IFS front clip swaps.

[MichiganJames]

I am looking into building my 54 3100 and everybody keeps telling me to do an entire frame swap. I really dont think I want to go to go that route. Anything worth considering for to buy for a decent price is all rotted out.

What other options out there are worth looking into?
Sub frame swap?
Prefabbed mustang II?

Could I just use an s10 frame front clip?

I need help deciding!! As far as my plans are air suspension and carb'd LS 5.3

[Rickysnickers]

Well, I recently purchased a '57. It had a MII front end installed. I like it. It's the custom IFS from Classic Performance Parts, http://www.classicperform.com/Store/...ks/UCI5559.htm Mine's not chrome though.

[torchlight]

If your original frame is in good shape, I think it's a great idea to consider using it with some modern upgrades to give you the updated handling you're looking for. There are a bunch of different options for the pre-fabbed IFS units. There are bolt-in and weld-in options for a variety of budgets. And they've done the design work so they'll come (mostly) properly set up for your truck. Could take a lot of the guesswork out of it for your build.

[MichiganJames]

Can an s10 front clip be mated to the original frame to give me IFS?

[Paid to Ride]

Attachment 1353545
We are using the TCI Mustang II IFS.

This is on my 55 Chevy.

[mr48chev]

There are who knows how many MII based kits out there including at least two crossmembers that bolt on and use either stock MII suspension pieces or tube A arms.
www.industrialchassis.com turns out a really nice crossmeber that uses Dodge Dakota pieces that give you a truck that drives great while being able to do truck stuff if you want to. It also is a lot better fit than the S-10 swap.

The S-10 swap started because it was cheap ten years ago. You drug an S-10 standard cab long bed pickup with a dead engine home for free or maybe 100 bucks at the most and then rolled the body off and set yours on.
Then someone started selling kits to mount them for 1500 and now guys advocate going out and buying a running and driving truck for a couple of thousand bucks and taking the body off. I don't see an advantage or cost saving in doing that and it becomes a thing of doing it because the "cool guys" did it.

I'm one of the bunch who advocates using the stock frame (if it is in real good condition) and adding independent front suspension. It's a lot simpler to line up body parts and to me if just flat makes for a better truck

I had my truck subframed in the past when that was the hot lick thing to do and it drove great but I doubt if I would ever do another one that way. There are just better ways now.
I and some other guys are putting Jag XJ 6 suspensions under the front of our trucks and they fit well, don't cost all that much to begin with and drive great when done. I've found out that they can be hard to find if you don't live close to a major city though as I can't find parts in the local wrecking yards.

Look at all the options and then decide but don't fall into the "everyone else does it" trap on any change you make.

[octanejunkie]

http://www.industrialchassisinc.com

[DransportGarage]

I'm a big fan of the IFS route. I did a Fatman on mine.



Springs aren't in yet on this picture. Nice & clean, room for everything...

[octanejunkie]

I would love IFS but I don't want to lower my truck. I'm looking at Scott's Hot Rod in Oxnard, CA - they build custom weld-in and bolt-on IFS kits to order.

[MichiganJames]

But what about just using an s10 front clip? can this be done? has it been done?

[Kabwe]

Originally Posted by MichiganJames

But what about just using an s10 front clip? can this be done? has it been done?

Yes you can do that. Check this out from one of the members here http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=559086

He was going to do a Camaro clip but later decided to use a 1997 S10 IFS attached to his original frame. The install start at post 12.

[joedoh]

you can clip anything to anything. the guy I bought a bed from had an s10 clipped truck. I thought I had taken more pictures and maybe I have them on a work archive but this is the truck. It wasnt stellar work


the point is, you can install anything, and you can also install anything badly. a completely bolt in setup wont work very well if you dont have any mechanical discipline, which can go for both a bolt in MII setup and for the bolt on s10 frame swap (which I think is the $1500 setup mr48 is referring to).

Ask yourself what you want to do with this truck. If you are looking for a drop dead gorgeous hot rod at the end, a custom front suspension might be the way to go.
Purists and old timey hotrodders prefer the MII (or dakota) route because it can be very cleanly installed on the original frame. Thats nice, but even the least expensive kit bought in parts will be over 2k by the time you buy all the required parts like a steering rack and arms and tie rods and brakes. and then you still need to put it on. plan for replacement parts by asking what the rotors and pads are from, tie rods, control arm bushings, etc. MII and dakota use steering racks, so ask about that part too, so you know what to tell the guy at the part counter.

An S10 swap can be done cleanly and safely. Its not just the cool kids doing them either, skymangs thread in the sticky section shows how it can be done to give you a good solid driver truck. There will always be the old traditionalists caterwauling about the swap but here is the thing, if you arent planning a nut and bolt restoration and want a great way to go cruising and have fun, and upgrade to disc brakes and power steering, and find all your wear parts at any part counter anywhere, it makes a lot of sense. The frame is easily set up for a V8, and if you keep the rearend that is one less conversion that is needed because it already has an open driveline and highway gears. I recommend doing a ball joint and bushing refresh on whatever s10 donor you use, its inexpensive, under 400 dollars for every wear item and can be replaced in an afternoon. You can buy a running donor and offset the cost by selling body and drivetrain parts, or check with the local salvage, around here an entire s10 roller frame is $250-300 because there are just so many of them in salvage yards owing to the fleet acceptance of the truck. the entirety of my s10 swap on my 65 did not cost what even the crossmember setup from porterbuilt fabrications cost, which by the way is totally worth the price and is a work of art in its own right.

as far as clipping, the original rails can be kept, I dont have a how to for you but it can be done by any shop that will swap in a camaro or g body. if you are doing it yourself a lot can be learned here even if not directly applicable to an s10 clip, so look around.

for clipping or frame swapping, keep legality in mind. The rules for finding the VIN on trucks are pretty clear and were developed so that people with newer and more valuable trucks did not steal an undamaged truck and swap VINs with a totalled truck, using part or all of the donor and thereby laundering the stolen parts. Although these rules are not intended to keep a guy from combining old body parts with more modern frames, you WILL have to adhere to the rules. Here in Kansas it is very simple, keep a record of where the donor parts were purchased and any VINs from the parts, a title or bill of sale for a frame, and when the truck is done have that VIN assigned as part of your build. This will help when selling on, if you ever do. I have done this for my S10 swapped 1965 and it is easy. Lots of guys talk scary about title issues, but the rules are there to catch chop shops, not the hobbyist.

again, anything can be done poorly. there is a 56 ford with a MII around the corner from my house that is done so scarily that I asked the guy to call me whenever he is going out so I can stay home. There is an S10 swapped truck at a local dealer that is gorgeous and has been done cleanly and is worth the 29k they are asking for the truck. Think about what you want to do, go cruising? win shows? sell on? and that will set the plan for your upgrade. Read skymangs S10 swap thread in the stickys. Look in the project section for MII swaps.

edit: I guess technically my 65 is clipped since we backhalfed it. So I can speak from experience of both an s10 frame swap and a clip transition. Build things cleanly and strong and no one can knock your ride.

body mounts:




clip transition:

fish plates for strength:



cleaned up

[MichiganJames]

well the way i see it, a mustang ii will run me about $2000 and that is just to far out of the budget. I know for resale value its worth the investment.

I want to bag the front of the truck. I might do the rear also but I know for a fact i want the front bagged so when parked i can get the hotrod stance i want. I know transition of the frame is important and will need to be planned very carefully to be done right. I dont like the transition in the link posted. It just dont have a great execution. And since I am going to swap the front, I will also swap the rear axle to s10 with disk brakes. So suspension wise everything will be s10.

[55dude]

if you have a S10 clip and it was free use it! toyota trucks work great, later ford ranger are killer since they have power R&P! if your going aftermarket http://www.industrialchassisinc.com steve is smart and builds nice stuff. man bmw stuff is nice just build some rails! you coudn't give me a m2!

[Speedbumpauto]

It "doesn't" have a great execution? You set a pretty high standard for yourself if you have a problem with the same pics I looked at. The welds are great, the fabrication of the boxing plates and all the mounts/brackets looks really good to me. If you are capable of that kind of work and you're making decisions based on a few hundred dollars, you might need to rethink. Most of these projects end up pretty expensive and, in the end, you could be looking at a sweet project that is hampered by some budget mistakes made in the early stages of "I'm on a budget." I know of what I speak as I'm once again spending time and money changing some drivetrain decisions I made early in the project. It's frustrating and takes away driving/enjoyment time from the project, but, trust me, once you see the problem limitations, you won't be able to let them go.

[MichiganJames]

im talking about the link posted by kabwe a few posts up.. the pictures posted just a above are great!

[gag1025]

We used a Chassis Engineering IFS Mustang II on my 1953 Chevy truck. It was easy and fit perfectly. The instructions made it painless. I am glad I went this route. A wonderful addition.