60 gal compressor garage piping size.

[ChevyRacefan]

Sick of the having to remove hose connectors and blow out rust every year (black iron 1")
Thinking of re doing it in copper.
Should it be 1/2"/ 3/4" or 1" pipe.
hobby shop not a production garage. but do use, blasters, paint guns, da's, and drills,hammers, sanders,etc.
Don't know if the smaller pipe will cause problems.
My gut says, bite the bullet and go with 1" .
What says you?

[Tx Firefighter]

I run a larger 80 gallon compressor and do near production levels of media blasting (cabinet) and I use Rapidair. I've had black iron pipe before and dealt with the issues you speak of. The current Rapidair system I have is my third shop setup and I won't ever go back to anything else.

For me Amazon and TP Tools have had the best prices on it.

[ChevyRacefan]

Originally Posted by Tx Firefighter

I run a larger 80 gallon compressor and do near production levels of media blasting (cabinet) and I use Rapidair. I've had black iron pipe before and dealt with the issues you speak of. The current Rapidair system I have is my third shop setup and I won't ever go back to anything else.

For me Amazon and TP Tools have had the best prices on it.

Interesting.

[67C10Step]

I've got some cheap version of rapidair in my shop to have three hose connection. It has worked well but probably not as good as the rapidair system.

Also, I have dealt with compressed air systems professionally quite a bit in almost 30 years working industrial stuff. I was asking a certified expert once on line size and his response I will never forget. He said, "Nobody has ever complained about an air line being too big, but they always complain about the ones that are too small."

It comes down to economics for the most part. A 1" main system with 1/2" to 3/4" drops should run most hoppy shops.

[ChevyRacefan]

Originally Posted by 67C10Step

I've got some cheap version of rapidair in my shop to have three hose connection. It has worked well but probably not as good as the rapidair system.

Also, I have dealt with compressed air systems professionally quite a bit in almost 30 years working industrial stuff. I was asking a certified expert once on line size and his response I will never forget. He said, "Nobody has ever complained about an air line being too big, but they always complain about the ones that are too small."

It comes down to economics for the most part. A 1" main system with 1/2" to 3/4" drops should run most hoppy shops.

I, after tex fire posted the link, played around with their design page and then the computer builds your set up and list parts and prices. Making the pipe smaller. did not drop the price enough to do that. After removing some of the parts/pieces , I won't need that their system automaticly added.
Like ball valve at compressor, the hose connectors for your air hose. a regulator. and some of the clips to hold the pipe, as the pipe drops will be run in 2" pvc pipe to protect the air line pipe from mayhem.
Once I subtracted that stuff, it wasn't that bad, for a screw it together set up.

I will for giggles price out copper in 1" to see how much of a difference it be.
The rapidair is a lot less labor ,than sweating copper.

I did just pass by the nylon tube system and priced out the flex alum/multi layered.

[Kim57]

I know you guys are not going to like this but I did mine with 1" PVC 20 years ago and have never had a problem.
Inexpensive and easy to do.
Kim

[ChevyRacefan]

Originally Posted by Kim57

I know you guys are not going to like this but I did mine with 1" PVC 20 years ago and have never had a problem.
Inexpensive and easy to do.
Kim

I have seen what pvc can do when it lets go. I like my life.

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by ChevyRacefan

My gut says, bite the bullet and go with 1" .
What says you?

Air consumption by the air tools, as well as length of line are probably the determining factor, not tank size. I would say 3/4" is more than enough for a shop, unless 2-3 guys are using DA sanders at the same time! Keep in mind that your air hose is only 1/2" or maybe 3/4" right?

I have a 1/2" Rapid Air kit, which they say is good for a 100 ft run. Best price I found on the kit was at Northern Tool, but Amazon had better prices for accessories.

[roll_the_dice]

I have an 80 gallon 7.5 HP compressor and when I set up my home shop (after we move later this year), I am going to do 3/4" rapidair system. I debated between 1/2", 3/4" and 1" and for what I am going to do 3/4" should be plenty.

[LONGHAIR]

Originally Posted by Kim57

I know you guys are not going to like this but I did mine with 1" PVC 20 years ago and have never had a problem.
Inexpensive and easy to do.
Kim

We had PVC in a shop where I worked many years ago. As many guys have said, it worked just fine for years.....until, that one time.
Someone banged into one of the lines and it exploded. There were shattered pieces thrown quite a distance. Luckily, no one was injured. It was replaced with iron pipe, but we weren't in the building very long after that.
The next building had iron in it too. We had a fairly sophisticated system with a drier and never had any issues with condensation, but modifying it to move or add drops was a pain.
The new shop has Rapidair aluminum tubing and it is fantastic. It is very easy to modify, which is always a thing in a new space.

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by LONGHAIR

The new shop has Rapidair aluminum tubing and it is fantastic. It is very easy to modify, which is always a thing in a new space.

Yes, I am very impressed with the 3/4" Rapid Air system that a buddy of mine has. He does have a tool to straighten the coiled aluminum line, which I think is essential to doing a good job.

[ChevyRacefan]

Originally Posted by MikeB

Yes, I am very impressed with the 3/4" Rapid Air system a buddy of mine has. He does have a tool to straighten the coiled aluminum line, which I think is essential to doing a good job.

Yes, the tool will make unrolling the pipe much easier.
I figure , buy it, use it, then ebay it. for 40.00 less than what it was new. and it only be a 40.00 tool rental.

[ChevyRacefan]

Originally Posted by LONGHAIR

We had PVC in a shop where I worked many years ago. As many guys have said, it worked just fine for years.....until, that one time.
Someone banged into one of the lines and it exploded. There were shattered pieces thrown quite a distance. Luckily, no one was injured. It was replaced with iron pipe, but we weren't in the building very long after that.
The next building had iron in it too. We had a fairly sophisticated system with a drier and never had any issues with condensation, but modifying it to move or add drops was a pain.
The new shop has Rapidair aluminum tubing and it is fantastic. It is very easy to modify, which is always a thing in a new space.

I think my problem with the black iron is, moisture and time between use.
It can go months, When you take the hose adapters off the pipe end and fire up the compressor, and get rust flakes out the pipe, ya. time to trash the iron pipe and redo it all. It lasted 20 years. It owes me nothing.

[LONGHAIR]

Originally Posted by ChevyRacefan

I think my problem with the black iron is, moisture and time between use.
It can go months, When you take the hose adapters off the pipe end and fire up the compressor, and get rust flakes out the pipe, ya. time to trash the iron pipe and redo it all. It lasted 20 years. It owes me nothing.

Yeah, that can happen, but there are things you can do to help. First of all is having the air line connections for your hoses above the actual end of the pipe.
Meaning that wherever you have a "drop", put a "T" fitting in it where your quick disconnect comes out and add a short section of pipe continuing down with a cap (or better yet a petcock drain).
This way any flakes or other junk in the lines drops below the fitting where the air is going out. This also allows you to drain any condensation in the lines themselves, rather than just at the tank.
Other things kind of depend upon how much/often you actually use the system. If it's not often enough, it might not be worth the time/trouble.

[Getter-Done]

I had a lot of water issues with my first set-up.
If I can even call it a setup

I run mine like TP tools suggests in the PDF below.

I don't have the moisture issues I had before.

I also put moisture filter from HF on my sandblast cabinet link below.

PDF Link: https://cached.tptools.com/Images/ai...ng-diagram.pdf

HF moisture filter link: https://www.harborfreight.com/indust...nit-68247.html









.

[franken]

I have 3/4" black pipe but built it so water has to drain back into the tank, or blow through the outlet end via traps and filters. No place place for water to collect makes for little rust. It also makes it easy to purge water.
The systems w/ vertical long runs and short horizontal and many valves make no sense to me. I might be full of crap, no doubt. I'm also speaking of a 2 car garage in suburbia, not a big shop. That said, I have a light commercial grade (Saylor-Beall) 80 gal compressor.
I drain water from the tank by purging (not draining) when I think about it so generally I start w/ cool air.

Let's not get started on the PVC suicide pipe. That's nuts. Leave a piece of PVC outside for a few months, then drop it on the ground. Shattered.

[franken]

Originally Posted by Getter-Done

I had a lot of water issues with my first set-up.
If I can even call it a setup

I run mine like TP tools suggests in the PDF below.

I don't have the moisture issues I had before.

I also put moisture filter from HF on my sandblast cabinet link below.

PDF Link: https://cached.tptools.com/Images/ai...ng-diagram.pdf

HF moisture filter link: https://www.harborfreight.com/indust...nit-68247.html
.

The trouble with that setup is you have 10 valves to open to purge water and can never forget. Or, paint the wall black in the area.
Of course, as I said, I'm just one fool in a 2 car garage so a more conservative flow through plan is ok. For several workers, that system makes sense.

To the OP, I should have asked more about the layout you have currently. Maybe it can be arranged to not pool water and create rust.

[ChevyRacefan]

Originally Posted by franken

I have 3/4" black pipe but built it so water has to drain back into the tank, or blow through the outlet end via traps and filters. No place place for water to collect makes for little rust. It also makes it easy to purge water.
The systems w/ vertical long runs and short horizontal and many valves make no sense to me. I might be full of crap, no doubt. I'm also speaking of a 2 car garage in suburbia, not a big shop. That said, I have a light commercial grade (Saylor-Beall) 80 gal compressor.
I drain water from the tank by purging (not draining) when I think about it so generally I start w/ cool air.

Let's not get started on the PVC suicide pipe. That's nuts. Leave a piece of PVC outside for a few months, then drop it on the ground. Shattered.

My problem started when I had to move the compressor for the deck the wife wanted, So the compressor "shed" went to the other side of the garage, and connects to what was the pipe farthest point, Running a compressor when it is cold out, and is heating the air puts moister in the lines. That and the long sit times between use at times, And the planned slopes being well, not really done all that well, 20+ year ago when installed. it needs to go.

I like to have few drops/connectors, than most for the size of my garage.
1) on the side ( outside) in a electric outlet waterproof box, for blasting.
1) beside the garage door, for working in driveway without having to have the door open.
1) That is only for paint work with shut off valve and own filters/driers.
1) in back end of garage,
1) on house side of garage half way down the side, this one has a feed that goes into the basement so I can use woodworking air tools or drill/grinders for head work, or whatever else.
Each one has 2 hose connections. So the paint only teed off connection, before it has a hose reel for normal use. The side connection has a 2nd on the inside for blasting cab. The one at the back has one going to back yard for blowing out water lines. and the one on the house side feeds the basement and folding work bench area and the one near the garage door, splits and one connector is outside in a outlet box for driveway, and the inside is so I don't have to have a hose draped along side the vehicle and make using a creeper a pain.
Sure the extra drops are not required, or "needed" but I found it is much easier this way. And with the compressor in it's own shed, keeps the garage noise down. and not having hose draped along the floor while under the vehicle is golden. The extra few hundred to add a the drops, is worth it, to make using the garage better, With a vehicle in it, there is only 2' per side to get around them, having to drape air hose around makes it a royal pain.
I don't see me building a bigger garage or shop anytime soon, so . making what I do have As good as I can as far as ease of use is worth it to me, to spend a few extra hundred.

[LONGHAIR]

Originally Posted by Getter-Done

I had a lot of water issues with my first set-up.
If I can even call it a setup

I run mine like TP tools suggests in the PDF below.

I don't have the moisture issues I had before.

I also put moisture filter from HF on my sandblast cabinet link below.

PDF Link: https://cached.tptools.com/Images/ai...ng-diagram.pdf

The extensions containing the ball valves is just what i was referring too. That's a pretty good illustration of a smaller shop set-up, except for one thing, which I am surprised a commercial designer left out. That is a "loop back" to the tank with the main line. When you have a "dead end" set-up like this, everything is fine when you are one guy in the shop. Add one more user and you will have a problem.
Using that diagram as an example. You are blasting in the cabinet at the end of the run. Now someone else starts up a sander, blows the dust off of something or even fills up a tire....you have a pressure drop. This happens because they cut you off. In a loop system, this doesn't happen because the air flows toward the place that it is being used from both directions. That way, you are never cut off.
The building where I work is 60k square feet, 50k of that is wide open shop space. It is plumbed for air virtually everywhere. There is a huge loop going around the outside, dropping down the walls where needed and at all of the columns that support the roof. These rows are connected to the loop at both ends, furthering the loops. This also means that these smaller loops can be isolated. That way any of these sections can be modified or repaired without draining the entire system. There are even more drops at specific places for the machines that need it. There can be upwards of 25 guys using air at any given moment, including a spray booth. Some of these machines are pressure and volume sensitive, so they will go into an alarm or just shut down. The design of the main layout was very important from the very beginning of the building planning phase.
This is waay overkill for a regular guy in a home shop, but the point of the loop remains. It will stop pressure drops from simultaneous users, at least as long as your compressor can keep up.

[MikeB]

I've moved since this picture, but here's my "basic two-car garage guy" setup in my last house.

In my new garage, I plan to have longer runs to allow air to cool better and condense so it will give up more moisture in the filters.

Left drop goes to a manifold with a drain valve, then to compressor. Center drop goes through a moisture filter to air hose reel. Right drop goes to 3-stage filter for paint gun.

All blue line fittings are 3/8 NPT. The line is 1/2".

[ChevyRacefan]

Originally Posted by franken

To the OP, I should have asked more about the layout you have currently. Maybe it can be arranged to not pool water and create rust.

The problem with the way it is now. Is I bought house, and car was coming that week, So I needed the pipe, in and up. Along with moving everything I owned.
Silly me thought I could do it in a week end and not take a weeks vacation to move.
So pipe slopes and such was not even a thought, it was get it in before the car gets rolled in, and I have to try to work around it.
That was 20+ years ago. Black iron pipe is not going back in, The rusty water out the tools are doing them no favors either.
This time I have to work around a vehicle to install it, but time isn't an issue so slopes and such can be done right. But I plan on this being the last time, I have no interest in doing it again in 15-20 years.

[racecougar]

I went with the RapidAir M7500 kit a little over a year ago, and I've been quite happy with it. I'd certainly recommend it over using black iron, PVC, copper, etc.

I still need to continue the run on the right side of the screen over to my lift, and there's plenty of tubing leftover to do so, I just haven't got around to it yet.

[_Ogre]

i've had copper in my shop for 20 years without a hitch
never more than 1 guy in my shop using air, my whole shop is 1/2"

if your compressor is outside in a separate shed, you should read the compressor timer link in my sig
my compressor is in the same building, but out of sight, under the enclosed stairs
timer/solenoid works great, instant air when the timer is on

[MikeB]

Originally Posted by racecougar

I went with the RapidAir M7500 kit a little over a year ago, and I've been quite happy with it.

Very nice shop!

[racecougar]

Originally Posted by MikeB

Very nice shop!

Thanks. Those pics are old; more equipment and wall hangers in there now.