Help with stance/suspension

[nickvig]

You guys might remember this from a while ago, but I'm finally to the point where I'm thinking about what I want to do for raising/lowering my truck.

What I would like is a usable stance that's not too low or too high. I've never been a fan of a totally stock truck but I lowered my '98 RCSB 5/7 with Belltech components and it was too low for me.

So...here's where I started:

3" cut front coils; 2" drop shackles in the rear. In this setup the truck bottomed out over every bump I hit. I had about 2" of clearance between the bump stop and the a-arm in the front.

IMG_20160430_122806 by nickvig, on Flickr

I proceeded to replace the front coils with some Delco OEM replacements from Rock Auto. It cured my front clearance problem and the truck rides pretty good. I drove the truck like this for about a year:

IMG_20160613_163550 by nickvig, on Flickr

About four months ago I finally got around to replacing the rear drop shackles with some OEM replacement ones. Now the truck looks like this:

IMG_20170408_075821 by nickvig, on Flickr

And here's a pic of where they had to cut a channel in the bed support for the drop shackle and the four leaf pack springs:

IMG_20170408_075839 by nickvig, on Flickr

So at a level surface I'm about 2" higher in the front than the rear. So here are my two questions...

My truck has RPO code G51 - Heavy Duty rear springs. I'm thinking that one of the previous owners pulled a couple of leafs out of the leaf pack. The leafs currently only have four leafs in total. I'm thinking it should have six or eight. The truck rides pretty good right now so here's my dilemna:

Do I look at replacing the rear leafs with a standard leaf pack to raise the back up 2" to stock. If the G51 RPO is actually a 4-leaf pack they're probably correct and just worn out which would cause it to be low in the rear. So it's kind of a happy accident.

or....

Do I get some 2" drop spindles that won't affect my ride quality to lower the front down a bit.

if I go with option 2 does anyone make 2" spindles? I'm only finding 2.5" drop spindles for these trucks. I called CPP yesterday and sat on hold for 10 minutes before they came back on the phone to tell me they were busy. It looks like the Western Chassis, Belltech, and DJM are all 2.5" drop. I'd like to just go 2" if I can.

I appreciate all your help and expertise!

[mongocanfly]

spindles would be best but you could also cut one coil off the spring..that usually gets 2" of drop..but a 2 1/2" spindle wouldn't look bad...

[JohnJ@RideTech]

For some reason I cannot get the pictures to show up on my computer.
Is the truck noticeably higher in the front than the rear?

[Jstock85]

Im not seeing you pics either...

[nickvig]

Okay...got the pics up and working. Google photos wasn't playing nice.

The third suggestion I had was to get some air shocks and air up the back 2-2.5" in order to give the truck a more level stance. I don't think this would cause an issue but I think the truck might look nicer just lower in the front.

I was hoping Keith S. or anyone else could chime in and let me know if those rear leafs look like they've been messed with or what the correct rear leaf pack is on the G51 RPO. It's hard to tell, anything that was done even a few years ago starts to look stock as it ages.

[Malo83]

That rear spring eye has been heated and bent down to give you you some drop on the leaf spring, Not Good! 2" drop spindles and 2" lowering springs should give you a 4" drop in the front and a flip kit on the rear will give you a 5-6" drop, this is my 83 with 4/5" drop, no bottoming out

[sweetk30]

Originally Posted by Malo83

That rear spring eye has been heated and bent down to give you you some drop on the leaf spring, Not Good! 2" drop spindles and 2" lowering springs should give you a 4" drop in the front and a flip kit on the rear will give you a 5-6" drop, this is my 83 with 4/5" drop, no bottoming out

not always . if non stock springs the aftermarket could have just wrapped them different than stock .

i did a 1" longer shackle on stock 3 leaf rear on my short bed and had to notch the cross member for the short bed .

i used a section of exhaust pipe cut in half for a rolled radius to fill in the cut out section and look factoryish .

mine with 2.5 drop spindle front and 2.5 rear via 2" up front hanger and 1" longer shackle for the .5" extra . on roller tires now 31x10.50x15

few spring eye charts also

[nickvig]

Thanks for the pics and suggestions. I guess I'm after two things:

1. What's the correct leaf springs for a truck with RPO code G51?

As I understand it the heavy duty rear spring option (G51) has a mount that is located higher on the frame which is the reason the bed support has to be cut to clear the leaf if the truck is lowered. So if my rear leaf springs are stock then they're probably wasted and need to be replaced. Or they've been pressed and flattened to make the truck lower.

2. If the correct leaf springs for G51 are a six or eight leaf pack can I replace those with a correct four leaf pack so the truck will sit in a similar position to where it does now?

I like where the back sits but it seems like the springs need to be replaced. Problem is I don't want it jacked to the ceiling after. My wife has a tough enough time getting in the truck at the height it is right now.

[sweetk30]

short beds the crossmember is just in the wrong place for all us guys to lower them bolt in easy . . .. just have to notch it is all . why some guys dont say they did or show they did i dont know.

as to springs 3 or 4 leaf is std style packs for the most part in 2wd trucks i have seen . and some 4wd got 5 maybe a 6 leaf . but i am not up on rpo code break downs as to leaf count in a pack .

[54Caddy]

Problem is you have brand new coils in front with some old leafs in rear. I’d call up Early Classics and order a set of 2in or there 1.5in front drop coils to solve that issue. Along with some new shocks due to shorter coils. I wouldn’t bother with rear if the wife is already having a tough time to get in now.

[LT7A]

Hey nickvig, I can't follow all of the ups and downs based on the advice so far so I will summarize and let me know if I am wrong.

- You corrected your truck with uncut front springs and non-lowering rear shackles
- Now the front sits higher (ish) than the back
- The wife doesn't want it any taller
- You want to lower the front 2 inches without sacrificing ride quality
- You can't find 2 inch dropped spindles so you may lower it 2.5 inches based on what's available
- If you lower the front 2.5 you might want to lower the back again, only an inch or so to get the proportions "right".

Is that a correct summary? First of all, I like the rig. Totally worth getting it sitting right, and how you want it.

I have an 82 GMC C15 LWB with the heavy duty spring pack. The back sits high. I checked it and it has 4 leaves plus the short, fat overload leaf at the bottom. I will let you know the RPO if I can find the SPID. I have it around somewhere but the PO pulled it off and put it in a maintenance envelope. I will also try to get a look and see if I have that "berlin eye" or if the leaf comes straight off the perimeter.

IMO, from looking at the truck, your 2.5/1 additional drop sounds right. Can you show us the shackles you removed? My drop shackles for my 93 have a set of holes for "the whole drop" and a set half way down for a "half" drop. Keep in mind that the shackles only lower one end of the spring so that a 2" drop of the shackle nets a 1" drop at the axle.

[LT7A]

I found "El SPID". My "HEAVY DUTY REAR SPRI" are designated G50. So it sounds as they may be similar or related.

[nickvig]

[/COLOR]

Originally Posted by LT7A

Hey nickvig, I can't follow all of the ups and downs based on the advice so far so I will summarize and let me know if I am wrong.

- You corrected your truck with uncut front springs and non-lowering rear
shackles Correct. And replacement KYB shocks.
- Now the front sits higher (ish) than the back Correct.
Approximately 2" higher in the front.
- The wife doesn't want it any taller She has a tough time
getting in. If it had O.S. bars it would be easier, but I'm not modding for
that. Slightly lower would help her.
- You want to lower the front 2 inches without sacrificing ride quality
Correct. Cut coils or lowering coils are not an option. I'm only going to do spindles if I do anything.
- You can't find 2 inch dropped spindles so you may lower it 2.5 inches based on what's available Correct. No one I've found (Western,
CPP, Belltech, DJM, McGaughey's) makes a 2" spindle.
- If you lower the front 2.5 you might want to lower the back again, only an inch or so to get the proportions "right". Not necessarily.
My concern is that after replacing the shackles the rear leafs are either blown out or modified to be lower. It rides ok but I would have expected it to be higher in the rear after going to stock shackles. If the leafs are blown out or modified I'm thinking I should replace them. If it's going to jack the back up super high after changing them I'd like to know what my options are. Either back to the drop shackles or buying leafs that are not the HD type.

Is that a correct summary? First of all, I like the rig. Totally worth getting it sitting right, and how you want it. Thanks!!

I have an 82 GMC C15 LWB with the heavy duty spring pack. The back sits high. I checked it and it has 4 leaves plus the short, fat overload leaf at the bottom. I will let you know the RPO if I can find the SPID. I have it around somewhere but the PO pulled it off and put it in a maintenance envelope. I will also try to get a look and see if I have that "berlin eye" or if the leaf comes straight off the perimeter.

IMO, from looking at the truck, your 2.5/1 additional drop sounds right. Can you show us the shackles you removed? My drop shackles for my 93 have a set of holes for "the whole drop" and a set half way down for a "half" drop. Keep in mind that the shackles only lower one end of the spring so that a 2" drop of the shackle nets a 1" drop at the axle.

Hey, I appreciate the comments. I've answered your questions above. My expectation after changing the front coils, shocks, and rear shackles was to have a truck that sat like this:

image (1) by nickvig, on Flickr

image (2) by nickvig, on Flickr

image by nickvig, on Flickr

These are all trucks I found for sale at one point that state they have stock suspension. However, I don't know if they have RPO codes for HD rear springs or not.

I double-checked my order from Rock Auto on the front springs. It says specifically PN: 45H0075 is for trucks that do not have brake codes JD3 or JD5. My brake RPO is JB5. So I'm fairly certain I didn't pick 4x4 or 454 springs when I replaced them. If anyone has other information I'm all ears.

The rear shackles I have did have two sets of holes, however when you tried to move the leaf to the lower hole (less drop) it wouldn't clear the wrap of the leaf over the eye. I don't think mine were specifically intended for 1" or 2" drop.

[54Caddy]

ECE 2in front coils will not sacrifice ride quality. There one of the only companies to make coils with correct spring rates.