Engine oil...... an interesting story

[leftybass209]

I'm taking some automotive classes at a local college. We had an engine with 200,000 miles come in for an inspection.

The owner religiously changed his oil every 3000 miles, give or take 100 or so. He was so OCD in fact, he carried spare filters and oil in case he needed to change during a long trip.

The engine mic'd out to OEM tolerances everywhere! Rod journals, main journals, bearing oil clearances, the whole deal.

Is it related to his rigorous service schedule? I think so. It was also a highway driven truck, never hot-rodded or abused.

Interesting none-the-less!

[GASoline71]

And I thought I had OCD issues... LOL

Gary

[Stocker]

Originally Posted by leftybass209

Is it related to his rigorous service schedule? I think so. It was also a highway driven truck, never hot-rodded or abused.

Interesting story, and I'm sure the frequent oil changes helped.... but I also think highway miles and no abuse probably had more to do with it.

[leftybass209]

I had to cut my initial post short because I was in class on break. To add to this, it was a early 2000's Silverado with the Vortec LS, unsure of the displacement. He pulled a large camper with it everywhere. In fact, the camper was still hooked when the truck came by for initial inspection.

He used Valvoline 10w30 conventional, no additives. He made sure to include it in the front seat for when the engine is back together Didn't see the filter brand though, maybe that's where the magic is! Haha

[Blown06]

Was this an old small block or an LS based engine?

My '71's original 350 had been maintained like that by the original owner, he only used Quaker State and always changed every 3000 miles. There wasn't one speck of sludge inside the engine when I tore it down, which was at 110K. But a lead footed teenager (me) managed to sink the valve seats and stretch the old timing chain, bearing wise it was pretty decent and you could barely see the copper in the bearings.

Just curious though.

[stomper]

Subscribed

[Mike C]

You can attribute some of it to newer oils (compared to stuff in the 70's and 80's) as well as his rigorous maintenance schedule, but the main factor is probably fuel injection. Never washing the cylinders down or running too rich contaminating the oil and removing lubrication from the cylinder walls.

I've seen quite a few 200,000 mile Nissan 2.8L 6 cylinders that you could still see the cylinder cross hatch in. FI amazing for helping engines last.

[Blown06]

Originally Posted by Mike C

You can attribute some of it to newer oils (compared to stuff in the 70's and 80's) as well as his rigorous maintenance schedule, but the main factor is probably fuel injection. Never washing the cylinders down or running too rich contaminating the oil and removing lubrication from the cylinder walls.

I've seen quite a few 200,000 mile Nissan 2.8L 6 cylinders that you could still see the cylinder cross hatch in. FI amazing for helping engines last.

I agree 100% about the fuel injection. The pic below is of my 2006, 5.3 with 120k miles. Pulled the heads because I had burnt some valves because I couldn't keep my foot out it when hauling a trailer. 11 pounds of boost and stock valve springs wasn't a smart move, but I was impressed how clean the cylinder walls were. You can see the cross hatch and this motor has had a blower on it for probably 80k of those 120k miles.

[71sierragrande]

Id say its more about highway miles than anything. I had a van that I bought with 345,000 miles and sold it with 385,000 miles still running good. The PO was a parcel driver and went from Michigan to Florida hundreds of times. It's the stop and go that kills them

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

I change my oil every 500-600 miles. Of course that's just once per year. I promise to drive it more often post restore.

['68OrangeSunshine]

I was anal about oil changes [ w/ Valvoline 30 weight Racing] at 2000 miles with a 292 bored .030 over in my '68 C/10 Stepside. I got 250,000 miles out of it in 25 years before I had to rebuild.
I haven't pulled an 'autopsy' on it yet as I had a spare 292 L6 block standing by. But I think it was "lead-foot related". A shop Sun-analysed it and they said I had no action on cylinders 3 and 4 -- the two cylinders closest to the 4 barrel 390 Holley carb on an Offy intake. Possible washdown. Maybe in the future I'll bore it out to .060 over and start again.

[BrianG]

Some one should have told him that he was wasting his money. 7,000 between oil changes no problem, and I'd bet it would have looked the same inside. I use synthetic and push it over 10,000 most of the time. I could be wrong, but I think the recommended is some where around 7,000 now. 3,000 miles was a good number when poorly running engines used gas guzzling carburetors and the oil was of much poorer quality. 185,000 plus miles on my wife's and my vehicles and they run like new. Fuel injection with every point along the way monitored and adjusting the motor to run cleanly and efficiently is a very big reason why these vehicles can get 300,000 plus miles between rebuilds.

[leftybass209]

Originally Posted by BrianG

Some one should have told him that he was wasting his money. 7,000 between oil changes no problem, and I'd bet it would have looked the same inside. I use synthetic and push it over 10,000 most of the time. I could be wrong, but I think the recommended is some where around 7,000 now. 3,000 miles was a good number when poorly running engines used gas guzzling carburetors and the oil was of much poorer quality. 185,000 plus miles on my wife's and my vehicles and they run like new. Fuel injection with every point along the way monitored and adjusting the motor to run cleanly and efficiently is a very big reason why these vehicles can get 300,000 plus miles between rebuilds.

I don't doubt that the oil change interval has the potential to be longer, but I have yet to see any information supporting the claim, ie: a test between two engines, one with oil changed at 3000 and one changed at 7000 to identify the wear differences, if any.

Oil companies would obviously love for us to use a minimum interval, because it's good for their business. Likewise, automotive manufacturers could potentially stress a longer duration between because it makes their vehicles seem tougher, and if there were issues, they'd bank on you fixing it at the dealership.

Like I said, I can't confirm or deny any claims made by any manufacturer without a 3rd party test from an entity that isn't benefiting from the information.

One thing is for sure, no one has ever had issues due to too many oil changes!

[hamjet]

Originally Posted by 71sierragrande

Id say its more about highway miles than anything. I had a van that I bought with 345,000 miles and sold it with 385,000 miles still running good. The PO was a parcel driver and went from Michigan to Florida hundreds of times. It's the stop and go that kills them

I agree with the long drives without stopping and starting theory. engine cooling down, tolerences change, dry starts, the carb putting raw gas down the cylinders till the choke pulls off, plus the newer engines have a closed emission system. back in the day we would take the air cleaner off and run it for years. all that dirt and such wiping between the pistons and cylinders, ( I'm getting off track). It's like the light bulb theory, if you turn it on and never shut it off it will last a looong time..

[Shaky]

As someone stated above, fuel injection is a big part of newer engines lasting longer. Also new cylinder wall honing technology, piston ring improvements, and better oils.

[special-K]

I tore down a 307 that was in a '71 K/20 mountain farm truck with 120,000 miles. It required no machining to overhaul, no cyl ridge, still had cross hatching, journals all mic'd to spec, round, and smooth as a baby's butt. That was a 2bbl, so less wash down than an old QuadraJet. The timing chain had jumped the crappy worn fiber gears and bent the push rods and a valve or two (while my boss was driving it...probably getting into it hard). So, I did a top-end, which they say is pissing into the wind on a small block with those miles, so I overhauled it. I put an RV cam in, hi-performance heads, and hopped it up a bit. Ran great for many more years

[Katrina/10]

Why was the engine disassembled?

[Bigdav160]

<yawn> When I was a GM tech, almost 20 years ago,we routinely had trucks with 300k, 400k, 500k on the odometer. There was a lube place down the street that had a customer's truck featured in the local paper; over 1,000,000 miles without engine problems. GM just shrugged, nothing special.

Tighter fuel control certainly is a factor but the anecdotes above were throttle body injected. Overdrive transmissions help a lot with overall rpms turned. Oil has gotten better. Rigorous Maintenance is paramount and easy driving can't hurt.

[WIDESIDE72]

Originally Posted by katrina/10

why was the engine disassembled?

x2

[WIDESIDE72]

I have a 2001 duramax LB7 with 285k. P.O. put 200k on it before me. His father in law was the owner but passed away. He used it to haul recycled cardboard bales, pulling an 18ft bumper pull with two bails and one in the bed. Son in law said his FIL always changed the oil (diesel specific but no particular brand) every 3k miles and used Wix filters. I had several K&N filters from my previous duramax so I use them. I am sure the engine will outlast me as I don't daily drive the truck, just for hauling.

[EARNHARDT#3]

I'm playing Russian roulette with my '02 Tahoe. 20k mile oil change intervals and filter ever 3k. Amsoil and AC Delco filters. When the motor goes, it goes. Then I'll probably be all over the Internet bashing Amsoil. Just kidding I'm not that type.

[biketopia]

Originally Posted by WIDESIDE72

I have a 2001 duramax LB7 with 285k. P.O. put 200k on it before me. His father in law was the owner but passed away. He used it to haul recycled cardboard bales, pulling an 18ft bumper pull with two bails and one in the bed. Son in law said his FIL always changed the oil (diesel specific but no particular brand) every 3k miles and used Wix filters. I had several K&N filters from my previous duramax so I use them. I am sure the engine will outlast me as I don't daily drive the truck, just for hauling.

It will out last you, tell the injectors crap out. The LB7 is the worst for the injectors and it's an expensive job. The ones in my 03 had just been replaced when I bought it from the dealer 6 years ago. Lots of guys get well over 150k out of each set in the LB7s though.

[leftybass209]

Interesting information everyone! So the concensus is fuel injection is the bigger contributor to longevity. I appreciate the responses, it helps the ol' knowledge bank!

Originally Posted by Bigdav160

<yawn> When I was a GM tech, almost 20 years ago

You can always move on and respond to a thread in which the technical information is more your caliber if something doesn't interest you.

[In The Ten Ring]

I always carry two quarts of oil in my trunk for when my car runs low. I change the oil every 3K miles in my Honda Accord, Valvoline 5w 20 conventional. Conventional is recommended in the manual and at that interval.

[ak808]

Originally Posted by biketopia

It will out last you, tell the injectors crap out. The LB7 is the worst for the injectors and it's an expensive job. The ones in my 03 had just been replaced when I bought it from the dealer 6 years ago. Lots of guys get well over 150k out of each set in the LB7s though.

Not intentionally changing the subject... but i replaced all 8 injectors at 80K and now at 150k they are gone again. I love my dmax, but I can't afford 8 injectors every few years!