Truck lost all electrical while jump starting

[HeloCrewChief]

I was jump starting my 71 C10 when it lost all electrical power. No lights, wipers, radio etc. I checked the battery connections and they are tight. Fusible link looks good. Fuses are good too. What should I check next? Has anyone else experienced a complete loss of electrical power during jump starting?

[LockDoc]

Originally Posted by HeloCrewChief

I was jump starting my 71 C10 when it lost all electrical power. No lights, wipers, radio etc. I checked the battery connections and they are tight. Fusible link looks good. Fuses are good too. What should I check next? Has anyone else experienced a complete loss of electrical power during jump starting?

I've never lost all power but I have blown a fuse or two. The first thing I would do is hook up a jumper wire from the positive post on the battery to the junction block on the inner fender to see if it restores power. (preferably with alligator clips) That will let you know for sure on the link. Did you remove the battery cables and clean the cables & posts? That's a good place to start....

LockDoc

[haysonj]

Dirty ground on the engine or the connection at the starter

[LockDoc]

Originally Posted by haysonj

Dirty ground on the engine or the connection at the starter

Ground would surely kill everything but the starter connection wouldn't affect the lights, wipers, or radio....

LockDoc

[dazza]

didn't cross your cables did you?

[5150.4.67]

Make sure you have voltage at the battery first.

[NoNeck]

What Jay said, but I think your battery has an internal short. Some people call it a "bad cell", but I would bet that it's toast and needs to be replaced.

Pull the battery, take it to be checked. Most auto parts stores will check it for free.

Good luck,
POP

[1fast10]

Im not 100% sure on the c10 trucsk but some older gm cars use fusable links in the main power to the fuse box. This is typically vwry close to the ring terminal going to the starters from. The heavy guage red wire from Firewall. These are not replaceble but can go bad. But start at the basics. Use multi meter check the battery power. If it have power then you need to check power at the fuses ect..

[dazza]

^^ Fusible Link... defo check that one, near your battery to junction block. Helped a friend with a mini motorhome last summer...exact same symptoms after trying to jump start.

[HeloCrewChief]

Ended up cleaning all the battery cables at both ends and I got electrical power back. The starter solenoid would just click like a bad starter would indicate. I figured maybe it got damaged during the cranking process even though I went easy on it. Pulled the starter and took it to the auto parts store for bench testing. They said it got really hot and barely passed so I replaced it. Installed the starter and got the same solenoid click. I do have a remote Ford type starter solenoid as well and tried swapping out with a spare one I have. I got one or two more clicks and now nothing. No solenoid clicks at all. Still have electrical power. Could a faulty ignition switch not have been sending enough juice and not crapped the bed? Unfortunately where the truck is located and my tool box are two separate areas. Its at a friends house when the issue occurred so, I need to go back with my multimeter and some more tools. I've had bad ignition switches before and now the latest symptom suggest that. I've also had bad fusible links and starters. Just weird the path this one followed. Went from a weak cranking battery, to a dead battery, to a solenoid click, to losing all electrical power, back to a solenoid click, now back to nothing.

[Killer Bee]

my swag is weak / damaged batt..
hot starter = high resistance = damaged battery
[and first four words of your op ]

but you should make a punch list and start crossing off known good items..

must verify all voltages from the battery in sequence or you could be chasing your tail all day

battery - load tested? cranking voltage drop? wet cell? age?
grounds - b- to block / block to firewall / etc.
hots - b+ to remote / remote to starter /etc.
voltages - what are they at load points? weak or zero? during cranking?

discon or remove any aftermarket devices that may influence current flow / voltage readings..

how did you install remote relay?
should be b+ to secondary / secondary to starter
s term wire from starter moves to relay primary / b- or good body ground to other primary [not shown in diagram]
install jumper from starter b+ to s term
move load wire up from b+ on starter to battery b+ at either remote or battery

good luck!

[HeloCrewChief]

Just a quick reply. I will elaborate later. I replaced the battery and it became weak during cranking. Took the battery back to get load tested and they said it was A ok.

[Killer Bee]

how does the engine turn by hand?

try stripping some circuits?

if battery is known good, sounds like high mechanical resistance or heavy parasitic draw somewhere that's reducing cranking voltage..

cranking voltage may reveal culprit..

don't overlook bad 'new' starter.. reman or new?

[HeloCrewChief]

I will dig deeper into it this weekend. I should have started this thread by mentioning I recently bought the truck out of an estate sale and was told all it needed was "gas and a battery". There has been all sorts of aftermarket items added to the truck so, it is possibly there is some deep rooted electrical gremlins. Just weird that I almost had it fired and then it started going downhill from there.

[Killer Bee]

hmmm.. that little tidbit would have been helpful in the beginning

so this truck has not been running since you bought it? parked for how long?

new battery or different battery? how are they testing your battery? microvat or midtronics?

go somewhere for a vat 40 or otc arbst tester for more accurate load test results..

pull all of the spark plugs and bar the engine over by hand before continuing..

if you hear squeaking or scraping noise from the plug holes, squirt some lube in there..

if it turns smoothly with normal resistance, then try cranking briefly with everything disconnected..

once you have established rotating group is turning smoothly and normal rpm, try starting again..

as I mentioned earlier, disconnect or remove any aftermarket devices that can be reducing cranking voltage..

once it's cranking like it should, make sure the fuel system is up to task and voila..

unless someone botched some sort of repair like timing chain replacement or similar that would prevent the engine from running, it should start..

if you are still having trouble, post a little youtube so we can hear it

interested now to find out what's actually going on, good luck!

[sleepertruck72]

I would ohm check the positive and ground cables while wiggling cable to check for good continuity ..I would actually just replace them to be sure they are good...assuming the engine is not hydrolocked , but for even more sh!ts and giggles I would use a good insulated handle screwdriver across terminals of starter to see if the engine will start Edit-- Damn alcohol lol I see you have the Ford style starter solenoid ..

[HeloCrewChief]

Thank you for the continuous help. I'm not much of a computer guy so, takes a bit for me to get the whole story out. I bought the C10 and a 67 El Camino from a couple that was settling a divorce. Both had not run in 3 years. I was told the el Camino needed just a battery. That one required a new fuel pump, fresh gas, carburetor, and new battery to get going. I was told the c10 just needed a carburetor rebuild. Obviously it has some electrical gremlins. I don't think the engine is seized as I did have it turning over initially and almost started (back fired through the carburetor) The C10 supposedly has a 383 stroker with a Powerdyne supercharger with 200 miles on the build. I should add that it no longer resembles an original truck. Never the battery has side post terminals. The cables look newer. I hope to be digging in a bit deeper with my multimeter soon. This truck has all sorts of afternarket electrical add ons such as stereo, air bags, msd ignition etc. so, there can be some gremlins hiding.

[Killer Bee]

oof, that looks messy..

hard telling what's all going on under there..

keeping my fingers crossed for you, good luck!

[BrianG]

The corrosion under the hood looks strange for everything being so new/low mileage. Could it have been in a flood perhaps? Have you checked/changed the oil. Maybe try pulling the plugs and see if you can rotate by hand and if so crank that way. Then reinstall the plugs and try again. I'll bet that'll be a fun truck when you do get it running!!!

[snipescastle2]

I once bought a barn find 67' Camaro that had been sitting for who knows how long, any way,long story short, it had a 327 that had seized up, got another 327 with it, that must have sat way longer, any way's, the guy I bought it from must have tried to start the engine at some point without pulling the plugs and shooting some WD 40 or at least oil in the cylinders before turning it over, needless to say, the rings were stuck and I'll bet I broke every oil ring land on every piston once it started....I could have "Fogged" the neighborhood for bugs as bad as that thing smoked......yanked the engine for a complete rebuild after witnessing that......
Ben

[HeloCrewChief]

I have inspected the truck and it just looks worse than it is from sitting. The owner lived right on the beach but, the truck was garage stored. Will look much better once I clean it up. I did have the truck cranking over pretty good and almost had it fired up but, before I got it fully running the battery slowly started draining and then led to the current state. I assume something was damaged during the jump starting procedure. I've been tracing all the wiring and testing everything. The only place I do not have 12 volts is at the remote solenoid mounted on the fender at the cable going to the starter. I assume I will only have 12 volts there while actually cranking? There is 12 volts at the "S" terminal on the solenoid and I believe the clicking I'm hearing is the actual ford solenoid and not the starter. I also tried jumping from the positive battery terminal to the "S" terminal on the ford solenoid and all that happens is the same clicking at the solenoid. The engine is a 383 Stroker with Edelbrock heads and obviously a powerdyne supercharger. I can see all the gaskets and they all look new. The carburetor is ugly as that is my temporary one I use around the shop. I have a new blow through carburetor on order. Was just trying to get her fired up to see if she runs as owner stated.

[Killer Bee]

yes, battery cable from remote to starter is only hot while cranking [remote relay closed]

hopefully not condescending, just throwing out some ideas of things that may be wrong or could have been overlooked..

recap on the starter wiring;
to convert the gm starter to one wire, you have to install a jumper from the battery terminal to the s terminal so that when the battery cable is energized, it also energizes the solenoid on the starter to engage the bendix to the flywheel.. one of the biggest advantages to this is removing the constantly energized battery cable from harms way [big culprit is headers] and relocate these terminations to the firewall for much better access.

so in doing this, the other vehicle fuse box and b+ power taps that were terminated to the battery cable stud on the starter now have to be relocated to b+ at the battery itself [most reliable, least resistance] or the b+ side of the newly installed remote.. the old starter wire from ignition switch circuit that was on the s sud on the starter gets moved to the stud on the new remote, the other side goes to a good ground.

so when the primary side of the new remote is closed [energized] the battery cable from the battery to the remote is connected to the battery cable from the remote to the starter.. and with the new jumper, the solenoid engages the bendix as the starter motor is energized..

isolate and energize the ignition, cranking can be accomplished under hood at the remote by jumping b+ to + term on remote, it should start if everything else is in order..

but as mentioned earlier, I would verify engine rotating group mechanically sound first.. if it cranks smoothly by hand it should crank smoothly by starter motor..

good luck!