Alternator...opened up a mess...love the PO

[JimmyCriswell]

I need some help gentlemen. 68 C10 3 gauge dash. I may have to take some picture to get good feedback, but I will start with a description.

The box (external regulator?) around the drivers headlight on my truck has nothing wired to it.
I have an SI alternator in it right now...plug is 2 prong -- style. At this point, I would like to wire the alternator in the truck up correctly to see if it works. Do I need to purchase any type of harness since nothing is plugged into what I believe to be the external regulator.
I really do have to send some pictures of how it is done. All electrical tape....corrosion is unreal and the fuse box seems to be toast around many of the connectors.

1. i don't have the money for a brand new wiring assembly right now (any thoughts on this as none of the wires will come out of the factory fuse box in the motor compartment?

2. How to wire the alternator up properly since there is no external regulator and the current wiring has had it. What wire gauges do I need for each wire.

Good thing I really enjoy working on the truck!

The FAQ for alternator alternator wiring has been taken down as all of the great links I click on go directly to the down site under Electrical, and alternator FAQ.


Jimmy Criswell

[67 chevelle]

READ THIS
http://www.madelectrical.com/electrical-tech.shtml

[VetteVet]

That won't do you much good read this.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=417872

[eyedrron]

Avoid the electrical gremlin and buy a one wire alternator.

[67 chevelle]

remote sensing has advantages over " one wire"

[VetteVet]

Originally Posted by 67 chevelle

remote sensing has advantages over " one wire"

Not to mention that he has a 3 gauge cluster so his charging light will not work.

Here's how I wire up the internal regulated SI alternator. You can't get any easier than this.

[67 chevelle]

Nice schematic vetvet , after lots of trail and error , this is the way I have been wiring my older vehicles and find that dash lights are brighter , and voltage to the fuse block is slightly higher than any one wire system provides

I see lots of vehicles where the owners or their mechanics just run a very short red wire from the number 2 post to the output post and call it good , while this does work to some extent ,it is not ideal , the diagram you posted works so much better

[VetteVet]

Originally Posted by 67 chevelle

Nice schematic vetvet , after lots of trail and error , this is the way I have been wiring my older vehicles and find that dash lights are brighter , and voltage to the fuse block is slightly higher than any one wire system provides

I see lots of vehicles where the owners or their mechanics just run a very short red wire from the number 2 post to the output post and call it good , while this does work to some extent ,it is not ideal , the diagram you posted works so much better

You're right on all counts and the beauty of it all is the newer CS 130 and CS144s are wired the same way. All that's needed is to drop a 75 ohm 1 watt resistor in the brown wire and run it to the L terminal on the CS and the red sensor wire goes to the S terminal. Not only that but looping the 2 terminal to the back of the alternator renders the battery gauge useless.

[JimmyCriswell]

Ok, have attached some pictures of fuseblock and wiring of alternator. I just got my throttle rod set up. All lights work and I do not want to purchase a complete re-wire kit yet. Please give me some feedback. I want to replace the wires with good wire for the alternator circuit.

[68 P.O.S.]

I bought one of these from Wes at Classic Heartbeat: http://www.classicheartbeat.com/Elec...rnal%20alt.htm
It's a quality item.

[67 chevelle]

Looks like standard stock 50 year old wireing , your junction block where the red wire splits to the horn relay and alternator looks like its been pretty hot in the past ,Id up gauge that wire from the junction , to the relay , from the relay to the junction block above the battery , and from there to the battery , The wire that runs on top of the heater core from alt to battery is too lite a gauge when you start adding things to these trucks that they did not have stock ,, its the only charging wire
Another wiring issue you should be aware of is the wite cloth wire coming off the bulkhead conector , its a resistor wire designed to energize the coil on a points ignition , if your ignition has been changed to a hei [ most have] , you need to replace that wire with a non resistor wire so the hei ignition gets a full 12 volts , if its stock original , or a points ignition , you need that resistor wire

[JimmyCriswell]

Thank you for the advice on the cloth wire. How do you pull connectors out of the junction block.

I am beginning to see that I really need to re-wire this truck. I just do not have the funds for it right at the moment. Some of the wires going into the fuseblock appear to have melted the plastic around the terminal. I am afraid getting them to release will be quite difficult. What gauge wire should I use for that?

Is there a good kit that is not terribly expensive that is HEI and internal regulated alternator available. I see the painless but I just cannot afford 500+ dollars at the moment.

[87Skier]

To pull the connectors out you have to pinch the terminal a little to get it to slide out. Picture is attached. They are called "Packard 56" connectors or terminals.

Here is your warning though, they don't want to come out. You will have to use pliers to pull them out and will probably mess up the terminal itself.

[JimmyCriswell]

Has anyone else done this? I have a wire that is exposed that I would like to replace that is fusible and hooked up to the HEI. I think all the other connections are tight enough with no exposed copper.

Just looking for suggestions. I don't want to mess up the terminal until I am ready to replace the entire bulkhead. Is there a place to get reproductions of the entire bulkhead?

[RenoKeene]

You should be able to get a good used engine harness on the parts board here, lots of good people here willing to help out.

[leftybass209]

Originally Posted by JimmyCriswell

Has anyone else done this? I have a wire that is exposed that I would like to replace that is fusible and hooked up to the HEI. I think all the other connections are tight enough with no exposed copper.

Just looking for suggestions. I don't want to mess up the terminal until I am ready to replace the entire bulkhead. Is there a place to get reproductions of the entire bulkhead?

I have replaced a couple of wires on my OEM harness, namely adding a choke wire to the TSC terminal, adding my HEI wire to the stock bulkhead and completely eliminating the eternal regulator, and ammeter wiring.

Wiring is unbelievably simple if you're replacing one wire at a time. If you want to replace that one wire, here are some tips, but not specific to the wire you're replacing:

Isolate the one wire from end to end as best you can, and determine what gauge it is, if it is linked to any other wires along its path, and if it needs to be a heavier gauge.

make sure you have a couple terminals for each end if you aren't familiar with soldering and crimping. Packard terminals can be attached using just a normal crimper, needle nose pliers, and/or a flat blade screwdriver and a lightweight hammer. They do make specific crimpers for them, but if you don't anticipate rewiring a vehicle using those connections, they aren't worth the cost.

you can always clip a wire, leaving a bit of a lead on the piece clipped, so that if you do make a mistake, you can solder it back and use some heat shrink to ensure it's sealed well. Try not to make that mistake though!

you can create a "new wire", disconnect the old wire (while still leaving it attached to the harness) and just run your new wire from terminal to terminal to see if it is accomplishing what you need it to. Once you verify it works, then you can completely remove the old wire and fit the new wire in with the harness. (I hope that makes sense)

[JimmyCriswell]

I believe I am going to attempt this tonight and see if I can remove the male end of the packard connection to replace that wire. I am worried about the exposure.

Long term, I will definitely be re-wiring this truck.

You are some good folks. I really appreciate all of the help!

[leftybass209]

the male end is easily removed using a tiny flat blade screwdriver and depressing the tab that locks it in. I've broke a few tabs, and depressed a few and pulled the entire terminal out. Ultimately the end result is the same; it comes free! I could explain it over and over using text, but it's something that's best to just look at for yourself and figure out.

Napa and many online outlets sell the terminals if you don't have any on hand.

Best of luck!!!!

[VetteVet]

This a great thread on six cylinder HEI swaps with some help on your terminal problem.
Start on post 13.


http://www.google.com/url?q=http://6...CeDHWuG-aVjVeQ

[JimmyCriswell]

I got the terminal removed from the bulkhead. I will need to buy some new Packard terminals to finish the job. Hopefully, I can pick some up at napa.

Next step is to replace the junction and wiring for the alternator to see if I can get it to work better with less resistance.

Recommendations on where to get the gm style terminal? Or recommend another type?
Posted via Mobile Device

[JimmyCriswell]

I went to napa to pick up a couple of packard male ends. I got the distributor wired back up.

Now I have to figure out what to do for the alternator. My factory junction needs to be replaced so I have to figure out something for that so I can re-wire everything else. The wire on the alternator that goes to the brown wire does what? I have an add on voltmeter that I a going to attempt to hook up and I will be using a remote sensing wire once I figure out where to send it to . I need to add a junction on the passenger side of the truck as well.

[leftybass209]

The wire on the alternator, that goes to the brown wire, eventually ends up at the ignition.

The junction can be handled a few different ways. Everyone has their own opinion about what the strongest least resistant connection is. Ill give you a couple ideas.

One, is for you to simply solder your connections together, similar to what GM did, but without the metal strap that was crimped on. this way is not ideal without some type of metal crimp connector.

Another idea, is to add a junction block, similar to what is (or should be) on your passenger fender. Placement is up to you, and what type of junction you use. The benefit is that the connections are easily removed if there is a problem.

Another idea, is you can use larger gauge crimp connectors, and run the smaller gauge wires into them. Solder and heat shrink those connections to make them as strong as they can be. This too, has the advantage of being removed if there is an issue, and can be wrapped with harness tape to hide the connection.

there are crimp connection "taps" as well. I used one on mine, in which a sandwich type female connector clamps over a wire, and can accept a male connector off of it. This is good to use when you're trying to tap a length of wire in the middle. It isn't the most ideal, but has worked flawlessly for me, I just anticipate problems down the road with connectivity.

Are you attempting to run the volt gauge in conjunction with the ammeter, or are you eliminating the ammeter all together? If you are eliminating it, and don't plan on ever using it again, you can also remove the two wires with inline fuses as they will be useless.

[JimmyCriswell]

I would not mind having the anmeter workable and using the volt meter. To be honest, I don't even see inline fuses on any of my wires.

PO or PPO removed terminal block on passenger side. I am seriously contemplating getting two terminal blocks and mounting one to each side to get everything wired properly. I wanted to get this done quickly but I want it done right too. My truck has not been started in over a week.

What wire do people typically add the diode to to eliminate current being pulled back out of the battery?

Finally, what gauge wire is recommended for this wiring?

And what type of diode is recommended. Are they all the same size/rating?

Jimmy Criswell

[VetteVet]

Originally Posted by JimmyCriswell

I would not mind having the anmeter workable and using the volt meter. To be honest, I don't even see inline fuses on any of my wires.

PO or PPO removed terminal block on passenger side. I am seriously contemplating getting two terminal blocks and mounting one to each side to get everything wired properly. I wanted to get this done quickly but I want it done right too. My truck has not been started in over a week.

What wire do people typically add the diode to to eliminate current being pulled back out of the battery?

Finally, what gauge wire is recommended for this wiring?

And what type of diode is recommended. Are they all the same size/rating?

Jimmy Criswell

I'm sorry I have been trying to get back to you on the forum but my circumstances have not allowed it.
until today. I will work with you here and in PMs but check your thread in this truck forum for pictures and diagrams.

The junction you need depends on the no. of circuits you want to run and you can always use sub junctions fed by the battery power wires.

If you have decided to use the ammeter in the stock gauge cluster for authenticity, or for restoration purposes, or just cause you want to, like me, then we'll need to run 18 gauge wires from the positive battery junction terminal on the right fender, which you don't have, all the way through the firewall block by the master cylinder into the cab and to the cluster plug to terminal 12 on the plug. If you are converting to a three gauge cluster to a seven gauge you'll have to move some of the wires around. I'll get into that more in the other forum.

The other wire that will go to the ammeter is also an 18 gauge black wire that will run from the alternator, battery, cab feed and alternator sensing wire junction. these two wires will need to be fused to protect the ammeter gauge internal circuits, by a minimum 4 amp fuse in each wire. The wires will need to be identified to avoid mixing them up, because the wires have to go on the cluster plug correctly. Otherwise the ammeter will read backwards.

If you use a 12 SI alternator from a mid to late eighties vehicle. you can use a 16 gauge tan or brown wire to the no. 1 terminal and a 12 gauge sensing wire for the no. 2 terminal on the alternator I would use a 10 gauge wire for the alternator feed wire to the main junction block. You should refer to my diagrams in this forum for reference. I can't post them in PMs

The wire that you use for the battery to the junction is a 12 gauge wire that normally runs across the top of the radiator and it is called the SHUNT because it shunts power back and forth between the battery and the alternator to charge the battery and to supply power to the main junction, for off engine power, or in case the alternator stops working. It is strictly battery power when that happens, so it will drain the battery fairly quickly.
__________________
VetteVet

[VetteVet]

The wiring junction in the first picture in post nine is the one that you will need to replace, with a junction like this.

Here is the soldered junction like my truck has.



This is the one mad electric sells with all the wires having fusible links for protection.