1970 c20 350 vs Toyota I force 5.7

[paulbrgr9999]

My tundra 5.7 puts out something like 380 HP, 400 foot lbs of torque.

What would I have to spend to get my 350 in my c20 to match those numbers? Would I have to get a stroker? Would a crate motor with a rv cam get me there?

I've pulled my toy hauler with both trucks. The trailer fully loaded is around 5000lbs. The tundra just flys along up and down hills. The Chevy 350 struggles.

Thank you

[Bigdav160]

A small supercharger would do it.

[hugger6933]

A vortec replacement motor with a LT4 hot cam and a good intake you will be right there with those numbers. Every magazine rag has done vortec articles or the last 20 years and made stupid numbers without much work. I'm talking vortec as in heads that are 96-99 truck so all the small block stuff will work saving money. It has been proven time and time again that those vortec heads make 40 hp over anything else chevy has done. Jim

[leftybass209]

Well first thing is first, NO you do not need to do a stroker to get that kind of power. It could help achieve that kind of HP later in the RPM band though.

Looking at crate engines, your options are slim to make that kind of power while keeping it everyday-driver capable.

The top Edelbrock package utilizing a GM Goodwrench 350 as the starting point, makes 363HP and 405ft-lbs of torque, and comes in at $6195.00 base price. That engine utilizes a roller cam, aluminum heads, and either a 750cfm carb, or dual quads.

That engine could be duplicated for a little under half their price if you do the work, sans warranty.

Of course there's dozens of ways to make that kind of power, and prices all over the map to match. Using Huggers suggestion of Vortec heads (Great idea!) The Goodwrench quest article from the early 2000's has a GM Crate with Vortec heads making 384hp, 401ft-lbs torque. The corvette LT-1 heads make slightly less HP/TQ but also shave weight.

[paulbrgr9999]

Any opinions on this:

http://www.westcoastengines.com/#!bu...for-sale/c10i4

[leftybass209]

yeah, I've got an opinion about that!

They state $300 core, $298 dyno session which they don't state mandatory or optional, and shipping starting at $150.

I prefer clear-cut pricing and no bs. So far, they have a $748 dollars in charges before you even pick a motor. Not to mention it's not clear of any charges for getting the core back to them, or if they'll accept your core to refund you that $300.

They name drop some brands and types like hypereutectic and melling but have no part numbers or additional information. They do however, show that they use parts store brand (pioneer) flywheel, balancer, rocker arms and rod bolts.

I'm not bagging on them, but I'd sure call them and find out what exactly is going into my engine.

[michael bustamante]

for the vortec heads.... does any body have cast # of what to look for? will they work on a '77 4 bolt main?

[leftybass209]

I don't have the casting # off hand. You can Google it.

Yes they'll work on any sbc, but the manifold needs to be changed to accommodate the revised mounting. (The bolts run straight down instead of angled)

They're about 300 bucks each, or whatever boneyard prices you have for a used set. They have a sawtooth pattern where the double hump castings are located. First year was 96 I think.

[michael bustamante]

ok the double triangles?

[leftybass209]

This was the info I pulled for the casting number, as per Super Chevy,

"Look for casting number 12558062, but avoid casting number 10239906, which has a modified exhaust seat and loses 20 percent of its flow at 0.120-inch lift."

The casting will have triple triangles, and look like the under bite of a classic carved pumpkin, to use an upcoming festive analogy. It's located between two accessory holes.

[Lattimer]

Originally Posted by paulbrgr9999

My tundra 5.7 puts out something like 380 HP, 400 foot lbs of torque.

What would I have to spend to get my 350 in my c20 to match those numbers? Would I have to get a stroker? Would a crate motor with a rv cam get me there?

I've pulled my toy hauler with both trucks. The trailer fully loaded is around 5000lbs. The tundra just flys along up and down hills. The Chevy 350 struggles.

Thank you

I have a Vortec crate motor in my Chevy. It engine dyno'd at 382 HP and 402 ft-lbs. Thats with a 600cfm 4-barrel and long tube headers.

I also have owned several Tundra's. Stock rating is 381 hp, 401 ft-lbs. Current one I just got and had the supercharger installed. 504 HP and 550 ft-lbs rated at the crank.

The Chevy used to feel like a hot rod with the huge weight difference. Now it feels slow.....

[summitflier]

VVT and Throttle body injection is a great thing.
Most of the newer LS's, Gen 3 Hemi's, and Coyote engines have this also.
The good ole 350 is 50 years old. Not many tundra's or Toyota V8s from that era.

But the ole 350 has a few tricks also.
http://www.chevrolet.com/performance...-burn-385.html
http://www.chevrolet.com/performance...t-350-400.html

Not bad for a 50 year old design... no superchargers or turbos required.
Even reasonable streetable.

If you want a newer engine to compete with newer technologies.. check the LS3's.
http://www.chevrolet.com/performance/crate-engines.html

Most are around 430hp, and at least one is rated at 480hp.

I have a smallblock in my truck.. I'd be happy to race your Tundra in it.

[Redline novdog]

I agree you do not need the stroker crank for those numbers.That is why the small block Chevy was THE MOTOR for building! There are as many builds on the net as there are cubic inches.Good heads,good cam,If you can use a die grinder, you can make a cheap set of heads very good.Bigger valves,good springs.The small block Chevy has not got the status it has because it's a slouch!!

[HeavyD]

The c20 is a heavy truck and could use the torque that a 383 would provide.

If the 350 is in good shape you can add heads intake exhaust cam usual goodies and will wake right up, but if it needs any shortblock work at all..I would buy a 383 kit and go from there.

[Z10]

ZZ383 Crate
425hp
449 lb-ft torque

That should do it.

http://www.chevrolet.com/performance...ck-zz-383.html

or

ZZ5
400hp
400 lb-ft torque
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/nal-19301294

or a tried and true ZZ4 will get you the torque and close to the HP.

355hp
405 lb-ft torque
http://www.chevrolet.com/performance...k-zz4-350.html
But instead of a carb, perhaps a little FIRST TPI?

[Redline novdog]

I should have added,depends on how much you want to spend,SBC parts are still very affordable and readily available. They will continue to drop off as the LS motors are getting more and more popular.

[ironroad9c1]

avoid any gm "Crate" engine , they use poorly cast blocks made in Mexico and are assembled there with poor quality control. find a good seasoned core out of a running truck and rebuild it, almost all used vortec heads I've looked at are cracked at the exhaust valve. they are thin castings

[Z10]

Originally Posted by ironroad9c1

avoid any gm "Crate" engine , they use poorly cast blocks made in Mexico and are assembled there with poor quality control. find a good seasoned core out of a running truck and rebuild it, almost all used vortec heads I've looked at are cracked at the exhaust valve. they are thin castings

I've had a couple of ZZ4 crate motors which have been made in Mexico, and I've had excellent service from them. I also have other friends with ZZ383, Ram Jet 350, and all of them are performing just fine. Also, the LS7,LS9, & LSX are assembled in the US. Do you have specific GM crate motors that you can reference?

I just don't accept the large net you've thrown over all GM crate motors.

[ironroad9c1]

how old is your engine ? If its over8-10 years old it most likely does not fall under this .
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/13-p...nightmare.html

http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/gm-c...ms-146622.html

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=586595

this was a high dollar race engine , and gm wouldn't even warrenty it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jTtviipmHg
I could go on all day,

[jjzepplin]

Hmm. A c10 with the reliability of a Toyota...Swap? I'ma go find me a wrecked Tundra!

[ironroad9c1]

look around and see how may 20 or even 15 year old toyotas are around.....

[Z10]

Originally Posted by ironroad9c1

how old is your engine ? If its over8-10 years old it most likely does not fall under this .
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/13-p...nightmare.html

http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/gm-c...ms-146622.html

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=586595

this was a high dollar race engine , and gm wouldn't even warrenty it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jTtviipmHg
I could go on all day,

One ZZ4 is 9 years old and the one with the most milage is 3 years old.

[CastIron]

The Toyota 5.7 is indeed a powerful engine. And it's pretty reliable too. But I wouldn't swap it into anything else. They are physically huge compared to a small block chevy. Even Toyota V-6s are big, about the same size as a small block.

[GMC Canuck]

I would love to have the roll down rear window of the crewmax tundra in my GMC. I think that would be a very cool mod.
If I were to do a toyota swap I'd skip the 3UR-FE (5.7L) and go for the 2JZ (inline 6) My long term plan for my galaxie is a 2JZ swap.

[XwalkerX]

Originally Posted by GMC Canuck

If I were to do a toyota swap I'd skip the 3UR-FE (5.7L) and go for the 2JZ (inline 6) My long term plan for my galaxie is a 2JZ swap.

the holy grail Toyota swap.

that would make the classic car guys cringe