Making a Better 67 - 72

[LongBox]

Before I go into this too far, just want to make sure that everyone knows that I love the 67 - 72 GM pickups. The styling, the interiors, and the simple but rugged build make these a great hobby vehicle, and recent market prices show that they have become quite collectible, with some high-option or survivor trucks going for $50,000 or thereabouts.

I enjoy driving my 69, but I often find myself wishing that it had better steering (mine is non-power), better gas mileage, more relaxed cruising rpms, and some more creature comforts, all things that my 98 Silverado has.

So, I find myself building a better 67 - 72 in my mind. First, I did not buy this truck for good gas mileage, but really, 11 mpg is pretty crappy these days. So, the first thing I change is substituting a 700 R4 with its overdrive gear, for my perfectly good TH 350. I figure that I have a 3.73 rear gear now, and the OD would drop my revs at cruising speeds, and up the gas mileage. I guess this would pretty much bolt up, but crossmember relocation and driveshaft surgery might me needed, I'm not knowledgeable enough to be sure.

Changing to power steering seems like a no-brainer, and apparently pretty well anything from a GM truck from 67 - 88 will pretty much bolt in.

Carburators are definitely entertaining devices, and it's possible to fix it yourself on the kitchen table if you have to, but the fuel injection on my 98 gives easier starts, better drivability, better mileage, etc. There must be a good aftermarket intake manifold and FI kit that can be bolted up, and that self-tunes. Anyone out there got some recommendations on this?

The cowl vents on the 67 - 72s provide a great blast of outdoor air to your ankles and knees, but AC is a much better way to go, in my opinion. Since my truck does not have factory AC, an aftermarket kit looks like the only real alternative, and I have heard that Vintage Air make systems with a reasonable compressor, and I guess some sort of fix for the fact that the firewall holes would not be right. Wondering if anybody on this site has some opinions on fitting AC to these old trucks.

In the end, I'm thinking we'd have the kind of truck that would have been acceptable in the 90s, with the look we all like. Not sure what all this would cost, but my gut feeling is that the trans change and FI would not pay for themselves in terms of fuel savings, so if I did this, it would just be to make the truck the way I like it.

I'm not sure that the steering column on my 69 telescopes for accident protection, anyone out there know for sure? Seems like a good idea, as these trucks have no other safety features, such as airbags, shoulder belts, ABS, etc., a lot of which is not something I really want anyway.

Hoping this long post (apologies) starts some sort of discussion around the whole notion of restomodding these trucks to bring them up to current standards.

[GASoline71]

I hear ya...

But...

Just drive the truck and enjoy it for what it is. An old truck.



Gary

[truckster]

I don't disagree with Gary one bit, if that's what you want. But if you want something different, I say absolutely, build it the way you want it, especially if you intend to keep it.

I look at mine as something I will enjoy for a long, long time, and so I'm building it the way I want it. All of the things you've addressed are well documented on the board, and there are a lot of good examples of how to go about doing them.

[Lattimer]

Originally Posted by LongBox

Before I go into this too far, just want to make sure that everyone knows that I love the 67 - 72 GM pickups. The styling, the interiors, and the simple but rugged build make these a great hobby vehicle, and recent market prices show that they have become quite collectible, with some high-option or survivor trucks going for $50,000 or thereabouts.

I enjoy driving my 69, but I often find myself wishing that it had better steering (mine is non-power), better gas mileage, more relaxed cruising rpms, and some more creature comforts, all things that my 98 Silverado has.

So, I find myself building a better 67 - 72 in my mind. First, I did not buy this truck for good gas mileage, but really, 11 mpg is pretty crappy these days. So, the first thing I change is substituting a 700 R4 with its overdrive gear, for my perfectly good TH 350. I figure that I have a 3.73 rear gear now, and the OD would drop my revs at cruising speeds, and up the gas mileage. I guess this would pretty much bolt up, but crossmember relocation and driveshaft surgery might me needed, I'm not knowledgeable enough to be sure.

Changing to power steering seems like a no-brainer, and apparently pretty well anything from a GM truck from 67 - 88 will pretty much bolt in.

Carburators are definitely entertaining devices, and it's possible to fix it yourself on the kitchen table if you have to, but the fuel injection on my 98 gives easier starts, better drivability, better mileage, etc. There must be a good aftermarket intake manifold and FI kit that can be bolted up, and that self-tunes. Anyone out there got some recommendations on this?

The cowl vents on the 67 - 72s provide a great blast of outdoor air to your ankles and knees, but AC is a much better way to go, in my opinion. Since my truck does not have factory AC, an aftermarket kit looks like the only real alternative, and I have heard that Vintage Air make systems with a reasonable compressor, and I guess some sort of fix for the fact that the firewall holes would not be right. Wondering if anybody on this site has some opinions on fitting AC to these old trucks.

In the end, I'm thinking we'd have the kind of truck that would have been acceptable in the 90s, with the look we all like. Not sure what all this would cost, but my gut feeling is that the trans change and FI would not pay for themselves in terms of fuel savings, so if I did this, it would just be to make the truck the way I like it.

I'm not sure that the steering column on my 69 telescopes for accident protection, anyone out there know for sure? Seems like a good idea, as these trucks have no other safety features, such as airbags, shoulder belts, ABS, etc., a lot of which is not something I really want anyway.

Hoping this long post (apologies) starts some sort of discussion around the whole notion of restomodding these trucks to bring them up to current standards.

Have you read what a lot of us do to our trucks? Lots of build threads on here, and many have done exactly what you are discussing. Not everybody likes these old trucks to be modified, but many of us do a lot of things for comfort and performance.

Things like adding PS, PB, tilt column, AC, OD trans are very common and have been done by many on the board. FI is a pretty common thing as well, especially with the new low cost systems from Holley and FiTech.

Spend some time reading and searching and you will find every bit of info you will ever need.

[LongBox]

I hear you all. I do enjoy driving the old truck, the "vintage" feel can be entertaining and fun, but there are times, such as when I have to make tight maneuvers in a parking lot, that it starts to become work instead.

I have seen some of the build threads and threads on some of the specific topics. My old truck falls into the survivor category, so I'm reluctant to make any changes that take away from its character. Putting in a 700R4 and converting to PS probably doesn't take away the collectible value of the truck. Probably the best way to make any of the changes I mentioned is to find a suitable donor vehicle with the 700 R4 and a PS system that will swap right over.

I didn't mention disk brakes (mine has manual drums), but I've seen threads on that conversion as well.

Was just hoping to start a discussion about our old trucks, and how times have changed, and whether making some of these mods is a good thing to do. So thanks to those that have chimed in so far.

[davepl]

Fuel injection (in lieu of a perfectly set up QJet) plus a CPP modern steering box will go a long way towards a modern driving experience, but it's always going to be an old truck.

I put disc brakes on mine, but does that -feel- any different? Not really.

The on-center steering of the old boxes is pretty sloppy. I haven't upgraded mine yet but I have a Saginaw 600 box on my Camaro and it really improved the feel.

[Barnfind46]

The changes that were mentioned make driving these trucks more comfortable and safe,and as we get older we tend to be less tolerant of things that never bothered us in our younger years.All of these things take skill,knowledge or money to acquire but none of them are irreversible. If a truck is an investment than park it and wait for the value to go up. If it is your baby,make it yours and enjoy. I saw the same concerns back when muscle cars went from being old cars to being collectible. Some preferred to store their big block camaros and others took them on long trips across the country or raced them. Best advice is do what makes you happy.

[Coley]

Start with the basics on your list and keep ratcheting it up from there.
I would start with and definitely get a power steering unit in there....and if you can get one from a '73 to a '77 pickup given the fact they have a 'faster ratio'.
After that your in town driving experience will already have notched up by about 100%
After that....the option that I love, is the tilt wheel. In Canada we don't need the a/c very often...but that tilt wheel is in use every time I get in the truck. Having both a/c and tilt in my truck, I'd give up the a/c before the tilt.
The trans and diff upgrades are good idea but definitely a lot more work and a lot more money.
All Good
Coley

[70cst]

LongBox ...

What you want to do makes sense plus - its your truck so you need to do what makes your truck "your" truck. Some folks leave there truck 100% stock, some make a few changes here and there , or major mods.

Make your truck so is fun to drive and reflects your personality.

[HO455]

Here is a link to a great web site documenting a build of a 1952 Chevy pickup. He has a fuel mileage payoff calculator that tells you how many miles it takes to recover the cost of conversions. I showed it to a friend recently and he used it to decide what car for his new commute. (He went from 15 minutes to 70 minutes on a good day). The price of fuel now makes it less convincing to convert, but it wasn't that long ago it was $4.50 plus. It is easier to find the cash when gas is cheap. Good luck with your dilemma. If you want to drive the truck and changing it up make it more pleasant go for it. Heck you'll save money over buying a new one.

http://www.chuckthetruck.com/page26.html

This is the down load link for the calculator.

http://www.chuckthetruck.com/files/payback.xls

[coreyjhen]

Sounds like you're contemplating what I'm starting to do. Have fun!

[Trevor]

Updating (drivetrain, brakes, steering etc.) one of the best looking, timeless, most loved trucks ever built ? Is truly - the Best of both worlds !

The alternative ? You can spend 50 grand on a new truck, have all the gidgets and gadgets you could possibly imagine to distract and isolate you from the visceral experience that driving was always meant to be, and drive around in just another belly-button truck that happens to look exactly like three-quarters of the trucks in your neighborhood, and of course best of all - you get to watch it depreciate 35% before the warranty is up ...

It's a No-Brainer as far as I'm concerned !

[TwoFiftyShifter]

I hear you. My truck isn't the most comfortable thing to bounce around in. It spins 3,000 rpm at the interstate speed limit. It gets 12-14mpg. You have to press the brake pedal fairly hard to stop without power assist and the manual steering needs no explanation.

That said, I don't plan on an OD tranny. I'm fine with the gas mileage. I don't mind that it rattles and that the steering is a bit loose on a straight road. I just enjoy rolling it down the road. I've got headers to listen to, or some period correct music like CCR and the like. It stands out and people ask questions about it. I have a late model with OD, AC power everything. There's more than.one tool for the job!

[Grumpy old man]

Keep chopping them up , hacking away at the frames,dropping them on the ground and changing the body lines to look ,run and drive like everything else running down the road . It's your truck modify anyway your heart desires , with the amount that have already been totaled, scrapped and rusted away it only makes the bone stock trucks more rare and appreciate faster .they're only stock once .

[72MARIO]

I would seriously consider adding a factory air system over a aftermarket. Aftermarket recirculutes the in cab air and does not have any fresh air intake options. Requiring fan speed at all times for heat on the cool spring and fall days. The defog position actually fills my suburban full of humidity before defogging the Interior

I Absolutely hate my old air products ac system

[HO455]

If I was in the market for AC for my Burban I would be waiting a lot more years to get one due to the new r123 refrigerant that is coming out now. New cars as of 2014 have started using it. Due to enviromental concerns it is going to replace the old freons (again were doing this) and in the interim you are buying into what may be a nightmare of hastily put together packages that may or may not work well. Plus the new stuff is super expensive to recharge at this point. The shop had to take a new Hellcat to the dealer to get it recharged and it was $650.
The set up for recovery and charging the new freon currently costs ten grand.

[LongBox]

Or, I could just drive the 1998 on hot days.

But then, I'd miss the tin dashboard, and all thumbs up I get from folks when I go for a drive.

Maybe it's time to install a "steering wheel spinner" aka a "suicide knob"?

[Andy4639]

This is why I have the 71 built my way. I drive it all the time. It drives as good as my 08 Tahoe does and it's just as comfortable too!

[Katrina/10]

If you can find a 1987 model truck, all those things will swap onto yours. It will most likely have power steering, power disc brakes, EFI, overdrive automatic trans, and so on. You don't have to cut the truck up to do this, and you can always put it back to original if you save the old parts.

[LongBox]

Originally Posted by Katrina/10

If you can find a 1987 model truck, all those things will swap onto yours. It will most likely have power steering, power disc brakes, EFI, overdrive automatic trans, and so on. You don't have to cut the truck up to do this, and you can always put it back to original if you save the old parts.

Thanks Gary, great idea. It's probably possible to find an 87 with decent mechanicals out there, and probably for not a lot of money.

Wonder just how much better the mileage would be with the OD trans and EFI?

[Katrina/10]

Well, the reason I mention it is because that's what I did with my 71. I got the truck with no drive train, and a friend had a 350 powered 87 he was parting out. So, I swapped it all into my truck, and have been very happy with it. The 87 cab and frame configuration is more similar to the 71 than the 88 and later models, so all the fuel lines fit easily. The drawback is the TBI 87 is a one year only combination, making them harder to find.

I get 13 mpg city driving, and 17 on the interstate with 3.73 gears. It also pulls a trailer pretty well.

[James the III]

Originally Posted by LongBox

Thanks Gary, great idea. It's probably possible to find an 87 with decent mechanicals out there, and probably for not a lot of money.

Wonder just how much better the mileage would be with the OD trans and EFI?

To give you an idea, the 80's trucks
350 v8 3 speed non o/d automatic got 1 mpg less than the same truck with the automatic with o/d.
both are q jet carbs

EFI is nice and all, but a TBI set up, (think carb with injectors in it)
are 700-2600 bucks..

multi port efi is 3000.oo and up..
when you get the parts injectors , fuel pump ..


Do you drive this truck enough to warrant that big dollar upgrade to efi?


is the 1 mpg difference adding o/d going to be worth it,

Might try tuning the carb and ign timing curve, as a basic 350 with a vac 2nd carb in these trucks should be getting 14-15mpg around town and 18-19 highway..
with 373 gears and 27-28" tall tires.

My 402 bbc el camino got 11mpg..