Manual to power steering conversion?

[berghandler]

My grandson and I are trying to convert his 1972 C10 2WD from manual steering to power steering. Starting with the gearbox we have found a used 1984 and a used 1986 GM power steering gearboxs and have seen youtube videos about getting adaptor plates for mid 60's C10's to make these fit on older C10's but have seen nothing for adapting them to his 1972. These 80's gearboxes look identical and I believe will work if mounting is done correctly to make sure alignment is correct to steering column shaft and rag joint but would like to know for sure if we can use either and what to do to make then fit and work. Have heard of Captain Fab as a reference for adaptor plates but have not followed up yet with that.

Thanks

[MARKDTN]

Pretty sure on a 2WD '72 you can use any 73-87 C10 box as a bolt-on with no adapters. I did a conversion for a guy on a '71 and ended up having to have the lower steering shaft from the donor truck. Now the hoses may be different with metric ends on the later boxes, but the box itself should bolt on.

[berghandler]

What was the reason for having to use the lower steering shaft from the donor truck? Rag joint and flange maybe different??

Thanks

[LockDoc]

-
Here are a couple of threads on the subject.

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=216886

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=567609

LockDoc

[kwmech]

Any box up to 86 will bolt on sans any adapters. Only difference will be the metric fitting for the high pressure hose. So if you can get matching pump and box you will be good to go. They went metric in 80-81 i think. Only 'adapters' you will need will be the brackets for the pump and a ps pulley

[geezer#99]

Some identification info here of gear boxes.
You need to check rag joint shaft type too.



https://leepowersteering.com/pages/h...entify-gearbox

[Davidf]

I highly recommend you purchase a new Borgeson steering box. It should bolt right in. You will also need a later model (1977+) square body rag joint (steering coupler).

I recently installed a Borgeson unit and it is a significant improvement over the slow Saginaw GM box (not sloppy) that was in my truck,

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by berghandler

What was the reason for having to use the lower steering shaft from the donor truck? Rag joint and flange maybe different??

Thanks

It was around 2004 so my mind is fuzzy. Seems like it had to match the rag joint.

[RustyPile]

Originally Posted by berghandler

My grandson and I are trying to convert his 1972 C10 2WD from manual steering to power steering. Starting with the gearbox we have found a used 1984 and a used 1986 GM power steering gearboxs and have seen youtube videos about getting adaptor plates for mid 60's C10's to make these fit on older C10's but have seen nothing for adapting them to his 1972. These 80's gearboxes look identical and I believe will work if mounting is done correctly to make sure alignment is correct to steering column shaft and rag joint but would like to know for sure if we can use either and what to do to make then fit and work. Have heard of Captain Fab as a reference for adaptor plates but have not followed up yet with that.

Thanks

I have a 1971 C/10 with a BBC engine.. About a 1 1/2 years ago, I replaced the "armstrong" manual steering with power steering. My best advice to you is stay away from junk yard steering pieces.. Lots of looseness, poor fits, leaks, and other problems will haunt you.. Every piece I needed was quickly obtained from a local "Mom & Pop" parts store. Reliable Auto Supply in Elkhart, Tx to be exact..

I purchased a reman gear box brand Cardone, part #27-7512.. A reman pump brand BBB Industries, part number 732-2164.. The manual pitman arm and idler arm won't work with P/S.. Moog pitman arm part # is K6131.. Moog idler arm part # is K6096T.. My truck has a BBC engine so hose part numbers won't fit a small block, but all hoses are readily available. I fabricated the return hose using 3/8" double flare tubing, bulk P/S return hose and clamped with FI fuel line clamps. GM P/S pumps use 2 types (not counting groove count) pullies. One is a press fit and friction holds it in place. You'll need a special tool to install and remove it.. The other type is a slip fit and the pulley is a keyed fit and is held in place by a bolt screwed into the end of the shaft.. No adaptors or modifications are needed for installing the above listed parts. Everything just bolts right up.

You'll need to turn in cores for the pump and gear or pay over $130.00 core charges.. I bought dirty rusty junk parts from a salvage yard for 10 bux for both. The reman gear cost me $149.00, and the pump W/reservoir was $50.00.. Total cost, including hoses, junk yard P/S brackets, and pulley was around $350.00.. On most internet places you'll pay that much or more for just the gear box. Shipping costs from internet suppliers can add up fast as all these parts are HEAVY. As I said, all parts were purchased locally so no waiting for parts to arrive and no shipping charges either. I've had zero problems with the installation.

[custom10nut]

I agree Rusty Pile. Go with at least Remanufactured parts, as the money you think you’re saving upfront with Salvage Yard parts are going to get replaced because of leaks anyway.
I also went to the Yard and bought the parts for codes, and did the same when I put the Power Brakes on.
Put the parts on that are meant for the truck, and you don’t have the headaches of “making them fit”.
To me, Steering and Braking are too important to fall into the “we can make it fit” category

[berghandler]

Thanks RustyPile. Sounds like you have laid it all out for us including part numbers and such. Grandson has limited funds to buy new expensive parts but reman looks like the way to go. Much appreciated.

[sick472]

Good timing on the thread as I am collecting parts to convert my 72 to power steering.

Rusty Pile - Thank You for laying that out so nicely! Looks like I need to get the idler arm.

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by RustyPile

The manual pitman arm and idler arm won't work with P/S.. Moog pitman arm part # is K6131.. Moog idler arm part # is K6096T..

Is the need to replace the idler arm a 71-72 specific thing? I upgraded a '67 to power steering 25 years ago (it had the dent in the frame, fortunately), and I didn't have to replace the idler arm. Of course most idler arms on these trucks could probably benefit from being replaced due to wear. I replaced it on my current truck recently, and I don't remember seeing manual vs. ps versions of the idler arm listed.

[kwmech]

Not mandatory to replace the idler arm unless worn out. Has nothing to do with manual or power steer. All it does is hold up the center link on the right hand side

[RustyPile]

I know the people at Reliable. They don't "pad" the parts list.. In fact, according to my research prior to buying the parts, indicated that the clocking on the splines and the length of the pitman arm is different between power and manual. Comparing the two indicated this to be correct.. There wasn't a great deal of difference, but enough to cause the steering wheel to be off center when the wheels were pointed straight ahead.. According to Moog, there are two idler arms listed.. One for power steering and another for manual..

When I finished the job, I took the truck in for an alignment.. All the steering components were tight and all that was needed was a small adjustment to the toe.. At that time, I'd owned the truck only a couple years and hadn't had an alignment done.. When I bought the truck, it had been setting up for a number of years because of serious engine problems.. For all I know, the toe could have been out of adjustment from the beginning..

Take my information for what it's worth to you as YMMV..

[pjmoreland]

Originally Posted by RustyPile

According to Moog, there are two idler arms listed.. One for power steering and another for manual..

You've got me wondering if I've got the wrong idler arm on my truck. The only idler arm part number I can find on the Moog website for 67-72 C/10 and C/20 trucks is K6096T, and that's what I've got. Do you know what part number you installed?

[RustyPile]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

Is the need to replace the idler arm a 71-72 specific thing? I upgraded a '67 to power steering 25 years ago (it had the dent in the frame, fortunately), and I didn't have to replace the idler arm. Of course most idler arms on these trucks could probably benefit from being replaced due to wear. I replaced it on my current truck recently, and I don't remember seeing manual vs. ps versions of the idler arm listed.

I can't comment as to the year model coverage of that part. I just gave them the information covering my '71.. I do know this.. I know the notch or dent is a hit-or-miss thing on some of these trucks. If the attempt is made to install one of these power steering boxes on a "non notched" frame, the box won't fit properly without that notch.. If spacers are used to move the box away from the frame, the steering geometry will be off center.. Changing the length of the tie rods in order to re-center the steering causes even more problems..

[RustyPile]

Originally Posted by pjmoreland

You've got me wondering if I've got the wrong idler arm on my truck. The only idler arm part number I can find on the Moog website for 67-72 C/10 and C/20 trucks is K6096T, and that's what I've got. Do you know what part number you installed?

Same part # K6096T, but who knows??? It's been almost 2 years since I did the job.. I keep all the invoices on my truck. I pulled those numbers from one of those invoices. Maybe Moog has changed their inventory and re-assigned or combined part numbers.. That sort of thing happens all the time..

What sticks out in my mind from the job is the hoses.. BBCs use a remote mounted P/S reservoir and I didn't want that.. We had to look at several pumps before we found one with the proper oriented return fitting. The return hose was almost $50.00 ($40 something) so I fabricated one using some 3/8" brake line and "bulk" return hose.. Cost me about 5 bux.. We had to go through a number of hoses before we found one that would fit.. I had to trim the inner fender panel for clearance around the hose fittings on the gear box..