I towed with it several times but not much. I now have a gooseneck plate and flip over ball in my 88' V30 crew and I have towed a decent amount with it. the most I've probably towed on a trailer was around 10-12,000 lbs I believe (combined trailer & load weight).

in my opinion these trucks can handle it just fine. Since your truck has a lot of mods I wouldn't be scared at all. The frames are strong enough. I just have a solid plate steel bolted through the bed floor. The large Grade 8 bolts run through the entire frame rail for added strength. Some people weld in the hitches inbetween the frame rails. Its strong but I don't like welding things to a frame.

Your best and cleanest option is to buy a B & W turnover gooseneck hitch. They are built specifically for your truck and bolt into the frame rails. I have installed several myself on past trucks I have owned. The cost about $400-450 which is a little pricey but in my opinion well worth it. They are heavy built and good quality.

Here is a couple of pics of my truck towing gooseneck

[Myers horsepower]

I use the B&W hitch GNRK1400, works great. I have one on my 1990 V3500, used the same hitch on a 1977 K20 that I had, Easy to install and small hole in bed. Pull a 20ft 14K gooseneck with a D2 dozer with No problems.

[K20chevy]

Originally Posted by Chevy3+3

My 87 K20 had a gooseneck plate with a welded ball in it when I got it. I towed with it several times but not much. I now have a gooseneck plate and flip over ball in my 88' V30 crew and I have towed a decent amount with it. the most I've probably towed on a trailer was around 10-12,000 lbs I believe (combined trailer & load weight).

in my opinion these trucks can handle it just fine. Since your truck has a lot of mods I wouldn't be scared at all. The frames are strong enough. I just have a solid plate steel bolted through the bed floor. The large Grade 8 bolts run through the entire frame rail for added strength. Some people weld in the hitches inbetween the frame rails. Its strong but I don't like welding things to a frame.

Your best and cleanest option is to buy a B & W turnover gooseneck hitch. They are built specifically for your truck and bolt into the frame rails. I have installed several myself on past trucks I have owned. The cost about $400-450 which is a little pricey but in my opinion well worth it. They are heavy built and good quality.

Here is a couple of pics of my truck towing gooseneck

Wow, thanks for the pics. Your´s is a Dually though, so I´m sure mine would be able to handle a little less. I have been looking at the B&W turnover hitch.

I just wasn´t sure what that is rated for....

Originally Posted by Myers horsepower

I use the B&W hitch GNRK1400, works great. I have one on my 1990 V3500, used the same hitch on a 1977 K20 that I had, Easy to install and small hole in bed. Pull a 20ft 14K gooseneck with a D2 dozer with No problems.

Wow, 14K should be more than plenty for what I would use it for. I just like the idea of a gooseneck more for heavy loads than the regular reveiver hitch.

Is there any cover for that hole, so when not in use the moisture can´t get in between the turnover ball and the square tube? (or sand and stuff like that)

Thanks a lot for the info!

[Chevy3+3]

As far as I know there is no cover for the B&W turnover ball. Even without a cover I never had any problems with the ball getting stuck from debris. I guess it depends on how much you use it. I used mine a decent amount but my bed was always dirty with dirt and other crap, lol. I actually always left my ball exposed ready for a trailer unless I needed to load something in the bed that required me to have a flat surface then I would flip it over out of the way.

Your K20 being a single wheel will do just fine. Just make sure your tires are properly inflated, hook up your trailer and let er' rip. You'll be suprise how nice it tows. If I'm not mistaken the B&W is the strongest bolt in turnover hitch on the market. I want to say they are rated for 20k but could be wrong. I think their website gives the specs for their hitches.

[K20chevy]

Originally Posted by Chevy3+3

As far as I know there is no cover for the B&W turnover ball. Even without a cover I never had any problems with the ball getting stuck from debris. I guess it depends on how much you use it. I used mine a decent amount but my bed was always dirty with dirt and other crap, lol. I actually always left my ball exposed ready for a trailer unless I needed to load something in the bed that required me to have a flat surface then I would flip it over out of the way.

Your K20 being a single wheel will do just fine. Just make sure your tires are properly inflated, hook up your trailer and let er' rip. You'll be suprise how nice it tows. If I'm not mistaken the B&W is the strongest bolt in turnover hitch on the market. I want to say they are rated for 20k but could be wrong. I think their website gives the specs for their hitches.

Thanks for the input, I really appreciate it! I read that most people had issues with the powder coating on the B&W hitches... Did you have the same problem? I checked and the turn over ball is rated at 30000 lbs and 7500 lbs vertical weight.. that is A LOT!!! Way more than the truck could ever handle!

I like the part that the bed stays usable to the full potential and that the vertical weight of the trailer is directly above the axle, compared to way behind the axle on a reviever hitch setup. I have the receiver hitch on there but for heavy towing I guess the goose neck is the safer and better way to go!

[Greenlee]

When I was a kid In the late 70's / early 80's my dad pulled a backhoe that probably weighed 14,000 lbs on a goose neck trailer with a 78' c20. Looking back now we had to be way overloaded! Apparently, the truck handled it just fine because he did that for years.

[Myers horsepower]

I haven't had any problems with the ball sticking in the mount or with the powder coating. I have had mine for over 11yrs I don't live in a salt state thow.(just alot of rain)

[Kinze]

Originally Posted by K20chevy

Does anyone use a goose neck on their 73-87 chevy? I was wondering which one is the best and also what the tow ratings are for a setup like this.

I do have a class 5 hitch below the bumper, which is rated at 12000 lbs (15000 lbs weight distributing), however I know the original tow rating is not as high.

Not sure how much a 78 K20 was rated for towing from the factory. Granted I have a D60 front with 08 F550 brakes and a 14 bolt rear with 08 3500 Dodge brakes, so the brakes and axles can handle way more than what the truck came with stock.

As for the goose neck, were these trucks ever rated for goose necks back then? Or do the hitch manufacturers factor the truck capability in, when they release a hitch for a specific truck? Or is the rating just for the hitch itself?

Just trying to figure out if a goose neck is worth the extra work on these old trucks or not...

I have a B+W gooseneck on order, I am not impressed with the bracket but I do like the fact that the ball can be pulled for a flat bed floor. I would be glad to take some pics any anyone wants to see it.

I would LOVE to hear/see more of these F550 brakes you added, how did you do it?

[Kinze]

Just read your build thread and thought it was great!

I think you will find the B+W your best option as they are the only ones making a gooseneck hitch for these trucks.

What are you using to power your brakes, hydroboost? What master cylinder? Guessing the rotor size makes your run a 17in. rim minimum?

Thanks and letme know if you need any pictures for the hitch.

[K20chevy]

Originally Posted by Greenlee

When I was a kid In the late 70's / early 80's my dad pulled a backhoe that probably weighed 14,000 lbs on a goose neck trailer with a 78' c20. Looking back now we had to be way overloaded! Apparently, the truck handled it just fine because he did that for years.

Thanks for the input. 14000 lbs is quite a bit for an old truck like that...

Originally Posted by Myers horsepower

I haven't had any problems with the ball sticking in the mount or with the powder coating. I have had mine for over 11yrs I don't live in a salt state thow.(just alot of rain)

Thanks. My truck lives in the salt area, but never gets driven as soon as there is salt on the road... so salt will not rot this truck all to h$&?.

Originally Posted by Kinze

I have a B+W gooseneck on order, I am not impressed with the bracket but I do like the fact that the ball can be pulled for a flat bed floor. I would be glad to take some pics any anyone wants to see it.

I would LOVE to hear/see more of these F550 brakes you added, how did you do it?

That is the same thing that kept me from ordering a goose neck in the past. I wanted to retain the full bed and not have some kind of mount sticking out in the middle of the bed. Sure, I´d be very interested in pictures of the hitch and how you´ll mount it. Thanks in advance!

The only thing I´m worried about is the clearance between the hitch and the rear diff at full bump. Sure the truck is lifted and with the very stiff springs now it shouldn´t be a problem. But once the long travel suspension is in, not sure if the diff would actually hit the hitch. -> maybe your pics can help me with that.

As for the brakes: The whole front axle was custom built by Dynatrac. It is a Dynatrac D60 Pro Series Diff set up as a passenger Side drop. It is a high pinion center section and the complete inner and outer C´s and knukles are all from an 08 F550 truck. So the F550 brakes bolt right up.
These things are huge: 14.54" rotors and massive dual piston calipers.

Originally Posted by Kinze

Just read your build thread and thought it was great!

I think you will find the B+W your best option as they are the only ones making a gooseneck hitch for these trucks.

What are you using to power your brakes, hydroboost? What master cylinder? Guessing the rotor size makes your run a 17in. rim minimum?

Thanks and letme know if you need any pictures for the hitch.

I´m using the stock "big brake" booster that came on the truck, so no hydroboost. The Master cylinder is out of an 88 Chevy P30 step van that had a disc/disc setup from the factory and matches the MC bore of the F550.

I also changed the proportioning valve to a disc/disc unit.

As for the wheels, that is adifficult story. Since the rotors and calipers are so big, I normally would have had to go to an 18" or even 20" wheel. To keep the stock look I wanted a 17" though but most of the wheels just didn´t have anough clearance. With the calipers, the diameter around the caliper is 16.05", which pretty much makes it impossible to run a 17" wheel. I went as far as working with Dynatrac and the wheel manufacturers putting the CAD drawing of their wheels over the CAD drawing of my axle to see if we have clearance. And this WELD racing forged wheel was THE ONLY 17" wheel that we could fit over the brakes! Only draw back, the clearance is so minimal that I can´t even run ballance weights anymore. I tried some "ballance powder" that they use for big rigs and so far even at over 70 mph it works great without any shakes.
So unless you would use these weld 17" wheels, you would have to go to 18" or 20" wheels.

But I have to say the brakes work like a champ. you can easily lock up all 4 37" tires without much force on the pedal. this thing stops on a dime now!

[K20chevy]

Any updates on the hitch install? Maybe some pics???

[LuckyLightning]

I just want to add a comment that seems to be missing here:

• K10 and K20 frames are identical (spring and axle combinations change the towing capacity for each)
• K30 frames are a bit thicker
• K30 crew cabs are even thicker than standard K30 frames

C10 and C20 is rated approximately for 500 lbs. more than their K counterparts. This is because the extra weight for 4x4 components cut into total towing capacity.

I've seen different numbers for towing capacity for C10/C20 and K10/K20 (anywhere from 5500 to 7500), but keep in mind nothing magical will happen the minute you go over the official weight capacity. Your truck will not break. The safety weight rating from the factory is well below what the truck can actually handle (maybe half?). BUT you also have to consider for your route what the road conditions will be like, the speed you plan to travel, and the distance.

I have a '79 K20 (long bed). The PO welded on a light pole for the rear bumper (it's pretty stout). He then towed approximately 14k total in trailer and junk. However, he only went about 10-20 miles, and didn't go over 40mph. Road condition was what you'd expect for small town roads (a bit bumpy).

And lastly, don't just think about being able to move forward with a large load and hope you don't break your truck. Probably more important is the ability to stop. You'll want to make sure the truck can stop each and every time reliably and safely.

Point being: just be reasonable, and think about the safety of other people on the road first. Being overzealous in what you think your truck can "safely" tow could cause injury or death for someone else - and you're 100% accountable for all of it too.

[nekkidhillbilly]

i know people who pull some goosenecks with half tons. prob not that heavy but still.

[MalibuSSwagon]

Originally Posted by nekkidhillbilly

i know people who pull some goosenecks with half tons. prob not that heavy but still.

My parents did in the late 80's to early 90's. My Dad installed a turnover ball in the bed of their 1984 C10 SWB, and towed a gooseneck horse trailer with it. My Dad said it towed just fine, altho he did install a 300HP 350 since the 250 six was a bit sluggish on hills (ya think!)

[K20chevy]

Does anyone with the B&W turnover ball hitch have a measurement on how low the ball comes down toward the rear axle?

That would be great!

Thanks!

[Bigstevex4]

This guy has the trick set up if you havnt ever seen this its not a put on.
Scarey yes!

[slotard]

Originally Posted by LuckyLightning

I just want to add a comment that seems to be missing here:

• K10 and K20 frames are identical (spring and axle combinations change the towing capacity for each)
• K30 frames are a bit thicker
• K30 crew cabs are even thicker than standard K30 frames

C10 and C20 is rated approximately for 500 lbs. more than their K counterparts. This is because the extra weight for 4x4 components cut into total towing capacity.

I've seen different numbers for towing capacity for C10/C20 and K10/K20 (anywhere from 5500 to 7500), but keep in mind nothing magical will happen the minute you go over the official weight capacity. Your truck will not break. The safety weight rating from the factory is well below what the truck can actually handle (maybe half?). BUT you also have to consider for your route what the road conditions will be like, the speed you plan to travel, and the distance.

I have a '79 K20 (long bed). The PO welded on a light pole for the rear bumper (it's pretty stout). He then towed approximately 14k total in trailer and junk. However, he only went about 10-20 miles, and didn't go over 40mph. Road condition was what you'd expect for small town roads (a bit bumpy).

And lastly, don't just think about being able to move forward with a large load and hope you don't break your truck. Probably more important is the ability to stop. You'll want to make sure the truck can stop each and every time reliably and safely.

Point being: just be reasonable, and think about the safety of other people on the road first. Being overzealous in what you think your truck can "safely" tow could cause injury or death for someone else - and you're 100% accountable for all of it too.

[IG]http://michaelholdren.com/online_pictures/truck/1979_k20/PO_towing/IMG_8115.jpg[/IMG]

[IG]http://michaelholdren.com/online_pictures/truck/1979_k20/PO_towing/IMG_8119.jpg[/IMG]

You sure the 10 and 20 frames are the same? I thought the 20 frame was the same height and width but thicker material.

I also saw this posted in an old thread here, from the '78 owner's manual, claiming that a C20 or C30 pickup can tow 12k.



I don't believe 78 was special. On the other hand, it is strange that a C10 is listed as able to tow more than a K30.

[K20chevy]

Originally Posted by LuckyLightning

I just want to add a comment that seems to be missing here:

• K10 and K20 frames are identical (spring and axle combinations change the towing capacity for each)
• K30 frames are a bit thicker
• K30 crew cabs are even thicker than standard K30 frames

C10 and C20 is rated approximately for 500 lbs. more than their K counterparts. This is because the extra weight for 4x4 components cut into total towing capacity.

I've seen different numbers for towing capacity for C10/C20 and K10/K20 (anywhere from 5500 to 7500), but keep in mind nothing magical will happen the minute you go over the official weight capacity. Your truck will not break. The safety weight rating from the factory is well below what the truck can actually handle (maybe half?). BUT you also have to consider for your route what the road conditions will be like, the speed you plan to travel, and the distance.

I have a '79 K20 (long bed). The PO welded on a light pole for the rear bumper (it's pretty stout). He then towed approximately 14k total in trailer and junk. However, he only went about 10-20 miles, and didn't go over 40mph. Road condition was what you'd expect for small town roads (a bit bumpy).

And lastly, don't just think about being able to move forward with a large load and hope you don't break your truck. Probably more important is the ability to stop. You'll want to make sure the truck can stop each and every time reliably and safely. I think with 2008 F550 brakes my truck should stop whatever it is rated for no problem as the F550 can tow about twice as much if not more!

Point being: just be reasonable, and think about the safety of other people on the road first. Being overzealous in what you think your truck can "safely" tow could cause injury or death for someone else - and you're 100% accountable for all of it too.

That is why I´m asking, I want to tow, but within the specs and withing a safe ballpark! I know my axles, brakes etc can handle it.

Originally Posted by nekkidhillbilly

i know people who pull some goosenecks with half tons. prob not that heavy but still.

true, but I would´t want to use a half ton to tow a lot, that is not what they were built for!

Originally Posted by MalibuSSwagon

My parents did in the late 80's to early 90's. My Dad installed a turnover ball in the bed of their 1984 C10 SWB, and towed a gooseneck horse trailer with it. My Dad said it towed just fine, altho he did install a 300HP 350 since the 250 six was a bit sluggish on hills (ya think!)

Originally Posted by Bigstevex4

This guy has the trick set up if you havnt ever seen this its not a put on.
Scarey yes!
Attachment 1336830

Attachment 1336832

Attachment 1336833

very scary!!!!

Originally Posted by slotard

You sure the 10 and 20 frames are the same? I thought the 20 frame was the same height and width but thicker material.

that is correct, the "shape" of the K10 and K20 frames are the exact same, but the K20 frame is thicker. The K30 frame has the same thickness of the K20 frame but the profile is much larger.

I also saw this posted in an old thread here, from the '78 owner's manual, claiming that a C20 or C30 pickup can tow 12k.



I don't believe 78 was special. On the other hand, it is strange that a C10 is listed as able to tow more than a K30.

[mattybilt79]

Hitches are rated individually. Goosenecks are rated by vertical load and overall weight as fas as I know. Gooseneck balls are typically rated at 25 or 30k. As far as hitches for a 78 would have to go for manufacturer recommendations which usually don't go back that far. So it becomes a matter of what will fit from what others have. Chevy had trailering special packages but don't know if that was goose/5th wheel specific. C/K trucks had different ratings based on drive train due to weight differences and I'm sure having full time chain drive 203 t-cases might have reduced tow weights some to save part breakage. Same is true for new trucks there are different ratings for 2/4wd standard cab/crew cab etc. Chevy based tow ratings on drive train in the vehicle due to variables you have to know what your truck is equipped with, your truck is far from factory so only thing to go from is what its capabilities were from the factory. If you get busted pulling an overloaded trailer law enforcement goes off whatever they can find on or about the truck so if stock was 6500 pounds stay close to that and know that newer motor axles etc can handle it no problem.

[slotard]

Originally Posted by mattybilt79

Hitches are rated individually. Goosenecks are rated by vertical load and overall weight as fas as I know. Gooseneck balls are typically rated at 25 or 30k. As far as hitches for a 78 would have to go for manufacturer recommendations which usually don't go back that far. So it becomes a matter of what will fit from what others have. Chevy had trailering special packages but don't know if that was goose/5th wheel specific. C/K trucks had different ratings based on drive train due to weight differences and I'm sure having full time chain drive 203 t-cases might have reduced tow weights some to save part breakage. Same is true for new trucks there are different ratings for 2/4wd standard cab/crew cab etc. Chevy based tow ratings on drive train in the vehicle due to variables you have to know what your truck is equipped with, your truck is far from factory so only thing to go from is what its capabilities were from the factory. If you get busted pulling an overloaded trailer law enforcement goes off whatever they can find on or about the truck so if stock was 6500 pounds stay close to that and know that newer motor axles etc can handle it no problem.

A big part of why modern trucks have different ratings based on all that stuff is to keep GVWR/GCWR below thresholds that change emissions/registration/etc.

[K20chevy]

You guys are right, the officer pulling one over probably just goes by what the OEM towing capacity is, he probably won´t care if everything on the truck is 1 1/2 ton rated or higher.

There is no way to get the towing capacity approved with all the changes made to the truck, right? (I assume for A LOT of money like the OEM it might be) but I´m talking about just someone checking the stuff on the truck and stating it is capable of a lot more than what it used to...

No idea if that would work.. Then it would be the safe and legal way.


However, I´m still concerned about the goose neck hitch hanging too low "into" the frame rails. I have a rear 4-link in the works which puts the upper triangulated links over the diff. Not sure if at full bump the link mounts would hit the goose nech hitch... Does anyone have a measurement for me??

Thanks and Merry Christmas to everyone!