Guys, I need some window regulator advice

[RIDE-RED 350r]

I need to replace both manual window regulators in my '78 K-10.

Are the LMC regulators at $50 each better than the ones I find on Ebay and other online sources for $25-30 each?? I don't have a problem getting the regulators from LMC if they are in fact superior to the ones I find elsewhere online.

Also, LMC has different crank handles for different years of trucks. It so happens that the only handles listed for my '78 are the black plastic ones. I would like to use the later style metal cranks. I see in most cases the regulators are the same from '74-'87 and some places offer one type of crank for all years.

I have searched here and mostly find threads about how to change the regulators (which have been insightful I might add) but not finding much on the particular questions I have.

In case anyone is wondering or can offer another solution: The reason I believe my regulators are bad is that all of the sudden, the mechanism seemed to want to lock up as I tried to raise or lower the window. I pulled the door panel expecting to find some issues with the track and/or rollers, but it seems that the bushings that the crank shaft rides in have worn to the point that the crank shaft is sloppy enough in the gearbox that the little gear seems to bind and not mesh properly with the sector gear causing the binding.

I tried lubricating the track and rollers and it did nothing to help. All of the rollers and track seem to be intact. The problem seems to be with the gearbox.

Funny thing is, the passenger side window crapped out, then 2 weeks later my driver side did the same thing...

Any advice offered would be much appreciated.

Thanks,
Joe

[thinair]

PM sent

[tucsonjwt]

I would try to find AC/Delco regulators.

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Yes,

Lucky for me a member here contacted me and I now have an OEM regulator still in the box coming for the passenger side.

I'll see if I can hunt up another for the drivers side.

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Had a good day at the junkyard today..

Scored a seemingly well functioning drivers side window regulator and as an added bonus, got some VERY nice stainless door mirrors to replace my painted units.

$35 out the door for all.. That's a good day!

[bmchevy1979]

As far as the crank handles go they will all interchange 73-91 lmc list them by what they were on originally

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Originally Posted by bmchevy1979

As far as the crank handles go they will all interchange 73-91 lmc list them by what they were on originally

Thanks for confirming what I suspected might be the case.

[bmchevy1979]

Also 73-76 hand cranks are the weakest ones especially parts store replacement so if you want a chrome plated metal crank I would go with the 80s ones

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Thats what I ordered..

The black plastic ones that were listed for my '78 strip out way too easily.

To complete the story: When my first window regulator took a dump I thought I had just stripped out the old crank handle. I happened to have a coffee can with several black plastic cranks... So, I grabbed one, put it on and gave it a crank. Stripped instantly and much too easily. I'll pass on those.

Granted, I wasn't fully aware that my regulator had locked up at that moment.. But it still took very little force to ruin the spline in the plastic crank.

[bmchevy1979]

Well the earlier metal ones break the handle right at the round part that covers the clip they are to thin in this area they will strip but they usually break. Glad I never put the plastic ones on my 79 when I but manual windows in it

[motornut]

I am using 87 cranks and window regulators in my 78.
I'd undo the 4 bolts and see if it can be ajusted,to work easier

[superwade57]

Originally Posted by RIDE-RED 350r

Had a good day at the junkyard today..

Scored a seemingly well functioning drivers side window regulator and as an added bonus, got some VERY nice stainless door mirrors to replace my painted units.

$35 out the door for all.. That's a good day!

And what are you doing with the painted ones????? I may be interested

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Originally Posted by superwade57

And what are you doing with the painted ones????? I may be interested

They are painted black and due to be re-painted. I could send them your way for $20 for the pair plus the ride. If you are interested let me know and I'll post some pics.


Back to what is turning out to be quite the QUEST to get both of my windows working again.... (Pulling what's left of my hair out!)

I received a GM NOS regulator for the passenger side today that was sent to me by a member here. (Thank you Sir!) So, I unboxed that, grabbed the driver side regulator I picked at the junkyard and decided to get started.

I got my vent window out without issue, got the door window out, and then the regulator.. All going good, right?? WRONG!!!

I get the old regulator out of the window and it dawns on me... The rollers on the regulator that was in my truck are smaller than the wheels on the 2 units I had planned to install!! WTF! So I guess either my doors are or glass and regulators are from an older truck..

I had the quick thought of just going to the junkyard and getting the glass out of the truck I picked the regulator from.. Wrong!! Can't do that, the door tracks in my doors are also made for the smaller wheels! I can't win for losing!

So, I am thinking what I need to do is order the rollers and rivets for a '73 from LMC truck and install those on my new regulators.

Can anyone please verify that I can do this without issues before I pull the trigger. It's not about the money, it's more about me wanting to end the hassle and get these darn windows working before the hot weather gets here.

Also, will I need any special tools to install the replacement rollers on my new regulators? LMC lists them as "roller and rivet". I am cautiously assuming here that I can drill the old roller rivets and install the new ones, hopefully with my pop riveter?? Or even if I have to take them to a shop to install the rollers, I'm OK with that too.

As I said above, comparing the newer style regs I have side by side to the older style regs that are in my truck, the two are identical as best I can tell other than the size of the rollers.

So frustrating, I had no way of knowing ahead of time that I had the small rollers and tracks as I had nothing to compare them to...until today! LOL! And yes, I did pull the passenger side door panel to confirm what size rollers were there... Small rollers and tracks there too.. At least they match!

[motornut]

not sure when they changed but yes the 78 glass was thicker,then the 89 I put in.
No roller issues,I think I used these

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Originally Posted by motornut

not sure when they changed but yes the 78 glass was thicker,then the 89 I put in.
No roller issues,I think I used these

The window regulator you have pictured has the newer style large rollers.

The rollers I need are smaller than that.

My issue is not about the glass thickness, its the size of the rollers. The style you pictured will not fit in the window track or door track.

I ordered the roller/rivets listed in LMC as for a '73. I have been told the small ones were used until '77 model year when they went to the larger rollers. So LMC's year specs may be off a bit.

Anyhow, I now await the arrival of 6 new '73 style small rollers. I hope I can figure out a way to peen the rivets as I think they are solid tyoe and a pop riveter will not work....

I'll update when I get them in and get started on the project again...

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Well this quest is turning out to be quite the fiasco...

I got my '73 style rollers in the mail yesterday and got them swapped on to one of my regulators.

I had to get a little creative to make the smaller roller rivets (1/4") work in the larger (3/8") holes on my newer style regulator arms.

I cut small lengths (about 1/8") of 1/4" brake line. Fits perfectly over the 1/4" rivet and into the 3/8" hole in the arms. A nice shim of sorts.

I cut the pieces so they were a tad shorter than the rivet shank to give the rivet a chance to flare over top of the shim.

A 1/4" socket to support the rivet head, a brake line flaring cone to flare the rivet and shim, and a vice got the rollers installed and seeming to work.

The other thing I had to address, the shoulder of the rivet that bottoms on the arm is just barely larger than the 3/8" hole. So I used a thin 1/4" machine washer to make sure I didn't push the shoulder of the rivet into the hole on the arm. I hope that little smidge of difference doesn't hurt the function..

I have 1 more regulator to swap the small rollers onto after work tomorrow. I had to go to my son's baseball game tonight, so I ran out of time to finish up.

Hoping to finish the roller swap and get at least one regulator installed tomorrow..

I think next time my regulators fail, I'm just going to have to get the complete LMC regulators that have the correct size rollers. As I said before, I did not realize ahea.d of time that my truck had these. I am thinking someone swapped older doors onto my '78.

One question though: LMC lists 3 different type of regulators. One type for '73, one for '74-'76, and the last for '77-'87.

Then there are only two types of roller/rivets: One for '73 only, the rest for '74-'87.

Would this mean that my regulators, glass and possibly doors came out of a '73 only?? Was the only difference between '74-'76 and '77-'87 the crank handle shaft length??

Just want to know for future reference in case my retro fitted later style regulators fail and I have to get regulators again..

Thanks.

[Skunksmash]

Originally Posted by tucsonjwt

I would try to find AC/Delco regulators.

This. IIRC, they can be had on rockauto. They're more expensive, sure. But they're well worth it, its not worth the headache dealing with cheap junk that was a pain in the rump to install.

[RIDE-RED 350r]

Well, I acquired an NOS GM regulator for the passenger side and picked a good working OEM from the junkyard for the driver side...


Got both regulators in and everything works as it should!!

I also cleaned the window and door tracks with carb cleaner and a wire brush and then a carb cleaner soaked rag. There was alot of old, gummy lube in them.

I re-lubed them with Fliud Film if anyone has heard of it. It is really good stuff.

The only trouble I had was with the passenger side window. I was trying to roll it down to facilitate removal of the vent window and the window was just plain stuck in the up position. Despite my best efforts to help it down while turning on the crank handle shaft with a pair of vise grips, I actually separated the window track from the glass! Almost all of the gripping material remained so I tapped it back on with a small rubber mallet. It seated pretty tight and I managed to get fully seated again.

But anyway, thank you all for the help and advice. I will be enjoying having a pair of functional door windows as the weather gets warmer here.