454 starter/flywheel ?? - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

Jason5571 · 10-25-2003, 12:15 AM

Hey yall! I have a question for you gurus. I have purchased a 71 longbed and it was fitted with a 454. I don't know how to tell the difference between the trannys. I know modulator valve is located on the side or back to indicate which is which but I don't think that is an issue. Anyway my problem is I bought the truck as is and the guy has put three starters and flywheels on it. They all grind and eat the teeth off the flywheel he "has shimmed the starter every which way it can be shimmed". He did not know what the 454 came out of either for all I know it could be a 396. I can't find the casting #'s on the side of the block to tell me what year it is so I was wondering if they made them the same up to a certain year or did they have alot of change overs? Without the casting #'s I am kinda pissin' in the wind if I just keep throwing parts at it like he did. Any info to head me in a good starting point would be great. I did grind the crap out of it and got it started and that 454 runs soooooooo strong. I don't know why I have stayed with the sb so long. ( other than parts availability reliable it's a chevy etc.)
Thanks alot I have not been on the board in about 8 months because I sold my 69 3 door sub and forgot my old user name. I know I have been rambling but It's 11:16 at night and my house is asleep. Thanks again Jason

crazy longhorn · 10-25-2003, 12:35 AM

There are 2 options on the starter/flexplate. The 14" diam, 168 tooth flexplte/flywheel takes a staggered pattern on the starter. The smaller12 3/4 " 153 tooth takes a straight across pattern. As far as shimming, you need to slip a 1/8 " rod tween the armature shaft & th OD of the flexplate(not loose, but not tight). if its too tight, you need to use shims under both bolts......too loose, you need to cut the shims in half, & use them under the OUTSIDE bolt only, untill you get the proper clearance. it is not uncommon to see 3 or 4 shims under the outer bolt to get the starter "talking right". after a couple times, you will be able to hear an out of spec starter a block away.......& know what you need to do to straighten it up

. Good luck,crazyL

junkyardjohn · 10-25-2003, 12:36 AM

I GUESS THE FIRST THING TO FIND OUT IS WHAT THE DISPLACEMENT (OR SIZE) & YEAR OF MANUFACTURE THE ENGINE IS. THE FLYWHEEL OR FLEXPLATE IS NOT INTERCHANGABLE BETWEEN A 396 & A 454 AS ONE (396) IS INTERNALLY BALANCED, & THE 454 IS EXTERNALLY BALANCED.
THE DATE CODE, & THE PART # OF THE BLOCK WILL BE ON THE BELLHOUSING BOSS. GO TO MORTEC.COM &THEY WILL TELL YOU WHAT THE BLOCK DISPLACEMENT WAS ORIGINALLY. JOHN

crazy longhorn · 10-25-2003, 12:53 AM

That is a very good point John

internal or external balance.....all of the sb's from 262-350 are internal balance......the BB's from 366-427 are internal balance, & the flexplates or flywheels will swap. The 400 sb, & the 454 BB are external on balance(both different plates), & will have a chunk of weight welded to the flex plate at 1 spot (very noticeable).If somebody has crossed these pcs, you will have a very noticeable engine vibe.I do agree with John , that the best way to run the mess down is by eng numbers! good luck,crazyL

Jason5571 · 10-25-2003, 05:52 PM

Thanks alot. I have the flywheel out and it has the weight on it. It is also a 168 tooth flywheel as well as all the others that he has chewed up. Also all of the starters have straight teeth on them they are not angled. I really don't know why but I think someone has ground the numbers off. It looks like it used to have numbers under the right head but that surface is ground smooth and the same goes for the back on the hump. Thanks a bunch for your input. Jason

10-25-2003, 12:15 AM	#1
Jason5571 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lubbock Texas Posts: 2	454 starter/flywheel ?? Hey yall! I have a question for you gurus. I have purchased a 71 longbed and it was fitted with a 454. I don't know how to tell the difference between the trannys. I know modulator valve is located on the side or back to indicate which is which but I don't think that is an issue. Anyway my problem is I bought the truck as is and the guy has put three starters and flywheels on it. They all grind and eat the teeth off the flywheel he "has shimmed the starter every which way it can be shimmed". He did not know what the 454 came out of either for all I know it could be a 396. I can't find the casting #'s on the side of the block to tell me what year it is so I was wondering if they made them the same up to a certain year or did they have alot of change overs? Without the casting #'s I am kinda pissin' in the wind if I just keep throwing parts at it like he did. Any info to head me in a good starting point would be great. I did grind the crap out of it and got it started and that 454 runs soooooooo strong. I don't know why I have stayed with the sb so long. ( other than parts availability reliable it's a chevy etc.) Thanks alot I have not been on the board in about 8 months because I sold my 69 3 door sub and forgot my old user name. I know I have been rambling but It's 11:16 at night and my house is asleep. Thanks again Jason

10-25-2003, 12:35 AM	#2
crazy longhorn Fabricate till you "puke" Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ill Posts: 9,402	There are 2 options on the starter/flexplate. The 14" diam, 168 tooth flexplte/flywheel takes a staggered pattern on the starter. The smaller12 3/4 " 153 tooth takes a straight across pattern. As far as shimming, you need to slip a 1/8 " rod tween the armature shaft & th OD of the flexplate(not loose, but not tight). if its too tight, you need to use shims under both bolts......too loose, you need to cut the shims in half, & use them under the OUTSIDE bolt only, untill you get the proper clearance. it is not uncommon to see 3 or 4 shims under the outer bolt to get the starter "talking right". after a couple times, you will be able to hear an out of spec starter a block away.......& know what you need to do to straighten it up . Good luck,crazyL __________________ 69 longhorn,4" chop,3/5 drop, 1/2 ton suspension/disc brakes,1 1/2" body drop,steel tilt clip, 5.3/Edelbrock rpm intake/600 carb, Hooker streetrod shorties,2 1/2" exhaust/ H pipe/50's Flows , 6 spd Richmond trans,12 bolt/ 3.40 gears....

10-25-2003, 12:36 AM	#3
junkyardjohn Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: SOMERSET KY. Posts: 6,425	I GUESS THE FIRST THING TO FIND OUT IS WHAT THE DISPLACEMENT (OR SIZE) & YEAR OF MANUFACTURE THE ENGINE IS. THE FLYWHEEL OR FLEXPLATE IS NOT INTERCHANGABLE BETWEEN A 396 & A 454 AS ONE (396) IS INTERNALLY BALANCED, & THE 454 IS EXTERNALLY BALANCED. THE DATE CODE, & THE PART # OF THE BLOCK WILL BE ON THE BELLHOUSING BOSS. GO TO MORTEC.COM &THEY WILL TELL YOU WHAT THE BLOCK DISPLACEMENT WAS ORIGINALLY. JOHN __________________ junkyardjohn 69 1 TON TOW TRUCK // 84 4WD CUCV BLAZER// 85 1 TON 4WD STAKE TRUCK// 86 M1031 5/4 TON 4WD CUCV// ALOT OF OLD TRUCKS FOR ONE OLD MAN TO DRIVE. THERES ROOM FOR ALL OF GODS CREATURES RIGHT NEXT TO MY MASHED POTATOES// LIFE MEMBER OF P.E.T.A (PEOPLE EATING TASTY ANIMALS) DON'T RENT U-HAUL ALWAYS TELL THE TRUTH IT WILL AMAZE PART OF THE PEOPLE & ASTONISH THE REST

10-25-2003, 12:53 AM	#4
crazy longhorn Fabricate till you "puke" Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ill Posts: 9,402	That is a very good point John internal or external balance.....all of the sb's from 262-350 are internal balance......the BB's from 366-427 are internal balance, & the flexplates or flywheels will swap. The 400 sb, & the 454 BB are external on balance(both different plates), & will have a chunk of weight welded to the flex plate at 1 spot (very noticeable).If somebody has crossed these pcs, you will have a very noticeable engine vibe.I do agree with John , that the best way to run the mess down is by eng numbers! good luck,crazyL __________________ 69 longhorn,4" chop,3/5 drop, 1/2 ton suspension/disc brakes,1 1/2" body drop,steel tilt clip, 5.3/Edelbrock rpm intake/600 carb, Hooker streetrod shorties,2 1/2" exhaust/ H pipe/50's Flows , 6 spd Richmond trans,12 bolt/ 3.40 gears....

10-25-2003, 05:52 PM	#5
Jason5571 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lubbock Texas Posts: 2	Thanks alot. I have the flywheel out and it has the weight on it. It is also a 168 tooth flywheel as well as all the others that he has chewed up. Also all of the starters have straight teeth on them they are not angled. I really don't know why but I think someone has ground the numbers off. It looks like it used to have numbers under the right head but that surface is ground smooth and the same goes for the back on the hump. Thanks a bunch for your input. Jason



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