New engine, won't run!

[brothers69c-10]

I finally got around to installing the big block in my 78, but can't get the darn thing to run. It is a completely rebuilt 427 tall deck motor. I have checked the distributor 5 times to make sure it is on top dead center of the compression stroke. Put in different plugs, new fuel pump, different plug wires, different cap and coil which i know is good. Adjusted the distributor every which way, Tried setting a tooth off in either direction. Cam was installed properly. Double checked valve clearances. I am out of ideas. It turns over fine and it will pop and sputter, no backfiring, but it will not run. I am out of ideas.

It's getting spark compression, and gas, and i am darn sure its in time. I have had a darn good mecahinc of 30+ years helping me and he can't figure it out either.

Any advice would be appreciated.

[old Rusty C10]

doouble check the distributor yet again... in fact pull it out and reset it.. I did this with my motor on the V6 i had and i had it out so it wasnt firing right..the stupid diagram in the Haynes manual was off so i had it firing on the wrong cylinder i know it sounds stupid but this is an error i made.... i had gone as far as to even think the fuel wasnt right and was going to put in a new fuel pump

[Restrorob]

Since you state you installed a different cap AND coil, Is it safe to assume this distributor is of the older style HEI ?

If so, There could be a problem with module or even the condenser. These older style pick-up's are known for breaking the lead wires up close to the pick-up housing from the vacuum advance moving the plate back and forth, The insulation may look good but the inner wire will be broken.

I mention the distributor components because it looks like you have most everything else covered, It's possible you have spark at cranking speed but loose it when it trys to start up (spins faster).

Just my

Good Luck

[1984 swb chevy]

If it is a tall deck block do you have a tall deck distributor? I dont even know if there is such a thing.

[Patriot]

Pick up coil? Are you it has spark?

[britnjc]

what about gas. are you using high octane. My friends big block would not fire on anything lower than 105 octane. Just another thought

[brothers69c-10]

The distributor itself is only about two years old, and the whole distributor setup that is on it now is the same one from the small block i pulled out of the truck and it ran fine. it is possible something could have happened when changing things over though. I know it has spark as we have checked it to make sure. The distributor has been pulled out and reset just about every time. Gas could be a problem as its just 87 octane, but have never had that problem before.

I won't be able to work on it again until sunday, but will check the distributor just in case for anything broke internally and maybe for kicks and giggles i will just drop the distributor in some random place and see if it will start.

[Big Port Jimmy 6]

Originally Posted by brothers69c-10

The distributor itself is only about two years old, and the whole distributor setup that is on it now is the same one from the small block i pulled out of the truck and it ran fine.

Tall deck blocks require a tall deck distributor or machine work on the intake to allow the short deck dizzy to engage. All small blocks are short deck. Not all 427s are tall deck. Hope this helps Jay

[brothers69c-10]

I used the stock tall deck intake which allows for the use of a regular distributor. I mean it drops in all the way, connects to the cam fine, and engages the oil pump.

[Rodms]

Is it a new engine or reworked engine some times the timing chain,gear could be aligned wrong ,just a thought but will cause the same problems.

[Big Port Jimmy 6]

Originally Posted by brothers69c-10

I used the stock tall deck intake which allows for the use of a regular distributor. I mean it drops in all the way, connects to the cam fine, and engages the oil pump.

Cool, I have seen the deck height gremlin fool more than one before. Jay

[1971gmcshortbed]

I would put a compression gauge in a few holes and check em, hth.

[68 TT]

Squirt a little oil into each cylinder and crank it over with the ignition disconnected to spread it around then reconnect the ignition. Sometimes new engines don't like to fire on dry cylinder walls. The rings aren't seated yet and leak down too much on the dry fit to build enough compression to fire the mixture.

The 400 in my Malibu was that way. I didn't believe it was the problem and pulled most of my hair out trying to get it to run until my 82 year old neighbor suggested the oil in the cylinder trick. It fired right up.

[Damien]

Water in the fuel? Had that once, finally pulled the fuel line off the carb and what spilled out beaded up on the intake. I was pulling my hair out too.

[brothers69c-10]

Thought about the timing gears being off. Going to pull the valve cover off and watch the valves when the piston is coming up to check that and see where the distributor is. I don't think there is water in the gas as i stopped and put gas in the truck right before i changed the motors and its only been sitting 3 weeks. I might try the oil in the cylinder trick. We did put a bunch of superlube down the cylinders before we put the motor in the truck and turned it over by hand to make sure it still turned since its been sitting a while.

[68 TT]

Originally Posted by brothers69c-10

Thought about the timing gears being off. Going to pull the valve cover off and watch the valves when the piston is coming up to check that and see where the distributor is. I don't think there is water in the gas as i stopped and put gas in the truck right before i changed the motors and its only been sitting 3 weeks. I might try the oil in the cylinder trick. We did put a bunch of superlube down the cylinders before we put the motor in the truck and turned it over by hand to make sure it still turned since its been sitting a while.

That superlube might have been too thin to oil up the rings. A little motor oil won't hurt anything. It will just smoke a bit until it burns off.

It's possible the timing set got put in with the dots incorrectly oriented. Some engines set the dots both facing up and some point the dots together in the middle. Maybe the mechanic who put it together used the wrong method. Only way to tell it to pull the timing cover off. Chevy V-8's put the dots together in the middle.

[LONGHAIR]

Originally Posted by 68 TT

Some engines set the dots both facing up and some point the dots together in the middle. Maybe the mechanic who put it together used the wrong method. Only way to tell it to pull the timing cover off. Chevy V-8's put the dots together in the middle.

I'm not saying that there isn't a valve timing issue here, but the above statement is completely un-true.
The crank gear is exactly half the size of the cam gear, so the "dots" will not always meet in the middle when the crank's "dot" is up. If you start out with the "dots" in the middle and turn the crank exactly one revolution....the cam's "dot" will not be at the bottom anymore, it will be at the top.
This BTW is TDC of the compression stroke for the #1 cylinder

[Damien]

The timing marks on a chevy small block V8 neet to be together when installing a timing set. It has been a few years since I have replaced a timing set and was a little unsure after reading the last two posts, so according to my 1974 Chevrolet Light Duty Truck Servive Manunal Section 6 page 58 "Hold the sprocket vertically with the chain hanging down and align marks on camshaft and crankshaft sprockets."

[68 TT]

Originally Posted by Damien

Longhair, You are wrong. The timing marks on a chevy small block V8 neet to be together when installing a timing set. It has been a few years since I have replaced a timing set and was a little unsure after reading the last two posts, so according to my 1974 Chevrolet Light Duty Truck Servive Manunal Section 6 page 58 "Hold the sprocket vertically with the chain hanging down and align marks on camshaft and crankshaft sprockets."

No, he is right, it won't matter where the dots are as long as they are both up or both together in the middle. Since the crank spins twice as fast as the cam it will work either way. Now if they were off a tooth or two it could make a big difference.

Forgive my slow thinking. I've been working 20 hour days for the past week so my brain is a little slow right now. I can sleep in February when this project is done.

[Alex1]

Distributor is 180 degrees out.

[68 TT]

Originally Posted by Alex1

Distributor is 180 degrees out.

Duh. Why didn't I think of that. It is the easiest thing to do wrong.

[Damien]

That is what I was thinking after you said the location of the timing marks didn't matter. If the cam sprocket was installed with the the dot at the 12 o'clock position the distributor would be off 180* making the number one terminal on the back dist cap. Talk about confusing.

[Restrorob]

Originally Posted by Damien

Talk about confusing.

Well, Let's add to it. The distrubutor can be installed in any position you want, As long as you put #1 plug wire in the proper position on the cap (where the rotor points) while #1 piston is at TDC compression stroke.

[Pyrotechnic]

How are you checking TDC ? The way I do it have one person put place their finger firmly over the #1 spark plug hole so it seals, then have someone spin the engine over by hand. When you feel pressure build up against your finger, watch the timing mark and stop when it gets to TDC. The finger is necessary because the timing mark on the balancer will show #1 OR #6 at TDC firing, because it takes two full revolutions of the crank to fire all 8 cylinders. The pressure against your finger means there's compression building in the #1 cylinder and when the timing mark gets to TDC, the motor is on #1 TDC firing for sure.

After that, check the rotor position and see if it's point to terminal on the cap that your #1 plug wire is connected to. I assume you have the wires connected in the firing order clockwise around the cap ?

Tighten the distributor down to where it's snug, but still can be moved by hand. Have one person crank the engine over, and one person slowly moving the distributor a small amount in either direction till it fires.

Don't know if you've already done all this but that's all I've got.

[brothers69c-10]

Everything you all have said about the distributor i have tried. I cput the distributor right on and 180 off, moved it a tooth either way from those positions and nothing. I check tdc just like you all have posted. But now on to something new.....

I've been thinking about the dry cylinder deal with puting oil in the cylinders. I had forgot that when i was checking the starter out i sprayed a ton of wd 40 down the spark plug holes. I would almost bet since wd 40 does evaporate quickly especially with the plugs in the motor, that when gas hits the plugs its more or less flooding the engine. So i am thinking that if i pour some regular motor oil down the holes and crank that thing over alot and clean the cylinders out, that it may run. What do you guys think?