Differential ID ?

[68blackbird]

I've researched, all I think I know is that it is a Dana44. Do these pics help with ID or do I need to look some more? Thx, Kel

[dsraven]

check the cover in comparison to this chart in the link, or google differential cover id. a parts store or gasket supplier may be able to help with pictograms as well. pirate 4x4 also has a write up with pics i think. check their tech articles

http://www.quadratec.com/jeep_knowle.../article-5.htm

[68blackbird]

Originally Posted by dsraven

check the cover in comparison to this chart in the link, or google differential cover id. a parts store or gasket supplier may be able to help with pictograms as well. pirate 4x4 also has a write up with pics i think. check their tech articles

http://www.quadratec.com/jeep_knowle.../article-5.htm

Thanks, did that, that's how I ID'd it being a Dana44. I was looking for info such as ratio, date ect..thanks.

[dsraven]

ratio will be stamped on the gear set. it used to have a tag held on with a cover bolt, but that looks long gone. it would have said date, ratio, limited slip etc.

[68blackbird]

Another question...just pulled rear drums off, need to replace brake pads, not sure what to ask for at local parts store since I don't know what rear axle this came from?

[68blackbird]

Pulled cylinders out, traced part# to '63-64 Corvette.

[Russell Ashley]

Probably the same wheel cylinders as used on lots of cars and trucks, but that rear axle is definitely not from a 63-64 Vette. It has six lugs so I'm guessing it's from a Chevy truck.

[68blackbird]

Originally Posted by Russell Ashley

Probably the same wheel cylinders as used on lots of cars and trucks, but that rear axle is definitely not from a 63-64 Vette. It has six lugs so I'm guessing it's from a Chevy truck.

Damn, what an idiot....I did not catch that, thanks! I went and got parts, they look same, maybe I just got lucky....I need to slow down some and ay attention, sometimes I get hurry to finish one part to get to another...Kel

[67GMCkid]

What size are the shoes 11x2 ?

Did you check them over good some times you can find a # stamped into them.. If they are 11x2" take them with you to the local parts house and tell them they are GMC in the 65-69 era..

I would start by comparing them to, MONROE BX280, RAYBESTOS 280PG, or CENTRIC 11002800 these are all the same shoe just different #'s for the different companys..

The self adjusters could have been add at one point but if they are factory you rear is a 63 or newer.

Your picture shows the housing stamped 2 11 5 B which could very well be Feb 11th 65 Second shift

[68blackbird]

Originally Posted by 67GMCkid

What size are the shoes 11x2 ?

Did you check them over good some times you can find a # stamped into them.. If they are 11x2" take them with you to the local parts house and tell them they are GMC in the 65-69 era..

I would start by comparing them to, MONROE BX280, RAYBESTOS 280PG, or CENTRIC 11002800 these are all the same shoe just different #'s for the different companys..

The self adjusters could have been add at one point but if they are factory you rear is a 63 or newer.

Your picture shows the housing stamped 2 11 5 B which could very well be Feb 11th 65 Second shift

Many thanks, now things are starting to makes sense. 1st, these must be self adjusters, because when disassembled, I have 8 springs/side just like the ones pictured. These are for 1963 - 1964 Chevrolet Corvette

[68blackbird]

I guess another question, if my truck has 6 lugs, why does Corvette brake kit fit this?

[67GMCkid]

Instead of getting hung up on Corvette parts vs truck parts I would advise you hunt your parts from the truck pages of the parts catalogs... Yes the Corvette and even the lowly Corvair used an 11x 2 brake shoe on the rear in fact they used the set #228 that was only used on the fronts of most of the 1960's Chevy/GMC trucks.. So looking at Brake parts kits they are going to look the same in pictures. Springs for different applications may have different lengths and tensions..

[Henry50]

63 corvettes had independent rear suspension.

[68blackbird]

Originally Posted by 67GMCkid

Instead of getting hung up on Corvette parts vs truck parts I would advise you hunt your parts from the truck pages of the parts catalogs... Yes the Corvette and even the lowly Corvair used an 11x 2 brake shoe on the rear in fact they used the set #228 that was only used on the fronts of most of the 1960's Chevy/GMC trucks.. So looking at Brake parts kits they are going to look the same in pictures. Springs for different applications may have different lengths and tensions..

Understood, I guess I'm missing something because the purpose of my 1st post was to ID the axle so I knew what to ask for? As 65GMCkid stated, I now know the axle is a '65, when I searched for 65 GM truck brake parts, I never found anything that matched what I have. For some reason, the only kit I found that has the same number of springs (8) that I took off the drivers side, was the mentioned Corvette kit. Sorry for sounding like a putz...I can fix the brakes, I just don't know what to order? Kel

[1project2many]

the purpose of my 1st post was to ID the axle so I knew what to ask for?

It may be difficult to ID the exact application. GMC and Chevrolet trucks used a six lug axle. GMC axles were Dana 44 when Chevrolet used a Chevy designed axle. Self adjusters were not used until the '60s so a '50s application will not have all you need.

Sometimes you don't need the exact application, only a "right" one. Look at pictures, find hardware and show / drum size, and pick that application as the right one.

[67GMCkid]

Kel, your picture shows both a Hold down kit and a Self Adjuster kit as a Combined package, many specialty dealers will do this,, If you go to rock auto you will need to buy the Hold down kit Dorman HW7018 and the adjuster kits HW2508 Left and HW2509 RT

But again these are the kits for 65 GMC Dana 44 with 11x2 brakes (be sure to verify your brake shoe size)..

[68blackbird]

Originally Posted by 67GMCkid

Kel, your picture shows both a Hold down kit and a Self Adjuster kit as a Combined package, many specialty dealers will do this,, If you go to rock auto you will need to buy the Hold down kit Dorman HW7018 and the adjuster kits HW2508 Left and HW2509 RT

But again these are the kits for 65 GMC Dana 44 with 11x2 brakes (be sure to verify your brake shoe size)..

11x2 confirmed...parts store has them, ,many...many thx! Kel

[dsraven]

when you assemble,
-check the new parts against the old parts to ensure you get the right parts on the proper side of the truck. the star wheels probably have a left and a right hand thread. also ensure the star wheels have the same ratchet pattern so one isn't course and one fine. it makes adjustment easier if they are matched.
-clean backing plates. inspect for wear grooves where the shoes contact and rub, if good, smear a small dab of brake lube on each rub area.
-antisieze on threads of adjuster (unscrew and lube the whole thing).
-antisize on the rub area (backside of backing plate) where the pins goes through the backing plate as well as where they contact the shoes (those cup shaped things)
-antisieze on upper shoe contact point, the anchor pin area at the top
-ensure the parking brake cables and linkage is all free moving
-ensure the shoe/spring retaining part at the top anchor is all the way seated on it's pedestal
-when done ensure the brake shoe set can easily move around on the backing plate at the star wheel adjuster end. this will ensure you don't have a burr or a rough point anywhere that will cause problems down the road somewhere. it also ensures that the shoe retaining springs and clips are well seated and won't let go as well as all the shoe return springs.

I know you probably have been around the block with drum brakes, but just as a refresher for anybody reading who may not know or has forgotten. it is important to release the park brake adjustment to ensure you are adjusting the actual service brakes properly FIRST, then adjust the park brake after. before assembly of the brake parts, adjust the park brake to be really loose so the shoes will contact the upper anchor point on both shoes, both shoes. this sets the brake shoes all the way in at that end so you can assemble the brake springs easier and also adjust the other end (star wheels) to fit the shoes to the drums. slip the drums on and adjust the star wheels tight, then back them off the required amount to allow the drums to turn easily, same amount on both sides. this may require a long skinny screwdriver through the adjuster hole on the backing plate at the same time as adjusting to push the star wheel ratchet part away from the star wheel so the wheel can be turned backwards. count how many clicks so you can do both sides the same amount. now step on the brake pedal to ensure the shoes have centred themselves. recheck the ease of turning the drums to ensure all is good. when satisfied adjust the park brake. this will adjust the wheel cylinder end of the shoes out the required amount to allow proper park brake operation so when you step on the brake pedal it will take less pedal travel to get the brakes to operate. step on the brakes a few times and then recheck to ensure the brake drums still turn easily. when done, apply and release the brakes a few times while backing up to adjust the brake star wheels automatically. after some driving, allowing the brake shoes to "wear in" to fit the drum diameter, a few of these brake applications while backing up may be required to compensate for the initial break in wear of the new shoes.

so, to recap. bring the shoes all the way in at the top by adjusting the park brake to be super loose. then adjust the bottom, with the drums on, (star wheel) to bring the shoes out, then adjust the top to bring the shoes out by adjusting the park brake. make sense?
some fellas don't install or connect the park brakes, don't adjust them properly or don't bother to release them all the way when doing a brake star wheel adjustment. this can result in difficulty to install the brake drum with the new brake shoes in place, dragging brakes because of the thicker shoe linings-even though the star wheels are adjusted in all the way (new brakes), a low brake pedal or having to pump the pedal a bit to get good brakes (assuming there is no air in the system). just remember the park brake adjustment is what brings the shoes out to fit the drums at the top and the star wheel does this job at the bottom. adjusting only one of these will make the shoes wear funny as well, like only one end of the shoe is doing the work. a low pedal or having to pump the brakes is because the wheel cylinders have been pushed all the way back in (bad park brake adjustment or no park brake)and have to displace more fluid to get the shoes out against the drums (assuming the system is bled correctly).

[68blackbird]

Originally Posted by dsraven

when you assemble,
-check the new parts against the old parts to ensure you get the right parts on the proper side of the truck. the star wheels probably have a left and a right hand thread. also ensure the star wheels have the same ratchet pattern so one isn't course and one fine. it makes adjustment easier if they are matched.
-clean backing plates. inspect for wear grooves where the shoes contact and rub, if good, smear a small dab of brake lube on each rub area.
-antisieze on threads of adjuster (unscrew and lube the whole thing).
-antisize on the rub area (backside of backing plate) where the pins goes through the backing plate as well as where they contact the shoes (those cup shaped things)
-antisieze on upper shoe contact point, the anchor pin area at the top
-ensure the parking brake cables and linkage is all free moving
-ensure the shoe/spring retaining part at the top anchor is all the way seated on it's pedestal
-when done ensure the brake shoe set can easily move around on the backing plate at the star wheel adjuster end. this will ensure you don't have a burr or a rough point anywhere that will cause problems down the road somewhere. it also ensures that the shoe retaining springs and clips are well seated and won't let go as well as all the shoe return springs.

I know you probably have been around the block with drum brakes, but just as a refresher for anybody reading who may not know or has forgotten. it is important to release the park brake adjustment to ensure you are adjusting the actual service brakes properly FIRST, then adjust the park brake after. before assembly of the brake parts, adjust the park brake to be really loose so the shoes will contact the upper anchor point on both shoes, both shoes. this sets the brake shoes all the way in at that end so you can assemble the brake springs easier and also adjust the other end (star wheels) to fit the shoes to the drums. slip the drums on and adjust the star wheels tight, then back them off the required amount to allow the drums to turn easily, same amount on both sides. this may require a long skinny screwdriver through the adjuster hole on the backing plate at the same time as adjusting to push the star wheel ratchet part away from the star wheel so the wheel can be turned backwards. count how many clicks so you can do both sides the same amount. now step on the brake pedal to ensure the shoes have centred themselves. recheck the ease of turning the drums to ensure all is good. when satisfied adjust the park brake. this will adjust the wheel cylinder end of the shoes out the required amount to allow proper park brake operation so when you step on the brake pedal it will take less pedal travel to get the brakes to operate. step on the brakes a few times and then recheck to ensure the brake drums still turn easily. when done, apply and release the brakes a few times while backing up to adjust the brake star wheels automatically. after some driving, allowing the brake shoes to "wear in" to fit the drum diameter, a few of these brake applications while backing up may be required to compensate for the initial break in wear of the new shoes.

so, to recap. bring the shoes all the way in at the top by adjusting the park brake to be super loose. then adjust the bottom, with the drums on, (star wheel) to bring the shoes out, then adjust the top to bring the shoes out by adjusting the park brake. make sense?
some fellas don't install or connect the park brakes, don't adjust them properly or don't bother to release them all the way when doing a brake star wheel adjustment. this can result in difficulty to install the brake drum with the new brake shoes in place, dragging brakes because of the thicker shoe linings-even though the star wheels are adjusted in all the way (new brakes), a low brake pedal or having to pump the pedal a bit to get good brakes (assuming there is no air in the system). just remember the park brake adjustment is what brings the shoes out to fit the drums at the top and the star wheel does this job at the bottom. adjusting only one of these will make the shoes wear funny as well, like only one end of the shoe is doing the work. a low pedal or having to pump the brakes is because the wheel cylinders have been pushed all the way back in (bad park brake adjustment or no park brake)and have to displace more fluid to get the shoes out against the drums (assuming the system is bled correctly).

It has been sometime since I have done this, and have only done a few, great refresher.....this should be a "sticky"...well done, thanks, Kel

[roger55]

Looks a lot like the Dana 44 I have in my '57 pickup. It came out of a '65 GMC pickup.
Mine also has the 2260 with the large 9 after it.

If it's the same one as mine, all the brake parts are available for it except for the drums. I made drums for a Jeep Waggoneer work for it with just a little machine work.

I also had to modify the backing plates to accept the '57 stock E-brake cables.
I've got photos of all this if you need any. You can find all the details in my build thread.

I replaced everything except the axles and the yoke in mine when I did the rebuild. I went with a new set of 3.54 gears and a new Trac-Loc positraction unit. I got all my parts from Tom's Differentials out of Idaho. He knows his stuff.

[68blackbird]

Originally Posted by roger55

Looks a lot like the Dana 44 I have in my '57 pickup. It came out of a '65 GMC pickup.
Mine also has the 2260 with the large 9 after it.

If it's the same one as mine, all the brake parts are available for it except for the drums. I made drums for a Jeep Waggoneer work for it with just a little machine work.

I also had to modify the backing plates to accept the '57 stock E-brake cables.
I've got photos of all this if you need any. You can find all the details in my build thread.

I replaced everything except the axles and the yoke in mine when I did the rebuild. I went with a new set of 3.54 gears and a new Trac-Loc positraction unit. I got all my parts from Tom's Differentials out of Idaho. He knows his stuff.

Thanks for the reply...went through just a few pages of your build, very nice from I've seen so far , have it bookmarked for ltr review,Kel

[semn49]

Jeep pickup and Wagoneer/Cherokee full size had the Dana 44 with 6 lugs from late sixties until they quit building them I think? Maybe one of those??

[67GMCkid]

Has anyone ever set down and figured out what the difference is in a 64-66 vs the 67-69 GMC drums ? The 67 and later can be found about anywhere... they are also 11x2 and 6 lug...

[roger55]

Originally Posted by 67GMCkid

Has anyone ever set down and figured out what the difference is in a 64-66 vs the 67-69 GMC drums ? The 67 and later can be found about anywhere... they are also 11x2 and 6 lug...

Yes. The widths are different. The later ones fit on my 65 axle but the shoes overhang outside the drum a little. They will work but it's not an ideal fit.
The Waggoneer drums are a better way to go. The machine shop work is inexpensive. The axle flange circle needs to be enlarged. And, the lug holes need to be drilled out from 1/2" to 9/16" to fit over the shoulders of the lugs.
Details:
http://www.67-72chevytrucks.com/vboa...=Dana+44+drums