Steering shaft and power sterring box alignment off

[DoubleL]

Just installed a 1978 c10 power steering box and used Capt Fabs bracket the column is all stock in my 65 c20 but they don't align at my rag joint. Any ideas?

[AcampoDave]

My advice is to call Borgeson. They have the expertise to help you get it done. I personally just used them to purchase a telescopic intermediate shaft with a universal joint at the column end, and a vibration reducing universal at the steering gear box. Cost me a couple of bills but totally worth it. One u-joint can compensate for a change of angle, but to compensate for an offset between column and box, (even a minor one) 2 u- joints make it smooth as butter. If you have power steering with an adapter plate on the frame chances are good you will have some degree of offset due to the thickness of the plate. A rag joint may take it up for a while but over time it will wear out prematurely. Flaming River also sells steering shafts and U-joints and they have some decent videos on youtube.

Edit: I actually posted this response a ways back to somebody else with the same dilemma because it was once my dilemma too.

[cag]

Originally Posted by AcampoDave

My advice is to call Borgeson. They have the expertise to help you get it done. I personally just used them to purchase a telescopic intermediate shaft with a universal joint at the column end, and a vibration reducing universal at the steering gear box. Cost me a couple of bills but totally worth it. One u-joint can compensate for a change of angle, but to compensate for an offset between column and box, (even a minor one) 2 u- joints make it smooth as butter. If you have power steering with an adapter plate on the frame chances are good you will have some degree of offset due to the thickness of the plate. A rag joint may take it up for a while but over time it will wear out prematurely. Flaming River also sells steering shafts and U-joints and they have some decent videos on youtube.

Edit: I actually posted this response a ways back to somebody else with the same dilemma because it was once my dilemma too.

do you have pics of this installed???

[DPowers]

Have you contacted Captain Fab for his input? Mine on my 66 lined up perfectly.

[1964FarmFreshC10]

if i remember correctly a few people i have spoken to about this job had this issue and had to loosen up the column mounting bolts at the firewall and dash.

[AcampoDave]

Originally Posted by cag

do you have pics of this installed???

Sorry no, I sold that truck, but I remember I gutted the steering rod and lower bearing from an old 67-72 column so as to ditch the one piece OEM widowmaker rod in mine. Doing that gave me the splined stub at the butt of the column for the first universal, then came the telescopic intermediate shaft with a vibration reducing U joint at the box.

[1964FarmFreshC10]

Borgeson does have weld on universals that can be installed on the 65 3/4 shaft.

[DoubleL]

I really appreciate the input! I think first I'm going to loosen everything up and see if there is any adjustment there. Then I'll be calling Borgeson and maybe checking in with the captain. I also will replace the rag joint. I was going to reuse it but probably best to change it. I pulled this into the garage 2 years ago to add power brakes, then I decided to go disk in the front, then decided might as well completely rebuild the front end and A-arms, might as well add power steering! Then might as well replace all the brake lines, then fix my turn signal and horn that were all jury rigged, of course that made me take a look at the wiring, Yikes! so front to back complete rewire, collapsed foam in the seat, better replace that. 4 barrel carb mounted with 4 different kinds of screws, heck I'm going back to the old 2 -barrel, better rebuild it first, etc,etc,etc

[AcampoDave]

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=668946 in this thread there is a pic and you can see he has an offset too. It's post #19.
BTW: it sounds like your doing your truck the right way, especially with regard to making it safe. Congrats

[racecougar]

Could move to a collapsible shaft for further safety improvement.

[cag]

1962, anyone know what the shaft on the steering column is? is it flat with rounded sides? what diameter?

also 1972 steering gear, what size is the splined shaft the rag joint bolts to??

[AcampoDave]

All the best info I found is in the link I posted on this thread in post #9.

[Chaparralman1974]

I am in the middle of a power steering upgrade on my '67 K20. I used Captain Fab's plate to mount a Borgeson quick ratio box on the frame. I have the same problem with misalignment that you do. In my case it is a good 1/2" or so off. I can't move my column over enough to make it work.

I ordered a Borgeson DD / 30 spline ujoint for the box side and a DD / DD 3/4" ujoint for the opposing side and also picked up a 24" length of DD 3/4" shaft. As my truck doesn't have a splined upper end to the shaft, I plan on cutting it and adding in the new shaft and ujoints to handle the misalignment.


Clay

[Chaparralman1974]

Here is the piece of my steering column that I cut out. I just cut 2" down from the preload spring on the shaft.

[Chaparralman1974]

And here is what the replacement DD shaft and the Ujoints look like mocked up.

[DoubleL]

Chaparralman1974 = Decided to go with a new shaft with u-joints on both ends. I was trying to figure out why I couldn't find a split on my spline this helps a ton. I'll just cut it off. I already have the lower bearing most of the way out and it is toasted. I'll replace that while I'm there. The only problem I see is the welding part. I was hoping not to have to pull the whole column and don't have a welder. Also, how do you work around the "nipple" on the steering box gear? (In pics) Thanks for sll your input!

[Chaparralman1974]

I am not sure about the nipple....I have never seen that on a steering box before. I would probably just cut it off with a cutoff wheel. That nipple would not work with the u-joints.

The 67's share a lot of similarities with the previous run of trucks. I believe that my steering column was almost identical to yours. I pulled my entire column and rebuilt the entire thing by myself. It wasn't that hard. Fortunately, my bearings were not bad....I just cleaned them up in mineral spirits, regreased and painted everything and reinstalled it. I would think that if you cut the shaft first, it would be even easier to pull the column. In either case, it isn't that difficult to pull it out once you remove the steering wheel.

As to the welding, I watched a video from borgeson where they recommend NOT welding the joints, although I don't know why unless it pertains to heating the u-joint itself and causing issues. My u-joints came with set screws in them. I will be "dimpling" the shafts about 1/16" or so with a drill bit where the set screws go so they bite into the shaft. I will also be using red loctite on they set screws so they don't come out. I personally prefer this route to welding so that I can take it apart if I ever need to. I don't see any reason to weld anything on the shaft. The only part that I won't dimple is the splined end on the steering gear itself. I will apply red loctite to that set screw, but that shaft is hardened, so there is no reason to run a drill bit on it and possibly mar up the splines.

EDIT
Regarding shaft welding, I probably would weld a round shaft....but not a DD shaft. You could drill a round shaft and go with a roll pin or even a bolt all the way through and use a lock nut or thread locker.




Clay

[Chaparralman1974]

Oh, one more thing....if you do go the U-joint route I highly recommend the Borgeson stuff. Yes, they are a bit pricey ($90 each at summit) but the quality is excellent. I don't like to skimp on steering and brakes. You can get the joints cheaper on Amazon, but I wouldn't trust them personally.


Clay

[DoubleL]

I have not been able to find a 3/4 dd to 3/4 round with a set screw for the round part. That's why I am thinking I would have to weld. I would rather not because I already rebuilt the top of my column and really would rather not take it apart again. I have plenty of room to do everything under the hood but would need to get a mobile welder out here for the round shaft. Borgeson is expensive but you are right on the safety factor. They even look way more solid.

[Chaparralman1974]

Originally Posted by DoubleL

I have not been able to find a 3/4 dd to 3/4 round with a set screw for the round part. That's why I am thinking I would have to weld. I would rather not because I already rebuilt the top of my column and really would rather not take it apart again. I have plenty of room to do everything under the hood but would need to get a mobile welder out here for the round shaft. Borgeson is expensive but you are right on the safety factor. They even look way more solid.

You could probably take the u-joints down to a machine shop and have them put into a mill so that they could do holes straight through the center. Then you could just put a 1/4-20 grade 8 bolt in there. I should think that would be adequate to hold it. All it has to do is to keep it from coming loose. It isn't a structural hold if that makes sense.


Clay

[AcampoDave]

Maybe you can get your hands on a junk column from a 67-72 and put that rod in yours. That way the stub sticking out the bearing would be splined.

[DoubleL]

I'm getting close! I removed the bearing and it is a "can" with the bearing attached. It is one piece. All I see when I search for a bearing is the bearing part only. I was told the 69-72 bearing is what I need. It looks similar to what i took out bit it is two separate components. The can and bearing. Mine is a one piece. Any ideas? I took the clip off and was able to remove the ball bearings and internals of the bearing which were toast but it does not separate from the can. Thank you for your help!

[DoubleL]

I got my answers! Thanks everyone for your help.

[AcampoDave]

Post a pic when you get it all buttoned up.