deadly alignment?

[fastlane]

I've got a 69 c10 2wd. I've had it aligned twice now, and it is undrivable at highway speeds. Both places want to blame the steering box (brand new redhead box [also a manual to p/s conversion]) I can see a bit of touchiness due to a possible to much pressure from the pump situation. but from one exit to the next I was fearful of my life and those around me. every bump I hit I was recovering for 2-300 yards. Also with NO input from the steering wheel it would dart slightly within the lane. this thing is scary! All steering components are new (tie rods, ball joints, control arm bushings, etc.) Please help.

[toolboxchev]

Something is amiss here, mine is in the same driving condition as yours. No new components. 300,000 mile truck. I see no mention of idler arm and pitman shaft.

[LongBox]

I would say that you need to find someone who is an expert in these trucks, fairly close to you, invite him to look over your truck, and offer him a beer (or two).

[67ChevyRedneck]

Something is way wrong. I can fly over a speed bump in my truck with two fingers on the wheel.

Did you ever drive the truck before the PS conversion?

[weq92f]

Definitely something is not right. If it's not the box then you've got some situation allowing slop or introducing this flakiness you experience. Double check that all the parts are correct, in good shape and installed properly. Move out from there and make sure the spindles/bearings are good and the wheels are straight/true.

Often issues can be found by just jerking around on stuff while the suspension is not loaded. The wheels should have no play if everything is attached and working properly. If they wobble up/down or left/right, you know it's something right there; ball joints, tie rods respectively or bushings, bearings...

Hth,

-klb

[weq92f]

Originally Posted by 67ChevyRedneck

Something is way wrong. I can fly over a speed bump in my truck with two fingers on the wheel.

[Boog]

I've read where some guys had the center link on backwards and it caused weird driving feel.

[35boulder]

My truck was kinda doing the same thing and we flipped the center link and things got much better. I agree w the statement ABOVE!

[saxart]

Can we get some more info on your suspension set up? If it's the truck in your avatar, it looks to be lowered. If so, who did the work, and how is it set up?

Also....

[Orange67]

If you replaced your LCA cross shafts, I have read where some suppliers are drilling the locating pin hole in the wrong spot, which would cause undetectable alignment issues. I had mine aligned three time by two shops, no joy. I have a similar issue, but not to the extreme yours is. Mine is VERY twitchy on the freeway. I have a set of good original '71 GM cross shafts I'm going to replace the aftermarket ones with and see if it fixes it. I will try to report back when I get it done.

[B. W.]

What are your alignment #s? You should have been given a read out from the alignment shop. Also, if you want to eliminate the power steering from the equation remove the P/S belt & drive it. When you get an alignment don't use box stores, find a dedicated alignment shop & ask for the tech with gray (white) hair! He will have experience the young pups don't. Just my 2 cents & yes, I have gray hair!

[hilltop55]

Post a picture of your centerlink with the tie rod ends so we can see if its on the correct way.

[fastlane]

Thanks all for the input. I have replaced ALL steering components, pitman arm and idler arm included. I did lower it 2 1/2" with spindles so the suspension geometry should be the same. I used moog parts, not certain the LCA cross shafts are moog or not but they are new. I did all the work, but I've been working on cars with my dad since I was about my sons age (5!) so about 29 years. Not saying I know everything! or else we wouldn't need forums like this!

As far as pictures go I will have to get out there soon and take some. What would be helpful?

As far as the alignment, I went to a guy who has 6 classics in his back shop including a '50 chevy truck.

[randy500]

Sounds like your toe out, go out and measure it, measure highest you can get on the rear and then same height on the front, see what the toe setting is. Use some part of the tread that you can repeat front and rear for the measurement, it wont be exact but it you will get a result that is relevant. The post back your findings.

[randy500]

Try this too, if you think its the pump, which it is possible but not likely, take off the power steering belt and do the same drive, check your results. If the results are the same its not the pump pressure.

[randy500]

I will add this too, the way the steering gear accepts power assist from the pump is via the spool valve which is connected to the steering input shaft.
Steering input from the wheel flexes a torsion shaft, the flex of the torsion shaft allows fluid to enter the ends of the piston acting on the sector shaft causing power assist.
When you let up on the steering wheel input, the assist stops, when you torque the torsion bar the opposite direction pressure is applied to the opposite side piston and it acts on the sector shaft providing power assist in the direction now turning.

So in essence the steering wheel input opens a valve giving assist in the direction of input, it would be rare that you had too much pressure and therefore to much assist because it gives pressure assist upon steering wheel input.
Something with the steering gear or pump would have to be grossly wrong to make this a problem.

[davepl]

Here's my guess:

Lower control arms swapped side to side. That wrecks your caster angle and the thing will want to change lanes at the slightest opportunity.

Center-link can cause a problem too, but I'm thinking specifically of the caster. You'd think, however, the alignment shop would have told you they couldn't get it in spec if that was the case.

[randy500]

Originally Posted by davepl

Here's my guess:

Lower control arms swapped side to side. That wrecks your caster angle and the thing will want to change lanes at the slightest opportunity.

Center-link can cause a problem too, but I'm thinking specifically of the caster. You'd think, however, the alignment shop would have told you they couldn't get it in spec if that was the case.

Control arms swap is not possible unless no shocks are used.

Center link isn't the problem either, how do you even do that, it would be completely obvious it was not installed correctly.

Post a couple pics of the control arms and the steering parts

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

It will be interesting to hear the results of this. My first thought is a bad box, but I'm a novice. Hopefully your alignment folks aren't the same.

[1972RedNeck]

Even if it has a sloppy box, it should want to drive itself down the road in a straight line.

[CG]

Ive had weird steering problems a few times. One I just messed up and didn't have the box tightened. Seems simple, but when I bolted it on I didn't torque it down. Looked fine eyeballing it and it was tight enough that it wouldn't wiggle by hand.

Had a crack in the frame once where it bolts on. And lastly I had a bad rag joint.

That's all I have lol. I have had three boxes done by red hat. That company has a super good rep. Not saying it couldn't be a box, but doubtful.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Originally Posted by 1972RedNeck

Even if it has a sloppy box, it should want to drive itself down the road in a straight line.

Good point.

[dflarsen77]

Here are two threads about guys with their centerlink installed backwards.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=400205

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=629495

I dunno if it's the same symptoms you're describing, but if you did the work yourself, it's really easy to put it in backwards, because it still seems like it fits. Just take a look under your front end, and if the tie rods attach to the front of the center link, then it's backwards.

[Ironangel]

When I installed my 2-1/2" drop spindles I had to readjust the toe in...There are "slight" geometry changes that take place when drop spindles are used. You need center your steering wheel up and then jack one tire up at a time to scribe a line near the center of the tread pattern. Once you have a line on each tire measure across the front of the tires and measure across the rear of the tires. The front should be about an 1/8" narrower than the rear. All this should be done with the steering wheel centered, both wheels straight ahead...You'll probably find one wheel or the other is tracking in or out which is why you want to center the steering wheel first, then set each tire to track straight ahead, then fine tune it with toe in measurements...I drive two 72 C/10's and have completely rebuilt both front ends and have never had to take a truck to an alignment shop. Always keep track of the shims on the upper control arms and make sure they go right back the way they came out. Make sure you dont get the inner and outer tie rod ends mixed up, easy to do and that's the only way you can get a center link in backwards.

[James the III]

Are the tires on it NOW the same as was before the parts replacement..
As the wear of the tires with the worn parts could be why you are having issues..

As for no steer wheel input is the rag joint loose or trash