Rear axle flange removal?

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Novice here, doing a ground up on a 71 C-10 2WD, 402/400 with rear leaf springs. I prefer not cut corners unless it's prudent to do so. For what it's worth, the truck has 140K miles, and has lived most of its life in the garage under dry conditions. It's likely the axle has never been touched, less fluids in the differential.

I'm not sure I should even go here, but it would nice to pull the axle plate to finish it. For that matter, to finish the axle flange as a unit as well. That said, if it's not worth the hassle, perhaps I should work with this stuff assembled.

Anyway, I'm hoping to get some idea what I'm looking at and what's involved. This image should help explain the parts I'm referring to. Thank you.

[57taskforce]

The axle flange as you call it is the outer portion of the Axle shaft, the whole shaft will have to come out to remove it. Pull the cover, Remove the cross shaft lock bolt, the cross shaft, then push the axle shaft in by pushing on the flange and remove the c clip that holds the spider gear on the axle shaft. Pull the axle shaft out of the tube. As for the backing plate, it's just four bolts holding it to the axle housing once the brake line and e brake cable is removed. As for if it's worth it to pull and detail... well it's your truck and you know the level your building it too. my truck is a driver that gets used as a truck... I wouldn't worry about it but if it were a high end build I would take the time to do it up nice... I would however replace the bearing and seal on each axle shaft as well as new brakes regardless of build quality.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Originally Posted by 57taskforce

The axle flange as you call it is the outer portion of the Axle shaft, the whole shaft will have to come out to remove it. Pull the cover, Remove the cross shaft lock bolt, the cross shaft, then push the axle shaft in by pushing on the flange and remove the c clip that holds the spider gear on the axle shaft. Pull the axle shaft out of the tube. As for the backing plate, it's just four bolts holding it to the axle housing once the brake line and e brake cable is removed. As for if it's worth it to pull and detail... well it's your truck and you know the level your building it too. my truck is a driver that gets used as a truck... I wouldn't worry about it but if it were a high end build I would take the time to do it up nice... I would however replace the bearing and seal on each axle shaft as well as new brakes regardless of build quality.

Agree, backing plate is straight forward. I'm lost on the balance, beginning from cover......... ha!. The differential cover, I suppose. I'll definitely hit the bearings and seals.

My rear brakes are real good. Outside a new spring kit I'm just refinishing the balance, and the shoes don't even need that. I'll finish up the adjusters tomorrow, but I cleaned these up over the last few days. Seems the cylinders are OEM, but by the condition I'd think they're replacements. The rubber looks great and no issues The only sign of pitting is on the pins....................The balance forward the rear brakes is a different story. All new stuff - because it's a money pit

If it's relatively simple, I'd like to pull the shafts. The bonus would be the balance of the axle is easier to handle. Thanks for the info. At least I have an idea what to look for.

Seems like a good video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zwYojw6cuU

[Jcfcamaro]

It would be a good time to put a new axle seal in too and also inspect the bearing. Very easy to change them and really cheap. Definitely change the seal.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Looks like it's a bad deal should those internal gears come out of place. Let me ask, if I pull the drive line first, I suppose that ring gear will rotate freely. However, am I asking for trouble if the drive shaft is pulled before the axle shafts?

[57taskforce]

No it won't hurt anything. You don't have to pull the pinion loose or the carrier all you have to do is take the center shaft out of the carrier to remove the c clips and axles.
This should help:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4zwYojw6cuU

[Wrenchbender Ret]

If the spider gears roll out of place it's no big deal. You can put them back in. The only thing you have to cross you fingers for is the lock bolt not broken. Sometimes the lock bolt is broke & part of it stays in. If that happens say a few choice words & post the question on here as how to remove it. If it comes out complete rejoice & dig in & complete the job.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Originally Posted by 57taskforce

No it won't hurt anything. You don't have to pull the pinion loose or the carrier all you have to do is take the center shaft out of the carrier to remove the c clips and axles.
This should help:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4zwYojw6cuU

I saw that video, thank you. This is a full take-off, so unless I'm missing something, the pinion and carrier come off anyway. Let me ask, is it advised I do not remove the pinion & carrier before removing the axle shafts?

Currently looking for a workable diagram of the drive shaft, so as to more better edgecated.

[57taskforce]

The pinion and carrier won't come out until the axle shafts are removed.

[Steeveedee]

Originally Posted by Wrenchbender Ret

If the spider gears roll out of place it's no big deal. You can put them back in. The only thing you have to cross you fingers for is the lock bolt not broken. Sometimes the lock bolt is broke & part of it stays in. If that happens say a few choice words & post the question on here as how to remove it. If it comes out complete rejoice & dig in & complete the job.

Except that it's a blue steel biyatch to rotate the gears to get the spider gears lined up, laying on your back on that puddle of gear oil, which will take a whole bottle of shampoo to get the smell out.

Personally, I'd just wire brush 'em, spray purple power to get the grease off, and paint in place. You get into the bearings and seals at your own risk, if they aren't leaking!

[Al1957]

Agree, if not leaking, paint them in place. It can be a real can of worms.

[nightrider388]

Originally Posted by Al1957

Agree, if not leaking, paint them in place. It can be a real can of worms.

Also, Most axles this age have a pretty significant groove from the seal. Sometimes can be a problem with a new seal, being leak free.

[GASoline71]

It's not as hard as it seems to pull then axles out of a C-clip rear end. Just messy as you have to pull the pan off to drain all the gear oil. But this will allow you to change the old nasty fluid out as well.

Gary

[roboticjunky]

Before you decide to take the differential cover off, make sure you can get the plug(where you fill it up at) out first. It's on the passenger side next to the pinion yoke.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Originally Posted by 57taskforce

The pinion and carrier won't come out until the axle shafts are removed.

Did some research so I can speak nearly educated about my confusion. I don't understand why that's true. Perhaps that's the better order of things, because I'm pulling everything off anyway?

From what I can tell, any corrections welcome, you can just unbolt the retainers at the axle yoke, unbolt the carrier bearing support, push/pry the shafts forward from the rear, and the shafts are ready to pull off.

I see it's a good idea to mark the yokes. For me that means scribes, because it's a "restoration".

Originally Posted by Steeveedee

Except that it's a blue steel biyatch to rotate the gears to get the spider gears lined up, laying on your back on that puddle of gear oil, which will take a whole bottle of shampoo to get the smell out.

Personally, I'd just wire brush 'em, spray purple power to get the grease off, and paint in place. You get into the bearings and seals at your own risk, if they aren't leaking!

I get your meaning. The nice thing about a restoration is there are no puddles, and there's nothing else on the frame but suspension, engine & transmission. Seems if you reinstall the pin it holds the gears in place? That said, I don't know what to expect if the axle yoke is pulled.

Originally Posted by Al1957

Agree, if not leaking, paint them in place. It can be a real can of worms.

Yikes. Now I'm thinking paint in place. Hmmmmmm.

Originally Posted by nightrider388

Also, Most axles this age have a pretty significant groove from the seal. Sometimes can be a problem with a new seal, being leak free.

Double yikes.

[57taskforce]

Originally Posted by 71CHEVYSHORTBED402

Did some research so I can speak nearly educated about my confusion. I don't understand why that's true. Perhaps that's the better order of things, because I'm pulling everything off anyway

It sounds like your talking about the drive shaft??? I'm kinda confused. I'm referring to the spider gear carrier inside the axle housing not the carrier bearing on the drive shaft.

I read it as you were trying to get the pinion gear out of the rear end housing. Sorry if I miss understood.

To get the drive shaft off, yes unbolt the drive shaft from the yoke, drop the carrier and move the drive shaft out of the way. Honestly you might not even have to unbolt the carrier, the slip joint may have enough travel to let it separate at the yoke.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Originally Posted by 57taskforce

It sounds like your talking about the drive shaft??? I'm kinda confused. I'm referring to the spider gear carrier inside the axle housing not the carrier bearing on the drive shaft.

I read it as you were trying to get the pinion gear out of the rear end housing. Sorry if I miss understood.

To get the drive shaft off, yes unbolt the drive shaft from the yoke, drop the carrier and move the drive shaft out of the way. Honestly you might not even have to unbolt the carrier, the slip joint may have enough travel to let it separate at the yoke.

Yes, I ended up at the driveshaft , sorry for the confusion. Unless I run with plan B (whatever that is), I'll pull the pinion gear after the driveshaft is pulled.

[my67c20]

71CHEVYSHORTBED402, do not take offense to this question. According to your profile you have almost 3000 posts and you are asking a question that is something i would expect from someone that drives a Honda civic? How is that? Typically when i look at questions posted by others, or even responses, I weight the responses by number of posts, kinda like a review to understand if this person is the one i should trust or not. Again not calling you out, just curious. Maybe your number of posts has been hacked by the Russians.

[Wrenchbender Ret]

We are mixing up the names of these parts & causing confusion. Get a book or parts picture from a catalog & study the names of the parts. The pinion That goes in font behind the driveshaft yoke is not the same as the pinion gears in the carrier or the pinion shaft that retains them. If you can do a ground up restoration you should be able to remove those axles without any hastle.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Originally Posted by my67c20

71CHEVYSHORTBED402, do not take offense to this question. According to your profile you have almost 3000 posts and you are asking a question that is something i would expect from someone that drives a Honda civic? How is that? Typically when i look at questions posted by others, or even responses, I weight the responses by number of posts, kinda like a review to understand if this person is the one i should trust or not. Again not calling you out, just curious. Maybe your number of posts has been hacked by the Russians.

Well, I've never torn down a Chevy before. Or a Honda, for that matter. Honestly, until this project I hadn't even replaced brakes. Wasn't raised around this stuff, but I like it.

It's important to me to pull things in the right order, without screwing something up. Pulling the shaft before the axles seems to make sense, but I can see how it probably doesn't matter. That said, I'm not 100% sold on pulling the axles. The entire driveshaft is another story, because I'm pulling the rear leaf springs, engine & trans.

Originally Posted by Wrenchbender Ret

We are mixing up the names of these parts & causing confusion. Get a book or parts picture from a catalog & study the names of the parts. The pinion That goes in font behind the driveshaft yoke is not the same as the pinion gears in the carrier or the pinion shaft that retains them. If you can do a ground up restoration you should be able to remove those axles without any hastle.

Gave that a shot, noted by this thread. http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=745603

Have to say you lost me on drive shaft yoke & really, the carrier. It's my understanding the carrier, or carrier bearing is another term for center support bearing. Sounds like you and others are referring to the "pumpkin" as the carrier, so yeah, a little confusing.

I tend to make mountains of molehills until once done, and then I realize how easy it really is. Good to know the axles are easy.

[Wrenchbender Ret]

The carrier is the housing that the ring gear attaches to & houses the spider gears & side gears. There i threw another term at you. The "spider" gears are the small gears that roll around in the carrier with the side gears that the ends of the axle shafts go into. They are often called pinion gears but spider gears will help avoid confusion.Don't remove the carrier assembly. Work through the opening in it. There is a pin with a slotted screw or hex head. remove it. Then slide the shaft out. You can leave it in place enough to keep the spider gear from moveing. Remove the block from the middle. (later models don't have the block.) Then push the axles in & remove the C washers. Then pull out the axles.

[57taskforce]

Have you pulled the differential cover off??? None of this will make sense to someone who's never been inside the cover before. the yoke Ret is referring to is the axle yoke #10 in the thread you linked. Again the carrier we are referring to has absolutely nothing to do with the drive shaft.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Originally Posted by Wrenchbender Ret

The carrier is the housing that the ring gear attaches to & houses the spider gears & side gears. There i threw another term at you. The "spider" gears are the small gears that roll around in the carrier with the side gears that the ends of the axle shafts go into. They are often called pinion gears but spider gears will help avoid confusion.Don't remove the carrier assembly. Work through the opening in it. There is a pin with a slotted screw or hex head. remove it. Then slide the shaft out. You can leave it in place enough to keep the spider gear from moveing. Remove the block from the middle. (later models don't have the block.) Then push the axles in & remove the C washers. Then pull out the axles.

I see. So the "carrier" is the A.K.A. pumpkin A.K.A. differential. The carrier bearing A.K.A. center support bearing isn't part of the carrier (ha!). I have to drain the carrier yet. I'll have a clearer understanding how it operates when I do. Thank you.

[71CHEVYSHORTBED402]

Yep, I make mountains of molehills. Took about 3 minutes to pull the axle shafts. My biggest fear was the gears coming out of place. I reinstalled the pin. The pin bolt came off easily. Now understand what a "carrier" is, or rather "the carrier housing".

I took the driveshaft off first leaving just the pinion. Not knowing the impact on the gears by removing the pinion, I think I'll leave it in tact, and just restore around it.

My only question is, and I've always wondered, is this a limited slip axle? How can you tell?


BTW, thanks for walking me through this.

[towbar]

Hey Tony, kudos to you for tackling a full on restoration, and admitting you had never changed brakes before. Some of us guys take for granted mechanical or electrical knowledge of a vehicle or.....whatever your interests may be?? The knowledge and willingness to share is what makes this a great site, and it open to anyone who asks, no matter the skill level.

So you rear is what is called an open differential, meaning that only one wheel pulls at a given time. Limited slip GM diffs typically have a clutch pack oriented in the side of the carrier, and a small set of springs visible in the carrier window. Some versions from different years or makes vary in appearance. All open diffs that I have seen are virtually identical and look like yours