Brake Issues

[BigMike56-72]

I have a question. Not sure if I really have a problem or not. I have a 72 C10 1/2 ton. Disc brakes up front drum brakes in the rear. I changed out the pads had the drums turned and installed new brake cylinders (bleed the brakes as well) . I have the truck on jack stands off the floor and was testing the brakes and I noticed that when I put the truck in drive I could not stop the truck. Well the rear drums would keep spinning no matter how hard I pressed the brakes. Is this normal? I'm kind of scared to drive this truck since I dont know if it will stop. No brake fluid leaks anywhere and I've bleed the brakes twice just to be sure no air was in the line. Any ideas on what could be going on here?



Thanks

Mike

[Leonard60]

Did you put the drums on then turn the adjusters out to where they start to drag then turn them back a little.

[midniteblues]

Yep adjust your shoes outward with the star wheel/adjuster till you cant turn the wheel/tire.
Then back off the adjuster wheel till you feel a good amount of drag on the drum.i always adjust them with the wheel/tire on.
It give you a better feel for the drag/friction.

It also looks like you have the shoes on wrong.

Short one goes on the front.

The Primary shoe is the one with the longer pad. It always goes on the "rear" and the shorter one goes on the front side.

[PanelDeland]

The little star wheel at the bottom is a brake adjuster, you may or may not have small slots in the drum or backing plate to put an adjuster thru. If you do simply turn the adjuster until you feel a slight drag on the wheel when turned. If there's no access turn it until the drum will barely fit over it and it should be close enough. They are auto adjusting and will tighten when you back up and apply the brakes. Since it's only one notch at a time, you don't want to have to adjust it all the way doing this(auto adjusters aren't great but generally will keep them in adjustment after they are set up.

[dmjlambert]

Originally Posted by midniteblues

Short one goes on the front.

The Primary shoe is the one with the longer pad. It always goes on the "rear" and the shorter one goes on the front side.

I was just reading and I don't follow this. On my truck (and in the picture above) the front and back shoes are the same. When I had the new shoe set in my hands and looking at them, I could tell no difference at all. I don't have a longer pad on one. Is that for a different model year that they are different sizes? Or am I misunderstanding?

[midniteblues]

Every set of rear drums I ever worked on in my life has a short and a long pad on the shoes.

Here is my 67 it has a 5 lug 72 rear in it.

you should measure the pads on this side and check the other side perhaps you put two shorties on one side and 2 longs on the other....it's possible.
check

[BigMike56-72]

Thanks guys for the help. Honestly I just took them apart the way they were. I took a bunch of pics before . Matched up the brake pads and put back on. That's not saying the pads were not put on wrong to begin with. There are no slots for the adjuster as well. I was wondering how the hell am I going to adjust these without a slot in them? lol. So, If all is working correctly I should be able to stop the drums when pressing the brakes right? Someone said maybe it was like a 70/30 thing with the brakes with this truck. 70 in the front and 30 in the rear. Not sure how true that is.


Mike

[BigMike56-72]

Originally Posted by dmjlambert

I was just reading and I don't follow this. On my truck (and in the picture above) the front and back shoes are the same. When I had the new shoe set in my hands and looking at them, I could tell no difference at all. I don't have a longer pad on one. Is that for a different model year that they are different sizes? Or am I misunderstanding?

I will check this as well and let you guys know what I find.

[dmjlambert]

Something I learned: preferably before putting the brakes together, push and tug on the parking brake cable to make sure it moves freely. I didn't do this, and later when getting the parking brake lever fixed and cable adjusted found I had to take the brakes apart to replace the cable that goes into back of the brake. Wear safety glasses.

[midniteblues]

If there is no slot for the adjusters they may be knock outs just be sure you knock the correct one out.

If ya don't have any access in the backing plate turn the star wheel/adjuster out till you can just barely get the drum on and do the reverse thing.

It's always a good idea when putting shoes on too pull apart the adjusters clean them and use lithium grease on the threads and the other end that turns.
And yes going in reverse will adjust the shoes, it make take a few times doing it before they get just rite...sometimes it only takes one time.
But it's always better to get them close before doing the reverse thing.

The Front discs will do most of the stopping.if they work you shouldn't have too much trouble stopping the truck. Just don't begin out in traffic.

It's kinda like putting new pads on disc's, you won't have a peddle till ya pump them.

I wander how many guys are pulling drums today too check there shoes

[cdowns]

most guys don't bother to read the factory service manual as to how to properly bleed the brakes so they work right// holding the pin in helps to do this crucial tsask

[BigMike56-72]

Originally Posted by cdowns

most guys don't bother to read the factory service manual as to how to properly bleed the brakes so they work right// holding the pin in helps to do this crucial tsask

Well, This would be me. I mean it's been years since I've had to bleed the brakes and come to find out I was doing it wrong. Good thing my buddy came down to help me look at the issue and we were chatting and I told him how I was bleeding the brakes and he said that's it your doing it wrong. Once we went around the truck again to bleed the brakes the correct way (pump, pump, pump, hold.. release the bleeder value and tighten) the rear brakes were stopping now. YES!!!

Also before that I also made the mistake of putting on the short brake pads on one side and the larger pads on the other. Big THANK YOU to midniteblues for pointing that out to me. I really wasn't looking at the brake pad but more the pattern of the brake pad itself. That's why I love forums like these. Good people helping each other out when they can.


Here's the after picture of the brake pads installed the correct way.

[midniteblues]

Like I said before that's why "most" of us are here too help and too get helped.

Yep all way check those pesky e brake cables.
I had one seize up on me. I was parked on a serious Hill once and used the p/e brake and it wouldn't release that was no fun cutting the cable rite inside the backing plate.
What made it worse was the hill I was on.

When doing shoes i usually Pull on the cables if there is any friction I pull them out (a small hose clamp snugged around the retaining fingers helps too pull them through the plate)
And put them into your oil drain bucket for a good while.
Hang and let drip dry, wipe them down and use a vise too hold them and work the cable back and forth.....if they are any good.

In your Last pic your adjusters still look way too far in.
Perhaps this pic was before adjusting?

[BigMike56-72]

Originally Posted by midniteblues

Like I said before that's why "most" of us are here too help and too get helped.

Yep all way check those pesky e brake cables.
I had one seize up on me. I was parked on a serious Hill once and used the p/e brake and it wouldn't release that was no fun cutting the cable rite inside the backing plate.
What made it worse was the hill I was on.

When doing shoes i usually Pull on the cables if there is any friction I pull them out (a small hose clamp snugged around the retaining fingers helps too pull them through the plate)
And put them into your oil drain bucket for a good while.
Hang and let drip dry, wipe them down and use a vise too hold them and work the cable back and forth.....if they are any good.

In your Last pic your adjusters still look way too far in.
Perhaps this pic was before adjusting?

Yes that pic was before any adjustments. Thank you again for all your help. I don't like the way the truck stops so I will be looking into adding a power booster. I will probably go with a whole kit that will replace the master cylinder and proportioning valve. The ones on the truck look like crap.

Any recommended ones you can think of?

[Stocker]

Just now found this thread, dunno how I missed it before. Looks like you're making great progress! Not much I can add..... If your backing plates don't have adjusting holes, make your own. After you drill the holes and adjust the star wheel (They tend to rust & seize up, a dab of antiseize on the threads will help), insert rubber plugs available from your local auto supply. Or maybe hardware store. With the fronts converted to disc, a power booster is a virtual necessity IMO, as is a prop valve b/c discs require higher line pressure than drums. And since shoe length was mentioned above, some vehicles did use equal-length shoes. From what I have read this applies mostly to older vehicles.